forums

SIAP: Miami comes in at #17

puertorricane said:
I hate pre season polls. The SEC with 8 ranked teams helps the narrative that they are so good when they beat each other and play no one OOC.
I'm not a conference rah rah guy but the ACC better start out 5-0 vs them.

Also would love it if the gaytors start 0-2 vs FAU and USF.
Click to expand...
Yeah, I can't remember where we were ranked preseason in '83.

I guess there are some that over the years have still questioned whether we really deserved no. 1 and whether beating Nebraska was a fluke.
 
Advertisement
JD08 said:
Have you ever been in a fight that you lost? If so, did you let it define the rest of your life as a loser deserving of derision from everyone?
Click to expand...
It was more than a loss, it was a humiliation. Perhap the worst I've seen UM take in over half a century of watching UM football. We need to put it in the past and be competitive against every team we play, including Alabama and if we play them, Clemson. It looked like we quit against UNC. I don't know if we quit, or we were so shell shocked by poor preparation. I think there's a flaw in MD's defensive philosophy and the wily old Mack Brown knew how to exploit it. He fired MD for the same problem I think at Texas. If all you're going to do is attack and go upfield (and I like an attack defense) you have to somehow account for the vulnerabilities you create. I would have preferred to see MD hire an experienced superior coordinator and delegate. It worried me when MD decided he would take the DC job back to himself. I'm hoping maybe the advice he gets from this Shoop guy gives MD some reality checking and feedback. When I was working, and I had a difficult and sensitive matter, I would always appreciate good advice and feedback from smart and trusted colleagues.
 
TheMatador said:
Yeah, I can't remember where we were ranked preseason in '83.

I guess there are some that over the years have still questioned whether we really deserved no. 1 and whether beating Nebraska was a fluke.
Click to expand...


1983, we were not ranked in EITHER the AP or the UPI pre-season Top 20 polls. We certainly were not after losing to UiF in Game 1. We made our 1983 debut in both polls (#15 in each) after winning 3 straight games to improve to 3-1. It also didn't hurt that our third win was a home victory over (then) #13 Notre Dame, who finished 7-5 that year.

We didn't play another ranked team until October 29 (#12 West Virginia), and then the only other ranked team that we beat was Nebraska in the Orange Bowl.

We did not play BC or Pitt that year (independents who finished the year ranked). East Carolina was unranked when we played them, but finished at #20 (we actually dropped from #5 to #6 when we "only" beat ECU by 5 points).

I believe that, for the "modern era", the 1983 UM team jumped the farthest to #1 in the final poll, from #5 to #1. Another reason I prefer more than 4 teams in the CFP.
 
TheMatador said:
It was more than a loss, it was a humiliation. Perhap the worst I've seen UM take in over half a century of watching UM football. We need to put it in the past and be competitive against every team we play, including Alabama and if we play them, Clemson. It looked like we quit against UNC. I don't know if we quit, or we were so shell shocked by poor preparation. I think there's a flaw in MD's defensive philosophy and the wily old Mack Brown knew how to exploit it. He fired MD for the same problem I think at Texas. If all you're going to do is attack and go upfield (and I like an attack defense) you have to somehow account for the vulnerabilities you create. I would have preferred to see MD hire an experienced superior coordinator and delegate. It worried me when MD decided he would take the DC job back to himself. I'm hoping maybe the advice he gets from this Shoop guy gives MD some reality checking and feedback. When I was working, and I had a difficult and sensitive matter, I would always appreciate good advice and feedback from smart and trusted colleagues.
Click to expand...


We lost badly, but to a good team. I believe we have had "worse" losses, in the sense that we absolutely should not have lost certain games that we lost. For instance, 48-0 in the final game in the Orange Bowl vs. UVa.
 
Canesfan1899 said:
I don't want to be ranked until we prove we can stay ranked. Isn't that how it goes.
Click to expand...


Uh, no, that's not how it goes.

If any writer thinks "I believe Miami is the 17th best team" and then somehow changes his mind after #1 Alabama beats us, that should be on the writer, not Miami.

We'll have 4 more weeks to prove that we should still be a Top 25 team (after Alabama) until we are strongly challenged for a second time.
 
TheOriginalCane said:
1983, we were not ranked in EITHER the AP or the UPI pre-season Top 20 polls. We certainly were not after losing to UiF in Game 1. We made our 1983 debut in both polls (#15 in each) after winning 3 straight games to improve to 3-1. It also didn't hurt that our third win was a home victory over (then) #13 Notre Dame, who finished 7-5 that year.

We didn't play another ranked team until October 29 (#12 West Virginia), and then the only other ranked team that we beat was Nebraska in the Orange Bowl.

We did not play BC or Pitt that year (independents who finished the year ranked). East Carolina was unranked when we played them, but finished at #20 (we actually dropped from #5 to #6 when we "only" beat ECU by 5 points).

I believe that, for the "modern era", the 1983 UM team jumped the farthest to #1 in the final poll, from #5 to #1. Another reason I prefer more than 4 teams in the CFP.
Click to expand...
Good post. Yes, we came out of nowhere in 1983. No one, but no one, expected us to do what we did. I recall going to a store that sold athletic shoewear one evening. Bunch of young guys working there. I remember them talking about Nebraska, as though their '83 team was unbeatable. (This was in suburban Maryland). I didn't say much, I didn't know much. It was still hard to follow UM from a distance, we didn't have wall-to-wall college football coverage back then. I remember how tough ECU was that year. Schnelly commented on how good they were, saying that the only difference from the very best teams was the name, ECU.

We were a Cinderella team that managed to get the Orange Bowl bid to play Nebraska. Auburn was trying to lay claim to the title. They still did after the bowl games when the NY Times computer ranked them number one instead of Miami. I even remember seeing Auburn NC gear being advertised in one of the sports newspapers, maybe Sporting News. (What people used to read in paper copy back in the day). Pat Dye, Auburn coach, complained bitterly that Schnelly campaigned for it to be the NC game, when he contended the legitimate contender should have been Auburn. Maybe he was right, who knows, but we got the chance to knock off Nebraska and we did.

We shocked the world.
 
TheMatador said:
It was more than a loss, it was a humiliation. Perhap the worst I've seen UM take in over half a century of watching UM football. We need to put it in the past and be competitive against every team we play, including Alabama and if we play them, Clemson. It looked like we quit against UNC. I don't know if we quit, or we were so shell shocked by poor preparation. I think there's a flaw in MD's defensive philosophy and the wily old Mack Brown knew how to exploit it. He fired MD for the same problem I think at Texas. If all you're going to do is attack and go upfield (and I like an attack defense) you have to somehow account for the vulnerabilities you create. I would have preferred to see MD hire an experienced superior coordinator and delegate. It worried me when MD decided he would take the DC job back to himself. I'm hoping maybe the advice he gets from this Shoop guy gives MD some reality checking and feedback. When I was working, and I had a difficult and sensitive matter, I would always appreciate good advice and feedback from smart and trusted colleagues.
Click to expand...
I'm not minimizing how bad of a loss it was. I'm saying you can't dwell on it.

I'd bet the Baker situation was a big part of the problem. We saw that the year before also. There is no way a defensive mind like Bob Shoop is going to let us go into that game unprepared without a plan B, C, and D in case Mack gets clever.
 
Advertisement
OrangeBowlMagic said:
They've also recruited very well, with 3 Top 20 classes in the past 4 years.

Including being #14 and #13 the past 2 cycles (2020 and 2021).

They've gotten some good kids out of the portal the past few years as well. I believe they'll have 3 DB starters this year all from the portal. McMichael from Clemson, Cam Kelly from Auburn and Bryce Watts from VT who opted out last year.

They usually recruit good kids on the DL, and the last 2 classes are no exception, pulling in Top 50 talents both classes (Dez Evans and Keeshawn Silver).

I think they're kind of a media darling again because of the ceiling. Like games against us, putting up 56 against VT, they scored 104 points last year against their 2 in-state rivals, etc. And Howell is obviously excellent. So I can see how, without really examining their roster and results, you could project them as a Top 10 team. But they haven't been consistent at all yet. 4 losses last year, 6 losses the year before. The defense is still very average. They were 74th in the country last year in YPP allowed. 64th in scoring defense. They gave up 41 points to Virginia. 45 to VT. 53 to Wake. So, let's pump the brakes a little. And, what people don't understand fully yet is they lost a LOT of offensive production. Their leading returning rusher is Sam Howell. Carter and Williams are taking almost 2400 yards with them to the NFL. Dyami Brown and his 1100 yards are gone. Dazz Newsome and his almost 700 yards are gone. Williams and Carter were their 4th and 5th leading receivers. That's well over 65% of Howell's passing yards that will have to go to other targets.

They'll be fine, Howell is good and Phil Longo is one of the best offensive minds in the game (watch how quickly they decline when he leaves, by the way. He's going to be a HC soon). So sure, let people put them up at #10. Week 1 they play on Friday night, at Lane, in what will probably be once again a packed house and very intimidating environment. They very well may end up leaving there 0-1, so this Top 10 talk might be extinguished very quickly. They go to Pitt on a Thursday night. They play in South Bend. They play in Raleigh the day after Thanksgiving. They get FSU again. We come calling on 10/16 as the 7th of 7 straight weeks with a game. I don't care where they start the year ranked. They won't finish it in the Top 10.
Click to expand...
Not to mention a very competent OL coach!
 
TheMatador said:
Good post. Yes, we came out of nowhere in 1983. No one, but no one, expected us to do what we did. I recall going to a store that sold athletic shoewear one evening. Bunch of young guys working there. I remember them talking about Nebraska, as though their '83 team was unbeatable. (This was in suburban Maryland). I didn't say much, I didn't know much. It was still hard to follow UM from a distance, we didn't have wall-to-wall college football coverage back then. I remember how tough ECU was that year. Schnelly commented on how good they were, saying that the only difference from the very best teams was the name, ECU.

We were a Cinderella team that managed to get the Orange Bowl bid to play Nebraska. Auburn was trying to lay claim to the title. They still did after the bowl games when the NY Times computer ranked them number one instead of Miami. I even remember seeing Auburn NC gear being advertised in one of the sports newspapers, maybe Sporting News. (What people used to read in paper copy back in the day). Pat Dye, Auburn coach, complained bitterly that Schnelly campaigned for it to be the NC game, when he contended the legitimate contender should have been Auburn. Maybe he was right, who knows, but we got the chance to knock off Nebraska and we did.

We shocked the world.
Click to expand...


OK, let's analyze this.

Miami lost to The Gaytor by 25 on the road. The Gaytor would finish the season at #6 (both polls). Miami beat West Virginia and ECU (both ranked at the end of the season) and beat a ranked-at-the-time Notre Dame team (might have been ranked at year-end if the polls featured 25 teams at the time). F$U would likely have been ranked in the Top 25 as well. We also beat Mississippi State.

Auburn lost to Texas by 13 at home. Texas would finish the season at #5 (both polls). Auburn beat Florida, Georgia, and Alabama and beat a ranked-at-the-time Maryland team (might have been ranked at year-end if the polls featured 25 teams at the time). F$U would likely have been ranked in the Top 25 as well. Auburn also beat Mississippi State.

Soooo....largely a wash, with the exception of the "but Auburn beat The Gaytor" argument.

But then...Auburn beat #8 Michigan (who had 2 losses) by 2 points in the Sugar Bowl...and Miami beat previously undefeated #1 GOATATT Nebraska by 1 point in the Orange Bowl.

Look, I could give Auburn a tiny bit more credit IF IF IF...the actual WRITERS AND COACHES had voted them #2. But those writers and coaches voted Auburn NUMBER THREE behind Nebraska.

So I'm going to call bullsh!te on that NYT "national championship" in the same exact way that I called bullsh!te on UCF's "national championship"...

UNLESS UNLESS UNLESS someone wants to recognize that Miami has NINE NATIONAL CHAMPIONSHIPS using the exact same criteria.
 
TheOriginalCane said:
Uh, no, that's not how it goes.

If any writer thinks "I believe Miami is the 17th best team" and then somehow changes his mind after #1 Alabama beats us, that should be on the writer, not Miami.

We'll have 4 more weeks to prove that we should still be a Top 25 team (after Alabama) until we are strongly challenged for a second time.
Click to expand...
Think you missed what I was trying say.
 
TheMatador said:
Good post. Yes, we came out of nowhere in 1983. No one, but no one, expected us to do what we did. I recall going to a store that sold athletic shoewear one evening. Bunch of young guys working there. I remember them talking about Nebraska, as though their '83 team was unbeatable. (This was in suburban Maryland). I didn't say much, I didn't know much. It was still hard to follow UM from a distance, we didn't have wall-to-wall college football coverage back then. I remember how tough ECU was that year. Schnelly commented on how good they were, saying that the only difference from the very best teams was the name, ECU.

We were a Cinderella team that managed to get the Orange Bowl bid to play Nebraska. Auburn was trying to lay claim to the title. They still did after the bowl games when the NY Times computer ranked them number one instead of Miami. I even remember seeing Auburn NC gear being advertised in one of the sports newspapers, maybe Sporting News. (What people used to read in paper copy back in the day). Pat Dye, Auburn coach, complained bitterly that Schnelly campaigned for it to be the NC game, when he contended the legitimate contender should have been Auburn. Maybe he was right, who knows, but we got the chance to knock off Nebraska and we did.

We shocked the world.
Click to expand...

Wrong

Howard did
 
Advertisement
puertorricane said:
They were last season, is a different year and they lost their top 4 pass catchers and top two rushers.
They are not a reload every year type of team.
Click to expand...
Seema no one just wants to give Unc any credit, Mack has only been there 2 years he definitely has them trending in the right direction, but like always, time will give us the answer
 
Back
Top