PSA: Butch Davis was 0-7 vs Tom O'Brien and Al Groh at UNC

[UMFarArcher]

Two words... Ad nauseum.....

Yea, you're probably one of the 'new' fans that came around during that 2001 NC team Butch built. Seems you don't appreciate what he did for this program.

Then that would probably make me a butch fan....So, your point is?


For the record. I'm all for hiring butch. But when every other thread is stuff that every Canes fan already knows it gets tiring.

There is a DocU dedicated to the man for christs sake. Leave it alone. The debate is repetitive AF. Repeating the same retired info.

The title of the thread had Butch Davis in it.

If you are tired of hearing about Butch Davis, why didn't you just skip over it?

 

[Andrew]

There is some good news for all the BBB circle jerk crew: Butch was 1-0 vs Mike London at UNC.

Please quit bein a fvckin p*ssy .. BBB

15-17 in ACC games, 0-7 vs Tom O'Brien and Al Groh.

Butch had a team decimated by the loss of 30 scholly's while on a devastating probation.
This comparing his record against certain coaches is rediculous
All we care about is the end product
At NC he took over a losing team and the suspensions may have deprived him of a championship run.
At Miami we know the end result.

this

 

[Canezum5]

Two words... Ad nauseum.....

Yea, you're probably one of the 'new' fans that came around during that 2001 NC team Butch built. Seems you don't appreciate what he did for this program.

Then that would probably make me a butch fan....So, your point is?


For the record. I'm all for hiring butch. But when every other thread is stuff that every Canes fan already knows it gets tiring.

There is a DocU dedicated to the man for christs sake. Leave it alone. The debate is repetitive AF. Repeating the same retired info.

The title of the thread had Butch Davis in it.

If you are tired of hearing about Butch Davis, why didn't you just skip over it?

The same reason a person can see the last three threads are about butch Davis.. and still make a post Repeating the same info....

 

[ProjectMKUltra5]

Negged cause of your weak *** name

 

[UMFarArcher]

There is some good news for all the BBB circle jerk crew: Butch was 1-0 vs Mike London at UNC.

Please quit bein a fvckin p*ssy .. BBB

15-17 in ACC games, 0-7 vs Tom O'Brien and Al Groh.

Butch had a team decimated by the loss of 30 scholly's while on a devastating probation.
This comparing his record against certain coaches is rediculous
All we care about is the end product
At NC he took over a losing team and the suspensions may have deprived him of a championship run.
At Miami we know the end result.

this

THIS.

 

[prinmemo]

LOL at the Butch cult comparing the abortion Harbaugh took over at Stanford to what their leader inherited at UNC. Not even close.

Remember when Harbaugh took a team of misfits who were 40 point underdogs to USC and beat Pete Carroll with the immortal Tavika Pritchard as his QB? Of course you don't because you didn't see it. That might still be the biggest upset in college football history.

When's the last time a Butch Davis led team overachieved like that? Never. Never even came close. That gave everyone who was watching a pretty good idea of what Harbaugh was going to do at Stanford.

Brush up on your history a little instead of regurgitating numbers you find through Google. Watch the games. Soak it in. Learn. Quit making asinine comparisons like Butch Davis to Jim Harbaugh.

Didn't Butch beat UCLA in 1998?

 

[Gatorhater]

Howard save the program against a backdrop of no expectations. Butch saved it again, but being measured against greatness.

 

[Ray Ciss]

Howard save the program against a backdrop of no expectations. Butch saved it again, but being measured against greatness.

Good point....yet he was still up to the challenge.

 

[FullyERicht]

Two words... Ad nauseum.....

Yea, you're probably one of the 'new' fans that came around during that 2001 NC team Butch built. Seems you don't appreciate what he did for this program.

Actually it's the BBB folks that seem to be the new fans. Its like they can't fathom that this program used to hire great coaches that weren't named Butch.

To these people they had no idea we used to hire NFL Head coaches, and guys from other P5 schools.

 

[The Franchise]

LOL at the Butch cult comparing the abortion Harbaugh took over at Stanford to what their leader inherited at UNC. Not even close.

Remember when Harbaugh took a team of misfits who were 40 point underdogs to USC and beat Pete Carroll with the immortal Tavika Pritchard as his QB? Of course you don't because you didn't see it. That might still be the biggest upset in college football history.

When's the last time a Butch Davis led team overachieved like that? Never. Never even came close. That gave everyone who was watching a pretty good idea of what Harbaugh was going to do at Stanford.

Brush up on your history a little instead of regurgitating numbers you find through Google. Watch the games. Soak it in. Learn. Quit making asinine comparisons like Butch Davis to Jim Harbaugh.

Didn't Butch beat UCLA in 1998?

That's really nothing at all like beating a 41 point favorite. UCLA was a 9 point favorite over us.

That 41 point spread was the biggest point spread EVER overcome in the history of college football.

 

[Ray Ciss]

Two words... Ad nauseum.....

Yea, you're probably one of the 'new' fans that came around during that 2001 NC team Butch built. Seems you don't appreciate what he did for this program.

Actually it's the BBB folks that seem to be the new fans. Its like they can't fathom that this program used to hire great coaches that weren't named Butch.

LOL, the only truly great prior coach was Jimmy Johnson and Butch worked for him.

 

[FullyERicht]

Two words... Ad nauseum.....

Yea, you're probably one of the 'new' fans that came around during that 2001 NC team Butch built. Seems you don't appreciate what he did for this program.

Actually it's the BBB folks that seem to be the new fans. Its like they can't fathom that this program used to hire great coaches that weren't named Butch.

LOL, the only truly great prior coach was Jimmy Johnson and Butch worked for him.

Case and point right here. Case and ******* point. Bet you never ever heard of this guy named Howard.

 

[Ray Ciss]

Two words... Ad nauseum.....

Yea, you're probably one of the 'new' fans that came around during that 2001 NC team Butch built. Seems you don't appreciate what he did for this program.

Actually it's the BBB folks that seem to be the new fans. Its like they can't fathom that this program used to hire great coaches that weren't named Butch.

LOL, the only truly great prior coach was Jimmy Johnson and Butch worked for him.

Case and point right here. Case and ******* point. Bet you never ever heard of this guy named Howard.

Howard was not a great coach, neither was Ericson. Howard was the beneficiary of tapping into SFla talent when college football was generally geared toward big, slow, cornfed boys running the option. Ericson was handed the keys to Jimmy's Ferrari, although he did a decent job maintaining it.

 

[Ray Ciss]

Negged cause of your weak *** name

It's a joke, everything is 'racist' these days, and I'm frankly tired of it. So rather than defending myself when some moron says I'm a racist because of this or that I wear is as a badge of honor. Besides, EVERYONE has racial biases, but most are too frightened to admit it. For instance, I bet the 'enlightened' Frenchies now have some bias against the 'Mooslims' in their country.

 

[prinmemo]

LOL at the Butch cult comparing the abortion Harbaugh took over at Stanford to what their leader inherited at UNC. Not even close.

Remember when Harbaugh took a team of misfits who were 40 point underdogs to USC and beat Pete Carroll with the immortal Tavika Pritchard as his QB? Of course you don't because you didn't see it. That might still be the biggest upset in college football history.

When's the last time a Butch Davis led team overachieved like that? Never. Never even came close. That gave everyone who was watching a pretty good idea of what Harbaugh was going to do at Stanford.

Brush up on your history a little instead of regurgitating numbers you find through Google. Watch the games. Soak it in. Learn. Quit making asinine comparisons like Butch Davis to Jim Harbaugh.

Didn't Butch beat UCLA in 1998?

That's really nothing at all like beating a 41 point favorite. UCLA was a 9 point favorite over us.

That 41 point spread was the biggest point spread EVER overcome in the history of college football.

Fair enough. That's one game, though. Flukes happen.

Bottom line is that I would take Harbaugh over Butch right now, but I would take Butch over 90% of the names floated out there. There are some home run hires (Patterson, Gundy, etc), but once we move away from them I would take Butch over any of them.

These debates are becoming very juvenile. And people on both sides (but more on the anti Butch side) are dishing out random facts out of context and acting like those are deal killers.

The best approach is to evaluate each coach's body of work. Butch's strengths include player evaluation and development. His weaknesses include game day adjustments. Overall, I feel pretty sure that if he had stayed at the U, stayed at UNC without sanctions, or arrived at the U without sanctions, he would have won multiple titles at Miami and played in a BCS bowl or two at UNC. To me, that is a high ceiling. Certainly, much better than the last three guys we've had!

Can he do it now? Who knows for sure, but I am confident he would have us competing for ACC championships by year 2 (maybe 1).

What is totally ridiculous to me is to compare Butch to Golden, Shannon, Coker, Mario, or Strong. I mean, please. Those turds are bottom 10% of CFB coaches. It is ridiculous, actually downright idiotic to make a claim like that, but some people are doing it.

 

[poncho0091]

Falling on deaf ears eh? I'm not talking about ancient history, everything I talk about is Botch's last stop.

You talked about suspensions at UNC, please list who was missed and for how many games. I know the numbers and it isn't enough to excuse away the entire year at 8-5. Lost his entire team? Jesus, it's unbelievable the length some will go to defending a ****** game day coach.

Yes, Stanford is a good school with real elevated admission standards for student athletes. UNC is a good school who doesn't have higher admission standards than the rest of division one. So what was your point here? There is no comparison at all other than both are quality academic institutions, but that's where the comparison ends.

Harbaugh at Stanford as a coach had a bit less experience as a coach, let alone a head coach. He had real academic standards, not the NCAA minimum stuff basically the rest of the schools use. He was still learning on the job at this level, Botch should've known at this point.

The less experienced head coach managed to get above .500 in conference his third year, something Botch never managed to do. That same year, one started out ranked at #20 (obviously someone expected something out of them) and the other didn't.

The less experienced head coach managed to finish second in his entire conference his third year while Botch never finished better than tied for third in his division. Yup, division....not the entire conference.

The talent in California is most certainly better than either of the Carolina's. Having said that, without even looking, I'd bet UNC had more people drafted than Stanford. Since that is true, what's their location have to do with anything?

History, Stanford has more? They've sucked forever and their big claim to fame I'd suppose was playing Notre Dame and Bill Walsh.

Stanford, the 50 years prior to Harbaugh arriving had four nine win seasons. They had one ten win season during that time. UNC trumps that on every level with far more success during the same span of time.

So basically I'm failing to understand how your comparison helps support Davis in any way. Harbaugh is a good coach, no question....that we can agree upon.

You claimed you dismantled the comparison, but I don't see how. I never posted that UNC was higher than Stanford. I just said they were both schools with strong academic standards.

14 players were suspended - 7 for 1 game, 7 for the season (3 of which were drafted in the first 2 rounds and a 4th in the 4th round without playing that season, which always leads to draft stock falling). Is that the whole team? No. It was likely enough for the LSU game (14 players). That's likely enough for the 4 point loss to NC ST and the 6 point loss to GT. If you don't believe missing that many players is an impact, you are blinded.

It's hilarious that you say Harbaugh was still learning at this level, so he gets a pass, but when Butch was "still learning" at this level while facing 30 scholarship reductions, he does not get a pass. BTW, Harbaugh was on his second HC position. Butch was on his first.

Butch in his 3rd year was in the heart of his sanctions at Miami. At UNC he disappointed. Fair enough. So out of 2 shots he did not have a greater than .500 conference record. Let's not act like Harbaugh dominated the conference and he also lost some he should not have, and I say this with Harbaugh in my top 3 favorite coaches in the game today.

Stanford does in fact have more history. They have 2 championship claims vs 0, more conference titles (14-9), more division titles, more all americans (34-14), more HOF players (3-2), more Heismans (1-0), more draft picks (241-215). They were both garbage when each coach took over. Even in recent history, Stanford won the conference in the 1999 while UNC had not won since 1980.

You laughably point out Stanford had only 4 - 9 win seasons and 1 - 10 win season for 50 years prior to Harbaugh and how UNC had trumped that on every level, but I don't see how 9 - 9 win seasons (6 of those as 10 wins) is trumped on every level. Poor job. 5 more 9+ win seasons over a 50 year period is supposed to be significant?

You're failing to understand, because you're ignoring the facts or only using the ones you want. I don't know why you feel the need to discredit Butch, especially against me. I'm defending "stats", because half of the information is being stated without context. That was the only reason for the Harbaugh comparison. It was to prove that stats without context are meaningless. If I tell you coach A went 10-0 and coach B went 7-3 without telling you coach A was a high school coach vs Coach B at DI, coach A looks great. Context tells the story though.

I'm not running around here saying Butch the god or anything ridiculous. I'm a big Butch fan and understand he could fail, but so could all the rest. At least Butch has already done it, and he did it here.

 

[poncho0091]

Butch doesn't get any pass. The reason your post as well as the rest of the anti Butch crowd are failing is you are posting stats out of context. You act like Butch taking over a 3 win team or playing with 30 less scholarships or having a loaded roster suspended for his 4th year is the same thing as taking over a championship team or even on par with taking over some team that won 8 or 9 games the prior year. Until you guys get that, your points are worthless.

Let me ask you what your thoughts are on Harbaugh. IMO, he's a great coach and I'd love to have him be the coach of any team I root for, including the pros. Did you know that Butch's record in his first 3 years at UNC are better than Harbaugh's at Standford? This is a reasonable comparison. Both took over programs at schools with high academic standards, both took programs that were very bad, both even started in the same year. The only difference is Cali is far more fertile than UNC, Standford has more history than UNC in football, and Harbaugh didn't lose his entire team in his 4th year.

Let's play this game Harbaugh 17-20 in 3 years vs Butch 20-18. By your guy's reasoning Harbaugh is trash as well. Year 4 was a huge difference and you're trying to compare Butch in year 4 with his hands tied.

It's not that there are not reasonable Butch supporting posts, it's that the anti Butch crowd is acting the fool right now and ignoring the reasonable posts and ignoring context.

Harbaugh:
Year 1: 4-8
Year 2: 5-7
Year 3: 8-5
Year 4: 12-1 (no suspensions)

Butch:
Year 1: 4-8
Year 2: 8-5
Year 3: 8-5
Year 4: 8-5 (with multiple NFL talent players suspended)

did you miss the last few years' worth of news about unc's academic standards for athletes? and even without those issues, the two schools are not comparable on academic merit. stanford is miles ahead of unc.

also, it's "stanford," not "standford."

I'm typing from my phone tool, but thanks for trying to smart.

you're typing from your phone and still got it wrong twice. autocorrect wouldn't spell it like that. you're just an idiot.

The old auto-correct excuse. I'm not an idiot; it's my phone!

Considering Standford is a real place and there is also a Standford University, it shows you are an idiot. If you're that stupid to believe I got them mixed up, then please continue. Nature will take care of itself.

 

[Hurricane23]

While I agree on Butch being the coach, the last time he was here it was a different era of cfb, not saying he can't succeed I'd like to see.

 

[deleted3746]

I expected better personal attacks from the BBB crew.

With Miami talent and ranked Miami football teams, Butch went 0-2 vs East Carolina.

 

[deleted3746]

So Butch was 0-2 vs Steve Logan and ECU at Miami.

BBB crew stays shook.