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Boxing The CIS Boxing Thread

rustywalkedaway said:
1. I think Fury, right now, is simply too much of a physical mismatch for Usyk. But this is peak Fury and I don't think we've seen peak Usyk.
2. Peak Fury v. peak Lennox? That would be a **** of a fight.
3. I don't throw terms like "great" around easily, but Ali was unquestionably great. Having said that, both Lewis and Fury are bad matchups for him.
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Usyk is 33 with over 300 amateur fights under his belt. When will he hit his peak?
 
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Bernie20 said:
Been watching heavyweight boxing since before you were born son.
Is Fury the best in an awful era of heavyweights? I guess. That doesn't make him an All-Timer or anywhere close. That is my whole point.
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I never said he was an All-Timer, but his boxing skill and defensive ability is up there with the best and I've watched boxing for years. His only knock is lack of one punch power. Try not to look at him as a flabby white dude, he has serious skill.
 
Rellyrell said:
Which Tyson? Teddy Atlas, Cus D’Amato Tyson or Don King, Fresh outta jail Tyson?

The latter version of Tyson would get worked, but the former, disciplined Tyson....I’m not so sure. Tyson dominated in an era where the heavyweight division actually meant something. Lewis & Hollyfield both fought Mike when he was no longer Iron Mike. He was a shell of himself w/ **** poor trainers and handlers that used him for all his $.
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Most people look at the Tyson that was in shambles and think that was the real one but just exposed.

A Cus D’Amato Tyson would push the limits of many great boxers. I'm not saying he is the greatest and would've won all fights but best believe. Them dudes wouldn't have wanted him to get close and start pounded them combos out.
 
Prime Fury is good enough to give prime 1967 Ali a good fight. That's how good Fury is. Good enough to give the greatest of all time a competitive fight. Ali would likely have won on points, but it would go the distance.

As for Mike Tyson, his style would put him at a massive disadvantage against Fury. Fury would have too much reach, too much defense for Tyson to get the quick KO, and that tended to be his undoing.
 
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OBLIVION said:
Most people look at the Tyson that was in shambles and think that was the real one but just exposed.

A Cus D’Amato Tyson would push the limits of many great boxers. I'm not saying he is the greatest and would've won all fights but best believe. Them dudes wouldn't have wanted him to get close and start pounded them combos out.
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Tyson was probably the most talented HW of all time.
 
OBLIVION said:
Most people look at the Tyson that was in shambles and think that was the real one but just exposed.

A Cus D’Amato Tyson would push the limits of many great boxers. I'm not saying he is the greatest and would've won all fights but best believe. Them dudes wouldn't have wanted him to get close and start pounded them combos out.
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People forget Tyson was a real boxer in his early days. He had superior power in both hands, along w elite quickness, head & footwork.

Later in his career, he was just swinging for the knockout blow; see his WBC match w Bruno....yes he won & knocked Bruno out, but he was looking solely for the kill shot and his technique was poor, plus you could look in his eyes and tell he wasn’t the same boxer.

Mike in his latter yrs was a just an old pit bull w a lot of bark, but no bite. His pre-fight antics were entertaining than his matches. I believe was he converted over to Islam, that edge that used to fuel him, was gone. Along w his wife setting him up on live TV, handlers literally poaching from his pockets....he was no where near the same person, let alone boxer. That’s what ppl remember, not late 80’s early 90’s Mike.
 
Rellyrell said:
People forget Tyson was a real boxer in his early days. He had superior power in both hands, along w elite quickness, head & footwork.

Later in his career, he was just swinging for the knockout blow; see his WBC match w Bruno....yes he won & knocked Bruno out, but he was looking solely for the kill shot and his technique was poor, plus you could look in his eyes and tell he wasn’t the same boxer.

Mike in his latter yrs was a just an old pit bull w a lot of bark, but no bite. His pre-fight antics were entertaining than his matches. I believe was he converted over to Islam, that edge that used to fuel him, was gone. Along w his wife setting him up on live TV, handlers literally poaching from his pockets....he was no where near the same person, let alone boxer. That’s what ppl remember, not late 80’s early 90’s Mike.
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He was one of the fastest HWs of all time and probably the most defensive.
 
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ShlomoShekelberg said:
Prime Fury is good enough to give prime 1967 Ali a good fight. That's how good Fury is. Good enough to give the greatest of all time a competitive fight. Ali would likely have won on points, but it would go the distance.

As for Mike Tyson, his style would put him at a massive disadvantage against Fury. Fury would have too much reach, too much defense for Tyson to get the quick KO, and that tended to be his undoing.
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Lennox Lewis would knock Fury out in 4 rounds.
 
DTP said:
I disagree that heavyweight boxing is that bad now. Wilder isn’t a great boxer but being a one dimensional knock out artist is hardly something new, especially for a heavyweight. And Fury is an elite level technician. He doesn’t get hit hard often and when he does, his chin is solid.
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He was floored by Steve Cunningham. His chin isn't that solid. His skill set is amazing though.
 
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CaliFLACane850 said:
Lennox Lewis would knock Fury out in 4 rounds.
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No chance of that. If Klitschko couldn't land meaningfully on Fury, then Lewis wouldn't have done much better, as they had somewhat similar styles and were trained to fight in a similar way. You need an elite boxer with elite hand speed (Ali, young Larry Holmes, etc...) to counter Fury's awkward defensive style.
 
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ShlomoShekelberg said:
No chance of that. If Klitschko couldn't land meaningfully on Fury, then Lewis wouldn't have done much better, as they had somewhat similar styles and were trained to fight in a similar way. You need an elite boxer with elite hand speed (Ali, young Larry Holmes, etc...) to counter Fury's awkward defensive style.
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Klitschko always had issues with taller fighters. Lewis, not so much. Fury was dropped by Cunningham and Wilder, both of whom do not possess the same skill set as Lewis. Lewis would annihilate Fury without any issues. Ali is too small for Fury and Holmes would be in a jabbing match with Fury the whole fight.
 
MasterBlaster said:
I never said he was an All-Timer, but his boxing skill and defensive ability is up there with the best and I've watched boxing for years. His only knock is lack of one punch power. Try not to look at him as a flabby white dude, he has serious skill.
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Ok you’re being reasonable. Will do.
 
Cribby said:
It affected him but it’s way over exaggerated. He was still in his prime when he got out. ****, Lennox was a year older than Mike.

Tyson literally never beat a really good or great boxer. They lined up tomato cans sometimes two in a month to pile up victories. It was a very watered down division. He fought Mostly mediocre boxers that were already defeated before the bell rang. They also picked his opponents well, finding mostly journeymen or washed up guys like Holmes.

His out of ring issues and other issues were always there , it just wasn’t an issue until he started getting knocked out. Then it’s the excuse why he wasn’t Ali lol. It wasn’t prison , or the other issues that exposed him, it was when guys were like “ he’s not unbeatable “ and they saw him get his lights turned out. That’s when his career ended.

And I was a huge Tyson fan growing up and saw all his fights. I just know it was a mirage.
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Tyson was the youngest heavy weight champion of all time beat three different heavyweight champions to unify the title. To say he never fought anybody is wrong after cleaning out the division. Tyson was never the same after Jim Jacobs died in 1988. He was at his prime for the Spinks fight. Shortly after this fight with just Kevin Rooney and Bill Cayton remaining , Don King slimmed his way in with the help of Ruth Roper and Robin Givens to divide the team to get sole control of Tyson, King took over and then fired Tyson's trainer Rooney replacing him with clueless trainers who trashed Cus DeAmoto's method and changed his style.

Tyson was never the same fighter and never trained as hard and was out of control with to much cocaine, women, crashing several cars and one crash knocking him self out while trying to kill himself. Street brawls breaking his hand and a divorce with Givens all in 1988. He looked terrible in his first fight after the big change againt Bruno getting hit more than he ever had before but still won the fight.

Before Don King and Robin Givens . Tyson’s sparring partner Greg Page who was at one time a rising star in the HW ranks. Tyson embarrassed Page in training camps by smacking him around from ring post to post. For the Douglas training camp Page belted Tyson around and then, famously, floored him. The rest is history and Tyson was never close to the fighter as he was the year before.
 
CaliFLACane850 said:
Klitschko always had issues with taller fighters. Lewis, not so much. Fury was dropped by Cunningham and Wilder, both of whom do not possess the same skill set as Lewis. Lewis would annihilate Fury without any issues. Ali is too small for Fury and Holmes would be in a jabbing match with Fury the whole fight.
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Oliver McCall and Hasim Rahman didn't have the skill set of Lennox Lewis, but that didn't stop them from putting him on the mat. And neither of those guys had half the boxing skill, footwork, size, or reach of Tyson Fury. Lennox Lewis wouldn't win one fight in three against Fury. Fury's style is all wrong for Lewis.
 
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