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Upon Further Review: Manny Diaz as DC

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Shogungts said:
How are you evaluating? If using the same metric, I don't think either is necessarily useful here since T Rob will not be calling the plays and I don't believe that T Will ever was a coordinator.

That said, I did see an article that Manny Navarro had where he compared Miami LB PFF grades to Auburn ones under T Will and even though the recruits were higher ranked for Auburn, the scores were not that much better for Auburn's LBs compared to Miami. I realize that PFF grades aren't necessarily the end all be all either.
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Travis williams was co dc the last two years at Auburn. He didn't call plays though
 
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CashMoneyCane said:
Statistically speaking, this happens with the extreme vast majority of CFB head coaches, and therefore would be highly expected. Making it, yet another dumb premise.
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CashMoneyCane said:
This would be an extremely dumb example of applied statistics. What is the record of three-year old girls against other real competition?
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Are you just gonna dance and blow hot air or you going to actually say something worth a real reply? Quick, figure out a way to slide your education and salary into the conversation.
 
Ericsoncane said:
It shows he was on his way up. That he was building a resume to be a dc eventually. He's no Thomas brown. He's way better
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People were once pretty excited about brown around UM. But they knew enough not to call him an OC.`It’s not a knock at Williams to point this out. It’s just a reality check for the folks who claim we have 5 DCs running around the building.
 
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Ethnicsands said:
People were once pretty excited about brown around UM. But they knew enough not to call him an OC.`It’s not a knock at Williams to point this out. It’s just a reality check for the folks who claim we have 5 DCs running around the building.
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Well I never claimed it. I'm just stating a fact. He was co dc in 19-20. He's a good lb coach and will probably be a dc eventually.

I don't remember any hype for brown as an oc. I remember hype for him being a good rb coach and he was.

We don't have 5 dcs but we have a vastly more talented coaching staff all with good experience and some have been dcs or co dcs. They'll all bring something new to the table. Whether that's new techniques,blitzes,coverages. Fresh eyes are here to improve this defense and I don't think this will be Manny's defense from the past. It'll be tweaked by Manny and the staff
 
JD08 said:
You left out the part where he accuses people of being Hecht shills.
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You mean mole, Hecht mole.



CashMoneyCane said:
OH THAT'S ME! I lived in Hecht for a summer therefore I want the football program to fail!
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It's an easy connection to make. The best known secret is that the athletic department wants its programs to fail. I'd explain it, but it involves algebra and I was never any good at that.
 
CashMoneyCane said:
Statistically speaking, this happens with the extreme vast majority of CFB head coaches, and therefore would be highly expected. Making it, yet another dumb premise.
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There’s currently 130 FBS programs. There’s 6 current head coaches who have won a national championship. Two of which are Les Miles and Ed Orgeron. Almost every single coach in the history of college football gets fired before he wins a national championship.
 
DTP said:
There’s currently 130 FBS programs. There’s 6 current head coaches who have won a national championship. Two of which are Les Miles and Ed Orgeron. Almost every single coach in the history of college football gets fired before he wins a national championship.
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Shhh you’re spoiling all the secrets of college football
 
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Ericsoncane said:
Well I never claimed it. I'm just stating a fact. He was co dc in 19-20. He's a good lb coach and will probably be a dc eventually.

I don't remember any hype for brown as an oc. I remember hype for him being a good rb coach and he was.

We don't have 5 dcs but we have a vastly more talented coaching staff all with good experience and some have been dcs or co dcs. They'll all bring something new to the table. Whether that's new techniques,blitzes,coverages. Fresh eyes are here to improve this defense and I don't think this will be Manny's defense from the past. It'll be tweaked by Manny and the staff
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He was an 'up n coming' coach growing into OC role ... that was the view. Richt was the play-caller. Not dissimilar to the arguments spread around our defensive position coaches today. And hey, not necessarily wrong. Just because it didn't work out with Brown doesn't mean it won't with these guys. Too many people just tend to be polar around here -- either it's a catastrophe or we're magical. The idea that we have a bunch of Dcs at position coach jobs strikes me as unconvincing. We have guys who had some co- titles and weren't truly the DC. I'm glad they're here. They're apparently good teachers and good recruiters. Just going to reserve judgment on what it means schematically. From what I see, Manny's back to owning the scheme and it's his way or the highway on that.
 
22 pages on Manny as DC. At this rate it will get more posts than the banner, Jobe and Lewis threads.

My 0.02 is that Manny needs Top 10 defenders not to get sliced to ribbons by Top 20 offenses. He's not outsmarting any of those programs by his scheme or play calling, and I expect they'll be able to exploit his tendencies.

We looked amazing vs. 2017 ND and Va Tech. But 1. they were overrated. 2. We had a really good defense -- McIntosh, Norton, Chad Thomas, Joe Jax, Shaq and Pinckney, Quan, Red, Thriller and Bandy/Dean/Delaney. Our CBs were the weakest link in that chain, everyone else was a high-level college or pro level guy.

Meanwhile, 2021 is still a black hole at LB, and our DTs and DEs are both a step below 2017. Our CBs should be much better. But the rest is par or worse.

Manny is not the genius he thinks he is, and is juggling 2 jobs. I'm looking forward to 2021 because of all the young talent. But I don't see us having a great defensive season overall, and I see us being outclassed and potentially embarrassed vs. Bama and UNC. We'll end up somewhere between 8-4 and 10-2, good enough to pull in a nice class to keep the trend in the right direction. But hopefully Manny realizes he will never be a great DC while being HC, and goes out and hires a top talent there in the offseason.
 
grover said:
22 pages on Manny as DC. At this rate it will get more posts than the banner, Jobe and Lewis threads.

My 0.02 is that Manny needs Top 10 defenders not to get sliced to ribbons by Top 20 offenses. He's not outsmarting any of those programs by his scheme or play calling, and I expect they'll be able to exploit his tendencies.

We looked amazing vs. 2017 ND and Va Tech. But 1. they were overrated. 2. We had a really good defense -- McIntosh, Norton, Chad Thomas, Joe Jax, Shaq and Pinckney, Quan, Red, Thriller and Bandy/Dean/Delaney. Our CBs were the weakest link in that chain, everyone else was a high-level college or pro level guy.

Meanwhile, 2021 is still a black hole at LB, and our DTs and DEs are both a step below 2017. Our CBs should be much better. But the rest is par or worse.

Manny is not the genius he thinks he is, and is juggling 2 jobs. I'm looking forward to 2021 because of all the young talent. But I don't see us having a great defensive season overall, and I see us being outclassed and potentially embarrassed vs. Bama and UNC. We'll end up somewhere between 8-4 and 10-2, good enough to pull in a nice class to keep the trend in the right direction. But hopefully Manny realizes he will never be a great DC while being HC, and goes out and hires a top talent there in the offseason.
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i think that is what he tried to do but couldn't get the guy he wanted. maybe next year he will.
 
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Hecht Mole said:
You mean mole, Hecht mole.




It's an easy connection to make. The best known secret is that the athletic department wants its programs to fail. I'd explain it, but it involves algebra and I was never any good at that.
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Don't forget the Trustees, who give millions of dollars of their own money to watch us lose!

If only we could take casual fans with zero experience in athletic administration, university administration, or coaching football at anything beyond the peewee level, and put them in charge. Then we might have a chance.
 
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Jedi Master Cane said:
I don't believe Cristobal was ever a coordinator, thus was never fired in that capacity and doesn't apply to my question. I also don't believe Leach was fired AS A COORDINATOR. Getting fired as a head coach doesn't apply to my original question. Correct me if I'm wrong on that one as far as him being fired as a coordinator.

As far as Aranda goes, he was fired from Hawaii but only as a matter of circumstance (and not for a lack of performance like Manny was at Texas) when the head coach he was under got canned, so he was not retained since the new coach brought in his own staff. So Aranda himself wasn't DIRECTLY fired INDIVIDUALLY for a LACK OF PERFORMANCE. Aranda's defensive stats at Hawaii were actually pretty good. We also don't have enough sample of him as a HEAD COACH to say he's a great head coach yet. As such I don't think he meets the criteria of the original question.

Was Orgeron ever a coordinator either? I also don't think he's a good example and doesn't apply to the original premise. The original premise was that a guy coming up the ranks who failed at his particular "area of expertise" rarely goes on to find success when tasked with being a head coach. Orgeron's "area of expertise" was recruiting....where he was excellent.

None of those examples I think quell the original concern.
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Orgeron was DC at USC and Cristobal was not a coordinator but failed as HC with FIU.
 
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