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Repulsive stat

DMoney said:
Feliciano, McDermott and Isidora started 13 games. Flowers started 12. Depth didn't come into play too much.

Three NFL players, another first-team All-ACC player, and over 75 career starts. Again, there is no reason the OL struggled like it did. Just another example of Miami doing more with less.
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Again, you calling isidora an ‘nfl player’ in 2014 is disingenuous. Why not try harder to actually assess 2014 talent? Isidora as a soph in 2014 was not a good player. Decent at best. Not even honorable mention all ACC. We had a pretty good feliciano as a sr. - despite your ‘nfl talent; claim he was just ‘honorable mention all ACC’ in 2014 Not even third team All conference. Ditto McDermott. Flowers was second team. Behind that group, zero. That OL was ok, lacked depth, lacked experience, lacked discipline. Say what you want about ‘nfl talent.’ It’s misleading because it’s incomplete and based off future outcomes, not 2014 capabilities.
 
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CANEFAN83 said:
Poor coaching and development of talent.
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I was watching some clips of Clinton Portis' career here (and he doesn't get enough credit in the discussion of all-time great backs here). Anyways, @The Franchise and @Ethnicsands we've been discussing player development here for the last several years. Watching these highlights of Dre, Portis, DJ, completely turned on the light bulb as far as player development or lack-there-of that's plagued this program.
-I saw a true freshman Portis get bigger, stronger, and faster each season he was here. Like it was clear to see how much better he got year to year.
-DJ started as a FB here, and the coaches saw his potential due to his grown man physique to get him on the opposite side of the ball.
-Dre went from a guy who was physically imposing and butter fingers, to an absolute monster of a WR we haven't had since.

Our players are remaining stagnant, and many have also regressed:
-As a true freshman, Donaldson looked like he was our next first-second round draft pick OL. Now? He barely looks like he will be a starter.
-As true freshmen, Pinckney, Shaq, and McCloud were praised as the new Bermuda Triangle, and we had all 3 being future high draft picks. Shaq gets picked in the 4th and Pinckney undrafted. McCloud RS so he could get an opportunity to play.
-Pope looks exactly the same as a Freshman until now
-Jade looks the same...no new rush moves from high school until now.

We can go back to players in 2006 and call out the same chit. I don't see guys getting better. I don't see them maturing physically either...I'm not talking how they look, I'm talking about being stronger at the point of attack. I still see guys getting tackled easily, and getting blown off the L.O.S, and slow. The Miami v. FSU marathon clearly shows how far we've fallen off as a complete program, excluding wins and losses.
 
Rellyrell said:
I was watching some clips of Clinton Portis' career here (and he doesn't get enough credit in the discussion of all-time great backs here). Anyways, @The Franchise and @Ethnicsands we've been discussing player development here for the last several years. Watching these highlights of Dre, Portis, DJ, completely turned on the light bulb as far as player development or lack-there-of that's plagued this program.
-I saw a true freshman Portis get bigger, stronger, and faster each season he was here. Like it was clear to see how much better he got year to year.
-DJ started as a FB here, and the coaches saw his potential due to his grown man physique to get him on the opposite side of the ball.
-Dre went from a guy who was physically imposing and butter fingers, to an absolute monster of a WR we haven't had since.

Our players are remaining stagnant, and many have also regressed:
-As a true freshman, Donaldson looked like he was our next first-second round draft pick OL. Now? He barely looks like he will be a starter.
-As true freshmen, Pinckney, Shaq, and McCloud were praised as the new Bermuda Triangle, and we had all 3 being future high draft picks. Shaq gets picked in the 4th and Pinckney undrafted. McCloud RS so he could get an opportunity to play.
-Pope looks exactly the same as a Freshman until now
-Jade looks the same...no new rush moves from high school until now.

We can go back to players in 2006 and call out the same chit. I don't see guys getting better. I don't see them maturing physically either...I'm not talking how they look, I'm talking about being stronger at the point of attack. I still see guys getting tackled easily, and getting blown off the L.O.S, and slow. The Miami v. FSU marathon clearly shows how far we've fallen off as a complete program, excluding wins and losses.
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Portis came in dynamite, brother. He grew physically, but he was lightning as soon as he first touched the ball. I think he had the freshman rushing record here.

Andre's "development" was getting his vision fixed and gaining a little confidence. He was another guy who came in freakish, and no one could cover him.

DJ played FB because we wanted to play him to keep him from transferring, and he wasn't far enough along to play LB. So we put in a couple plays for him at FB and let him get on the field. He was the #1 recruit in the country for a reason, boss.
 
The Franchise said:
Portis came in dynamite, brother. He grew physically, but he was lightning as soon as he first touched the ball. I think he had the freshman rushing record here.

Andre's "development" was getting his vision fixed and gaining a little confidence. He was another guy who came in freakish, and no one could cover him.

DJ played FB because we wanted to play him to keep him from transferring, and he wasn't far enough along to play LB. So we put in a couple plays for him at FB and let him get on the field. He was the #1 recruit in the country for a reason, boss.
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Not disagreeing w/ anything you're saying, but Portis still got better EVERY year he was here. He went from getting tracked down, to pulling away.
Dre got his vision fix, but hands are still hands. Absolutely Dre was freakish, and if I'm not mistaken he was the number 1 WR in the nation coming out or at least top 3.
DJ was the number 1 player in the nation, for sure. But again, he got better each season as well:
Sophomore yr: 51 tackles, 1 FF
Junior yr: 108 tackles, 4 sacks, 2 FF (2nd team all Big East)
Senior yr: 82 tackles, 6 sacks, 1 FF, 1 TD (3rd team AA, 1st team all Big East)

We're not seeing our players get better in any facet of their game from today.
 
Rellyrell said:
FINALLY! This guy gets it.

1. As I’ve been saying for a couple of years now, our S&C has been wack and it shows in the trenches.

2. We have been predictable af

3. We have caused ZERO fear into any defense we’ve played

4. We’ve had ZERO innovative coaches here

5. We’ve been inconsistent with players’ performances/motivation
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Hey wait, what do you mean FINALLY? Am I usually THAT slow? Wait, please don't answer that.
 
ThomasM said:
Hey wait, what do you mean FINALLY? Am I usually THAT slow? Wait, please don't answer that.
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There's an exclamation point after finally, which means, I was giving you props for being the one to bring your point out. No one said what you listed up to that point. lol
 
Rellyrell said:
There's an exclamation point after finally, which means, I was giving you props for being the one to bring your point out. No one said what you listed up to that point. lol
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I am kind of slow after a night of no sleep, potty training, home schooling, and online courses. Potty training for my youngest, not myself.
 
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LuCane said:
Yet, at the same time, Enos would stick with a QB run play call into a company of soldiers if that’s what he had come up with during the 23 seconds he decided in between plays.

I think 142 year old Butch Davis felt like General Patton across the sideline predicting our plays. He had rows of defenders plugging where he thought our plays were going.

The goal line play where Jarren Williams runs despite having a slot WR uncovered is Enos’ legacy here. We had timeouts, too. I still can’t wrap my head around that play.
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The second Butch took away the Slant....I knew Enos was done....
 
Rellyrell said:
I was watching some clips of Clinton Portis' career here (and he doesn't get enough credit in the discussion of all-time great backs here). Anyways, @The Franchise and @Ethnicsands we've been discussing player development here for the last several years. Watching these highlights of Dre, Portis, DJ, completely turned on the light bulb as far as player development or lack-there-of that's plagued this program.
-I saw a true freshman Portis get bigger, stronger, and faster each season he was here. Like it was clear to see how much better he got year to year.
-DJ started as a FB here, and the coaches saw his potential due to his grown man physique to get him on the opposite side of the ball.
-Dre went from a guy who was physically imposing and butter fingers, to an absolute monster of a WR we haven't had since.

Our players are remaining stagnant, and many have also regressed:
-As a true freshman, Donaldson looked like he was our next first-second round draft pick OL. Now? He barely looks like he will be a starter.
-As true freshmen, Pinckney, Shaq, and McCloud were praised as the new Bermuda Triangle, and we had all 3 being future high draft picks. Shaq gets picked in the 4th and Pinckney undrafted. McCloud RS so he could get an opportunity to play.
-Pope looks exactly the same as a Freshman until now
-Jade looks the same...no new rush moves from high school until now.

We can go back to players in 2006 and call out the same chit. I don't see guys getting better. I don't see them maturing physically either...I'm not talking how they look, I'm talking about being stronger at the point of attack. I still see guys getting tackled easily, and getting blown off the L.O.S, and slow. The Miami v. FSU marathon clearly shows how far we've fallen off as a complete program, excluding wins and losses.
Click to expand...
As I have been saying for ages, it’s not one thing, it’s everything.

S&C has been subpar since Moffitt left. but lack of depth and BS culture also hurt ‘development.’

Still, like @feanchise points out, DJ was the top recruit in the country. AJ was an athletic marvel. Portis was amazing. Miami didn’t make those guys - that’s be a mistake to believe. We identified them, and got them here, and gave them tools to work with.

Donaldson does look like he’s regressed ... but he’s a huge body kid and sometimes their bodies get away from them. We see him as a referendum, but he’s just a kid struggling with his weight.

Shaq and Pinckney played okay here. Athletically, they weren’t what fans hyped them to be. DJ williams himself, who you bring up as an analogy, would get on pinckney for his work ethic.

It’s not very much ‘development.’ That’s a word to help people avoid understanding what it is. It’s evals, culture, S&C, and the rest is scheme, game planning and play callinf, and some leadership and morovation. ‘Development’ beyond those things is a bit of technique development, and it’s not at all clear our guys had less access to help with that then kids at plenty of lesser schools who stall made the pros.
 
Ethnicsands said:
As I have been saying for ages, it’s not one thing, it’s everything.

S&C has been subpar since Moffitt left. but lack of depth and BS culture also hurt ‘development.’

Still, like @feanchise points out, DJ was the top recruit in the country. AJ was an athletic marvel. Portis was amazing. Miami didn’t make those guys - that’s be a mistake to believe. We identified them, and got them here, and gave them tools to work with.

Donaldson does look like he’s regressed ... but he’s a huge body kid and sometimes their bodies get away from them. We see him as a referendum, but he’s just a kid struggling with his weight.

Shaq and Pinckney played okay here. Athletically, they weren’t what fans hyped them to be. DJ williams himself, who you bring up as an analogy, would get on pinckney for his work ethic.

It’s not very much ‘development.’ That’s a word to help people avoid understanding what it is. It’s evals, culture, S&C, and the rest is scheme, game planning and play callinf, and some leadership and morovation. ‘Development’ beyond those things is a bit of technique development, and it’s not at all clear our guys had less access to help with that then kids at plenty of lesser schools who stall made the pros.
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I agree, but part of my previous argument has been **** poor culture in the hinderance of development.

I’m talking physical, emotional, mental, IQ development. So we may take player A from a lesser known school, but that lesser known school may demand a certain level of professionalism and work ethic. W-L, what conference u’re in, or what you have access to, doesn’t necessarily mean or indicate “development.” We never had the best compared to other schools, but a certain culture & work ethic, both on & off the field, was extraordinary.

Putting players on a cheeseburger & pizza diet is not indicative of physical development or having a team that just went 7-6 the year before, including embarrassed to an underwhelming Wisc team, thinking that was the “past“ so let’s wrassle, doesn’t help with mental development. Allowing guys dance on the sideline; like dance, dance, while losing, is not indicative of emotional development.

So that’s what I mean by player development; guys coming from Program A v. Program B has no relevance to what’s going on or not going on at Miami for the past decade & a half.
 
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