What are the visible differences between Shannon and Golden?

[The Franchise]

Golden's roster management is much better than Randy's. I think we had one returning CB in McGee when Golden took over.

You mean the roster management that's seen him lose 27 of 77 signees through his first 3 years?

 

[CANE4LIFE]

Golden's roster management is much better than Randy's. I think we had one returning CB in McGee when Golden took over.

Roster management has been better, and recruiting for needs. We don't have MASSIVE holes on the roster the way we did under both Shannon and Coker. LB depth has had some issues because of horrible luck, first the EJ and Terry fiascos, and a year later the Figs and Blue debacle. DT recruiting has also been very lack luster under AG. But its at least been balanced as far as the numbers go.

I would also say sideline management and game management has been SOMEWHAT better. Im not talking about gameplans, but we aren't USUALLY wasting 3 time outs within the first 4 minutes of the 1st quarter, the last few games with Kaaya notwithstanding. There has certainly been a regression so far this year though, with stupid penalties, mistakes, wasted time outs, etc.. but I chalk a lot of that up to having a true Frosh in there.

In the end, I just feel like Shannon had a lot more talent to work with, and really underperformed. Golden had some talent his first year, but a ton of off the field issues, then two years of pretty mediocre talent, and now has some talent back. He needs to show something with it this year.

I get the anger and frustration with Golden and this staff, but some of the revisionist history on these boards is beyond comical. People here couldn't run Randy Shannon out of Miami fast enough for his incompetence. Now suddenly "he wasn't so bad". Golden may end up going down as a total failure, but that isn't going to somehow make Shannon less of a disaster as an HC than he was.

 

[canesrdynamite]

Golden's roster management is much better than Randy's. I think we had one returning CB in McGee when Golden took over.

Roster management has been better, and recruiting for needs. We don't have MASSIVE holes on the roster the way we did under both Shannon and Coker.

Recruiting QBs has been a huge issue for us since Butch left.

We are obviously hurting at OC, but a real qb coach would go a long way. There was a striking improvement in qb play under Fisch. I would've like to have seen what Kyle Wright could've done with better coaching. I don't see it getting much better any time soon.

I hope Kaaya proves me wrong.

 

[rsa coral gables]

Golden's roster management is much better than Randy's. I think we had one returning CB in McGee when Golden took over.

You mean the roster management that's seen him lose 27 of 77 signees through his first 3 years?

dont think that is a fair commentary. the first class was a sign-whomever-you-can, given how late he got into the game. class 2 was contaminated by the scandal. who the **** was going to come here with some people saying that the program would recieve a death sentence. ditto with class 3. class 4 was way better and class 5 and 6 look great.

on the field? not so much. . .

 

[CANE4LIFE]

Golden's roster management is much better than Randy's. I think we had one returning CB in McGee when Golden took over.

Roster management has been better, and recruiting for needs. We don't have MASSIVE holes on the roster the way we did under both Shannon and Coker.

Recruiting QBs has been a huge issue for us since Butch left. We are obviously hurting at OC, but a real qb coach would go a long way. There was a striking improvement in qb play under Fisch. I would've like to see what Kyle Wright could've done with better coaching. I don't see it getting much better any time soon. I hope Kayaa proves me wrong.

Yes, but honestly, QB recruiting was a problem under Butch too. I know its sacrilege to speak some of these truths here, but Butch had a bunch of Duds at QB too. He basically won the lottery with Dorsey which is what basically took us to the next level. Covington was ok at best, and not til his Sr. year. Kenny Kelly was a big disappointment. Derrick Crudup didn't do jack. Buck Ortega ended up a TE. **** I remember some of the QBs Butch was trying to recruit every year, and it was a **** show for the most part.

As for KW, we will never know what could have been. He did have some decent (at least on paper) QB coaches work with him. Maybe it was too many cooks in the kitchen, but he did have DEDICATED QB coaches, some with NFL pedigrees work with him, and he still could never get it together.

I definitely agree we need a quality QB coach on this staff. If Coley is to remain here, they need to make some changes. He needs to have a different title. Make him recruiting coordinator/TE/OC, and then get a real QB coach in here. Coley is obviously in way over his head here. If they are going to keep him because of his recruiting, then they need to do EVERYTHING possible to bring in some offensive brainpower, and it has to start with a good QB coach for Kaaya.

 

[Ispyin]

one got his lower extremities kicked, the other gets his *** kicked.

 

[Ispyin]

Also, on the field one lost to Virginia in disgusting fashion at home, the other lost to duke period.

 

[deleted3746]

I find this cringe-worthy to say, but as it relates to ON THE FIELD, I think Randy Shannon showed more flexibility and willingness to adjust than we have seen so far from the current staff.

- Shannon went from predominant Man under to transitioning to some underneath zones. The notable Sharpton pick-6 toward the back end of Shannon's tenure as a Head Coach is one example.

- Shannon went so far as to hire Whipple and Bill Young. Both are guys who strayed pretty far from what Shannon had showed were his core, on the field, philosophies. Young was a zone blitz guy. Whipple was a chuck it guy.

- Shannon also made swift decisions when something didn't work. The notable example is Tim Walton. He was immediately fired. Say whatever you will (and most of it is likely very accurate), but Tim Walton actually grew to become an NFL defensive Coordinator under a pretty legitimate Head Coach.


We're talking about on the field, here. I can't believe what I just wrote.

Walton was fired after the defense ranked 35th in total defense.

35th.

 

[canesrdynamite]

Golden's roster management is much better than Randy's. I think we had one returning CB in McGee when Golden took over.

Roster management has been better, and recruiting for needs. We don't have MASSIVE holes on the roster the way we did under both Shannon and Coker.

Recruiting QBs has been a huge issue for us since Butch left. We are obviously hurting at OC, but a real qb coach would go a long way. There was a striking improvement in qb play under Fisch. I would've like to see what Kyle Wright could've done with better coaching. I don't see it getting much better any time soon. I hope Kayaa proves me wrong.

Yes, but honestly, QB recruiting was a problem under Butch too. I know its sacrilege to speak some of these truths here, but Butch had a bunch of Duds at QB too. He basically won the lottery with Dorsey which is what basically took us to the next level. Covington was ok at best, and not til his Sr. year. Kenny Kelly was a big disappointment. Derrick Crudup didn't do jack. Buck Ortega ended up a TE. **** I remember some of the QBs Butch was trying to recruit every year, and it was a **** show for the most part.

As for KW, we will never know what could have been. He did have some decent (at least on paper) QB coaches work with him. Maybe it was too many cooks in the kitchen, but he did have DEDICATED QB coaches, some with NFL pedigrees work with him, and he still could never get it together.

I definitely agree we need a quality QB coach on this staff. If Coley is to remain here, they need to make some changes. He needs to have a different title. Make him recruiting coordinator/TE/OC, and then get a real QB coach in here. Coley is obviously in way over his head here. If they are going to keep him because of his recruiting, then they need to do EVERYTHING possible to bring in some offensive brainpower, and it has to start with a good QB coach for Kaaya.

Well, to be fair, we had some hits and misses with Howard, Jimmy, and Dennis as well. It's just that each of those guys and Butch all hit the lottery. I'm not trying to knight Butch or anything, but 20 yrs of talent at qb makes me remember the good ol days pretty fondly.

KW definitely suffered from the oc coaching carousel and some issues with the oline. And maybe he was all arm and no instincts, but we haven't been getting anywhere close to that caliber of athlete.

We don't need the next Cam Newton or Mike Vick or Dan Marino at qb, but how about somebody who can consistently hit a receiver in stride and go through some progressions. This gets back to the takes talent to recognize talent problem. We would be fine with 3* recruits if we could coach them up (though we should be able to pull tons of qb talent to UM). We just don't have the juice on the offensive side of the ball to make that happen right now, and I don't know when we will with the staff we've got.

 

[pyhooya]

Some of our best moments in UM history have come while Randy Shannon was here, either as a player, DC, or even a head coach. Al Folden, not so much.

My memory isnt that good so please help me with the bold part of your statement. Not saying that Al has done anything either

 

[The Franchise]

I find this cringe-worthy to say, but as it relates to ON THE FIELD, I think Randy Shannon showed more flexibility and willingness to adjust than we have seen so far from the current staff.

- Shannon went from predominant Man under to transitioning to some underneath zones. The notable Sharpton pick-6 toward the back end of Shannon's tenure as a Head Coach is one example.

- Shannon went so far as to hire Whipple and Bill Young. Both are guys who strayed pretty far from what Shannon had showed were his core, on the field, philosophies. Young was a zone blitz guy. Whipple was a chuck it guy.

- Shannon also made swift decisions when something didn't work. The notable example is Tim Walton. He was immediately fired. Say whatever you will (and most of it is likely very accurate), but Tim Walton actually grew to become an NFL defensive Coordinator under a pretty legitimate Head Coach.


We're talking about on the field, here. I can't believe what I just wrote.

Walton was fired after the defense ranked 35th in total defense.

35th.

These dudes would be taking jello shots off Greaseball's gunt if he fielded a top 35 defense.

 

[TrueCane100]

Wont know until we see golden playing with a full deck.. My first year judging golden and staff is this year and at the moment.. Im not exactly liking what im seeing still have a long season to go... Off the field recruiting has been top notch on the field still ?

 

[dudenate]

I read thru this thread and then cried.

 

[AsylumGodfather]

Shannon's defenses were better

 

[Joecane]

Golden's roster management is much better than Randy's. I think we had one returning CB in McGee when Golden took over.

You mean the roster management that's seen him lose 27 of 77 signees through his first 3 years?

dont think that is a fair commentary. the first class was a sign-whomever-you-can, given how late he got into the game. class 2 was contaminated by the scandal. who the **** was going to come here with some people saying that the program would recieve a death sentence. ditto with class 3. class 4 was way better and class 5 and 6 look great.

on the field? not so much. . .

Holy **** grab your helmets! The excuses are flying around.

 

[GTPete00]

A thread like this reminds me that CiS still has the potential to be the best place to have reasonable dialogue on the Canes on the web. The last couple of months have been generally brutal to read.

Back to OP, Shannon-led teams had just as little on-field fire in their bellies as Goldens. Golden manages the clock better, but his game plan doesn't seem to include situational plays that put the offense or defensive players in positions to be most successful.

 

[weownfsu]

The only noticeable difference is that Shannon teams were better

I will asy that I don't think Golden teams really come out flat--I just think they don't have a clue what they are doing due to inept coaching. Sahnnon's teams would come out listless quite a bit.

 

[CANE4LIFE]

I find this cringe-worthy to say, but as it relates to ON THE FIELD, I think Randy Shannon showed more flexibility and willingness to adjust than we have seen so far from the current staff.

- Shannon went from predominant Man under to transitioning to some underneath zones. The notable Sharpton pick-6 toward the back end of Shannon's tenure as a Head Coach is one example.

- Shannon went so far as to hire Whipple and Bill Young. Both are guys who strayed pretty far from what Shannon had showed were his core, on the field, philosophies. Young was a zone blitz guy. Whipple was a chuck it guy.

- Shannon also made swift decisions when something didn't work. The notable example is Tim Walton. He was immediately fired. Say whatever you will (and most of it is likely very accurate), but Tim Walton actually grew to become an NFL defensive Coordinator under a pretty legitimate Head Coach.


We're talking about on the field, here. I can't believe what I just wrote.

Walton was fired after the defense ranked 35th in total defense.

35th.

Do you know how many NFL players Walton and Shannon had on that team that played just defense?

Kenny Phillips 1st round
Calais Campbell 3rd round
Sam Shields
Tavares Gooden
Daryl Sharpton
Colin McCarthy
Spencer Adkins
Antonio Dixon
Dwayne Hendricks
Glenn Sharp
Joe Joseph
Tervaris Johnson
Bruce Johnson

Not even going to count Allen Bailey because he was a Frosh that year.

 

[CANE4LIFE]

Shannon had FAR better talent to work with. Just look at the list above I just made. Those were guys on the 07 squad that went 5-7. ALL those guys played in the NFL. We had a 1st round draft pick on that defense. A slew of other guys that all played in the NFL.

 

[canesrdynamite]

Shannon had FAR better talent to work with. Just look at the list above I just made. Those were guys on the 07 squad that went 5-7. ALL those guys played in the NFL. We had a 1st round draft pick on that defense. A slew of other guys that all played in the NFL.

28th total yds defense, 111th total yds offense (that 2007 team)