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oxbridge scrimmage

Chise, my comment was not anything about what other schools offered. If you follow recruiting, and I think you do, you know that people were VERY passionate that we offer and "go get" Knowles. He was being dubbed as a SoFla gem by all the sofla nut huggers in the recruiting section. The guys who think because of where a guy comes from must mean he is good or not. I agree there is a ton of talent in sofla, and it needs to be gotten, but the blatant bias is a bit much at times.
 
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frostycane said:
Chise, my comment was not anything about what other schools offered. If you follow recruiting, and I think you do, you know that people were VERY passionate that we offer and "go get" Knowles. He was being dubbed as a SoFla gem by all the sofla nut huggers in the recruiting section. The guys who think because of where a guy comes from must mean he is good or not. I agree there is a ton of talent in sofla, and it needs to be gotten, but the blatant bias is a bit much at times.
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My main concern with Knowles is that no one wanted him. It's tough to hide in South Florida. He might shock the world, but, generally speaking, you're not going to win NCs stealing too many recruits from FIU.

So far, he's proven he has Vince Testaverde's number. Testaverde has his dad's brain and his mom's size and arm.
 
For sure. However, you cannot deny that there was a LOT of clamoring for us to take that kid when he was coming out. Basically just because he is from SoFla.
 
frostycane said:
For sure. However, you cannot deny that there was a LOT of clamoring for us to take that kid when he was coming out. Basically just because he is from SoFla.
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I gave up on following recruiting at the end of the Folden era because it was meaningless who we brought in as long as Folden was here. But I'm sure you're right about the "every South Florida player is great" crew.
 
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The Franchise said:
My main concern with Knowles is that no one wanted him. It's tough to hide in South Florida. He might shock the world, but, generally speaking, you're not going to win NCs stealing too many recruits from FIU.
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Underrecruited South Florida kids tear it up every season. We know the names and we watch them on Sundays. It still happens regularly because there are just too many players. Just this year, you had Brandon Doughty and Daniel Braverman putting up huge numbers at smaller D1 schools. You won't win an NC relying exclusively on those guys, but they provide valuable depth when you are building up a program. That's the kind of depth we lack.

frostycane said:
Chise, my comment was not anything about what other schools offered. If you follow recruiting, and I think you do, you know that people were VERY passionate that we offer and "go get" Knowles. He was being dubbed as a SoFla gem by all the sofla nut huggers in the recruiting section. The guys who think because of where a guy comes from must mean he is good or not. I agree there is a ton of talent in sofla, and it needs to be gotten, but the blatant bias is a bit much at times.
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I'd say the South Florida truthers have a pretty good track record. In 2013, we cried for Skai Moore and killed the staff for botching Denver Kirkland. In 2014, we ripped the staff's DB recruiting and begged them to offer Quincy Wilson, Juwon Dowels and Deatrick Nichols. I was personally very vocal about building the offensive line class in South Florida and said that we should offer Reggie Bain and A'lique Terry. We also suggested offering Isiah McKenzie and Reshad Fenton to bring some explosiveness to special teams.

Imagine if we had signed those guys. Moore and Kirkland became stars. Wilson is a very good corner at Florida. Dowels starts and Nichols is all conference. Bain and Terry were Day One starters, and Bain was a first-team Freshman All-American. McKenzie and Fenton are returning kicks for touchdowns while our guys trip over their feet.

There are good players everywhere. But there are more good ones here than anywhere else, and they are the easiest to get.
 
Those were the easy ones D. they were all 4 star players. Thats like saying hey we should have gotten Alex Collins and Matthew Thomas... Yeah those were the obvious guys. I believe we had a few good dudes committed when we passed on Wilson. And in general people were fairly split on him. Same with Dowels. I believe even you were not super high on Wilson if I recall. My point was just that now that we have Knowles he is a JAG but when he was being recruited he was a SoFla star that we were going to miss on. As with anything, the truths are wrong as often as right. They just like to remember the ones they were right on. I don't care one way or another, I want to see the team do well. And they guys we have taken a chance on have not panned out.
 
frostycane said:
Those were the easy ones D. they were all 4 star players. Thats like saying hey we should have gotten Alex Collins and Matthew Thomas... Yeah those were the obvious guys. I believe we had a few good dudes committed when we passed on Wilson. And in general people were fairly split on him. Same with Dowels. I believe even you were not super high on Wilson if I recall. My point was just that now that we have Knowles he is a JAG but when he was being recruited he was a SoFla star that we were going to miss on. As with anything, the truths are wrong as often as right. They just like to remember the ones they were right on. I don't care one way or another, I want to see the team do well. And they guys we have taken a chance on have not panned out.
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Yeah. Pointing to a bunch of 4 star guys that wound up at SEC schools isn't the same thing as talking about stealing a guy like Knowles from FIU.
 
And there are lots more. Guys like to throw around names like Khalil Mack, or TY Hilton, but there are ten dudes with the same ranking as them who go on to do virtually nothing. Its whatever as far as I am concerned. Heck, lets throw Choc into that mix of sofla guys we HAD to have. I just do not see him contributing here... **** I am pretty sure there was a ten page plus thread just on him getting admitted. He was just a guy we HAD to have.....
 
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The Franchise said:
frostycane said:
Those were the easy ones D. they were all 4 star players. Thats like saying hey we should have gotten Alex Collins and Matthew Thomas... Yeah those were the obvious guys. I believe we had a few good dudes committed when we passed on Wilson. And in general people were fairly split on him. Same with Dowels. I believe even you were not super high on Wilson if I recall. My point was just that now that we have Knowles he is a JAG but when he was being recruited he was a SoFla star that we were going to miss on. As with anything, the truths are wrong as often as right. They just like to remember the ones they were right on. I don't care one way or another, I want to see the team do well. And they guys we have taken a chance on have not panned out.
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Yeah. Pointing to a bunch of 4 star guys that wound up at SEC schools isn't the same thing as talking about stealing a guy like Knowles from FIU.
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Of the nine guys I listed, seven of them were 3* or below.
 
DMoney said:
The Franchise said:
frostycane said:
Those were the easy ones D. they were all 4 star players. Thats like saying hey we should have gotten Alex Collins and Matthew Thomas... Yeah those were the obvious guys. I believe we had a few good dudes committed when we passed on Wilson. And in general people were fairly split on him. Same with Dowels. I believe even you were not super high on Wilson if I recall. My point was just that now that we have Knowles he is a JAG but when he was being recruited he was a SoFla star that we were going to miss on. As with anything, the truths are wrong as often as right. They just like to remember the ones they were right on. I don't care one way or another, I want to see the team do well. And they guys we have taken a chance on have not panned out.
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Yeah. Pointing to a bunch of 4 star guys that wound up at SEC schools isn't the same thing as talking about stealing a guy like Knowles from FIU.
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Of the nine guys I listed, seven of them were 3* or below.
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Many of the guys you mentioned were fairly highly recruited guys. And several of them wound up at SEC schools that play pretty good football.

Knowles was more lightly offered than pretty much everyone you mentioned.
 
D were you or weren't you one of the "truthers" saying Knowles was a take? Yet now he's raw, and probably a jag. I actually have high hopes for the guy. I don't expect every guy to be the man by the time he's a soph.

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frostycane said:
D were you or weren't you one of the "truthers" saying Knowles was a take? Yet now he's raw, and probably a jag. I actually have high hopes for the guy. I don't expect every guy to be the man by the time he's a soph.

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I'm the biggest Knowles fan around. I advocated for the take and think it was the right decision. There are others who think he is a JAG. I'm not one of them.

He is improving every day and showed his playmaking instincts in the scrimmage. He came in raw from Edison (a program without much resources) and his best football is in front of him.
 
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That's what I thought. See I'm a fan of him. I just thought it was funny how many have dubbed him a jag, yet as a recruit he was sought after. He was definitely a playmaker. I'm not against taking a guy regardless of stars. But I'm ok if the guy is not from sofla too. I think the problem has been we have missed too many big fish. Too many Cool, Collins, Peterson/Johnson. I feel like the past teams suffered the same country club feeling. I honestly place that on the one thing that was the same from all those head coaches. That's swasey. I'm glad he is gone. I honestly think him being a holdover was toxic. Not that he's a bad guy, or even bad at his job. But we needed to move on from him.

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DMoney said:
frostycane said:
D were you or weren't you one of the "truthers" saying Knowles was a take? Yet now he's raw, and probably a jag. I actually have high hopes for the guy. I don't expect every guy to be the man by the time he's a soph.

Sent from my LGUS990 using Tapatalk
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I'm the biggest Knowles fan around. I advocated for the take and think it was the right decision. There are others who think he is a JAG. I'm not one of them.

He is improving every day and showed his playmaking instincts in the scrimmage. He came in raw from Edison (a program without much resources) and his best football is in front of him.
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Right there with you, [MENTION=2]DMoney[/MENTION]. His highlight tape from HS screams baller to me. He's a kid who gets it. He was able to be very successful at Edison without having much structure in pretty much any regard. I wonder what his off-season training and diet was like.

We had a coach from K-State (now former coach at K-State) come to recruit some a few of our guys. The conversation over dinner was about what makes South Florida recruits so good. One of the biggest points he wanted to hammer home was the fact that many of these kids from tough areas are "raised on vending machines." Many of their meals consist of strictly vending machine snacks like potato chips and cinnamon buns. One round though a major D1 diet, strength and conditioning program and their bodies really flourish. It's almost like their bodies are primed to soak up the nutrition after all the years of below average nourishment.

A secondary point he wanted to make was that many of these kids from schools like Edison come ready and willing to learn. They are almost like blank slates. They pay their dues in the program and they are complete football players by the end of their careers. That's why you see schools like K-State playing with so many 5th year seniors. It's part of their model of success.
 
However, those 5th yr seniors at Kstate are not from SoFla. These kids are showing up expecting to play as freshman, and have handlers that will publicly tear you apart if they do not flourish. I'm sure there are some kids like that, however they are not kids with a 4 or a 5 nest to their star rating. And lets look at Kstate, they are not winning any NC's with those guys either. It takes some elite players at a point. I completely get what your saying, I do not know if that is truly the case as much as it may have been in the past. Now with the 7v7 camps, school choice etc These kids are getting a great place to work out, they are in phenomenal shape at a very young age. I am not sure I completely agree with what your saying..
 
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frostycane said:
However, those 5th yr seniors at Kstate are not from SoFla. These kids are showing up expecting to play as freshman, and have handlers that will publicly tear you apart if they do not flourish. I'm sure there are some kids like that, however they are not kids with a 4 or a 5 nest to their star rating. And lets look at Kstate, they are not winning any NC's with those guys either. It takes some elite players at a point. I completely get what your saying, I do not know if that is truly the case as much as it may have been in the past. Now with the 7v7 camps, school choice etc These kids are getting a great place to work out, they are in phenomenal shape at a very young age. I am not sure I completely agree with what your saying..
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I was making a point about player development. That coach has been other places too, you know. He was in south florida to try and land some of those 1-3 star kids that fall through the cracks. What were Knowles's other offers? Not all kids are showing up and expecting to play. Not all south florida kids are 4 and 5 star players. We are talking about Robert Knowles and other kids like him. No one was ever talking about national championships. Only one team wins that per year. You can be successful and not win a NC.

A program like K-State has been successful despite having the odds severely against them. The point I was trying to make was that teams like K-State need to develop the vast majority of their team like I had stated previously. A team like Miami needs to develop the bottom half of their roster with players like Robert Knowles. South Florida is the area where we should be picking up those 1-3 star kids who have the attributes that I had previously stated.

You did not understand my point.

The emergence of these powerhouse programs has simply widened the learning curve between these kids. A kid like Knowles hasn't benefited from the infrastructure of a St. Thomas or Booker T. Kids like him have to take some time to catch up. They absolutely will catch up if they persist. 7 on 7 camps do next to nothing for strength and conditioning. Kids need to be in the weight room and need to be eating right before anything else. Again, we are talking about Robert Knowles and other kids who have not benefited from such infrastructure. We are not talking about kids who actually have benefited.
 
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