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X's and O's More of A Need: Dominating Safety or Shutdown Corner?

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Here's how the NFL voted (with its $$$) in 2023:

Franchise tag:​

  • Quarterback: $32.42MM
  • Running back: $10.1MM
  • Wide receiver: $19.74MM
  • Tight end: $11.36MM
  • Offensive linemen: $18.24MM
  • Defensive end: $19.73MM
  • Defensive tackle: $18.94MM
  • Linebacker: $20.93MM
  • Cornerback: $18.14MM
  • Safety: $14.46MM
  • Kicker/punter: $5.39MM

Transition tag:​

  • Quarterback: $29.5MM
  • Running back: $8.43MM
  • Wide receiver: $17.99MM
  • Tight end: $9.72MM
  • Offensive linemen: $16.66MM
  • Defensive end: $17.45MM
  • Defensive tackle: $16.1MM
  • Linebacker: $17.48MM
  • Cornerback: $15.79MM
  • Safety: $11.87MM
  • Kicker/punter: $4.87MM
 
Brooklyndee said:
Yet you see who the Seahawks found indispensable... you see who they got rid of before all the injuries kicked in. You see who the league was obsessed with. Kam tearing whole heads off and earl locking up the deep third. It was the safeties that made sherms job so easy and why you see how quickly he became less desirable when injuries kicked in with safeties. Look all around the league and think on those dominant shut down corners. How many of them are considered that without the safety help. Not many
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Seattle played nothing but Cover-1 and Cover-3...which means the CB's were on an outside island with zero help.
 
Kinda depends on what your primary coverage is... but...
For me, shutdown Corner all day.

Safeties can't help CB's all the time.
If you're in a 2-high structure and the offense sends the slot WR directly at the Safety, guess who's now on an island with the outside WR... YOUR CORNER.

If you have a duck at CB offenses will find a way to pick on him and there's not much you can do about it. (depending on formation)

On the flip side, if you have a shutdown CB that doesn't need help, it gives you flexibility with your Safeties.

I'm a Cover-3 Match guy. Best coverage in football if you have solid Corner play.

The lowest completed pass in football is the outside vertical. If you can get 2 long aggressive CB's out there, with additional help from the sidelines, there's practicality nowhere to go with the football.
By completely taking away that portion of the field, you force the offense to throw inside the hashes where you have FOUR underneath zone defenders playing an umbrella over TWO receivers.
 
I've always been a CBs > S person. I'd say non pass rushing LBs are the least valuable on the Defense unless they are ELITE, After would be SS, then FS, then CB. With DT and EDGE the clear top values. For me I'd rather have top CBs and average LB/S and have the safeties help the LBs more, rather than say have Average CB and LB and have elite safeties that have to help both. Being able to just trust a CB 1v1 vs a top WR is crazy impact. But I also think there is a point to saying like Ed Reed is more valuable to the defense than Darrelle Revis was... tough to call.

Top 10 Safeties Make $15.88M/yr.
Top 10 CBs Make $18.4M/yr.

Then again there is a pretty big difference between top 10 LT and top 10 RT and at this point it should be more accepted that there really is little to no difference between what the two should be worth, because the idea of a blindside isn't fully legit. A Right handed qb that takes a snap and looks to pass to the Left has his blind side to the right. And most teams are likely passing to left/right quite balanced.

I could see the argument that Safeties should be valued even more in CFB than the NFL though cause I think it's true they likely have a larger actual impact at this level. Ultimately the difference between NFL WRs and QBs is such a leap that an elite CB at the NFL level is easily more valuable, but at the CFB level you might only really play a couple elite WRs and/or QBs per year. The safety is going to have MORE impact on more plays. So in totality I can see why they'd be more valuable at this level.
 
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No_Fly_Zone said:
Here's how the NFL voted (with its $$$) in 2023:

Franchise tag:​

  • Quarterback: $32.42MM
  • Running back: $10.1MM
  • Wide receiver: $19.74MM
  • Tight end: $11.36MM
  • Offensive linemen: $18.24MM
  • Defensive end: $19.73MM
  • Defensive tackle: $18.94MM
  • Linebacker: $20.93MM
  • Cornerback: $18.14MM
  • Safety: $14.46MM
  • Kicker/punter: $5.39MM

Transition tag:​

  • Quarterback: $29.5MM
  • Running back: $8.43MM
  • Wide receiver: $17.99MM
  • Tight end: $9.72MM
  • Offensive linemen: $16.66MM
  • Defensive end: $17.45MM
  • Defensive tackle: $16.1MM
  • Linebacker: $17.48MM
  • Cornerback: $15.79MM
  • Safety: $11.87MM
  • Kicker/punter: $4.87MM
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I'm pretty sure LBs is including 34 OLBs here, cause aint no way an off ball lb is getting tagged for **** near half that lol.
 
Memnon said:
Richard Sherman was a Zone cover 4 Corner that could only play Boundary, he never traveled.

Of course he needed Safety help, he had limitations with his lack of speed & lateral footwork. What he was, was a big tall Zone Corner that fit perfect in Seattle's Defense for that time being, but once he lost his athleticism & got injured that was it for him.

Now look at Patrick Peterson; a freak athlete with elite Speed, size & Ball skills; He could travel all over the field covering the XWR, the Flanker or the Slot. He's still in the league right now because he wasn't confined to one side of the field & could actually move.

He didn't play with any top tier Safeties behind him, still had a HOF career, because he didn't need that help in order to cover down the field. He could rely on his own traits & skill set.

Same with Darrelle Revis; nobody remembers who his Safeties were, but everybody remembers Revis Island.
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I’m old enough to remember when he was named Patrick Johnson and committed to Miami… 80k later and a job for his old man and he was off to DBU and Death Valley
 
ghost2 said:
In Guidry's defense I'm gonna go against the grain a bit and say a dominant safety. Get a guy that can cover ground, play center field and also thump in the box when asked and he can mask a lot of weaknesses.

Put another way, on this defense I'd rather have Sean Taylor than Antrel Rolle. JMO.
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I’ll just take a safety that does his job and doesn’t constantly gamble
 
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Coach Macho said:
Seattle played nothing but Cover-1 and Cover-3...which means the CB's were on an outside island with zero help.
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Was gonna say when that first guy wrote Seattle played cover 4 I just assume typo until I kept reading. Cover3 was what they ran Cover 1. Earl Thomas made that Defense go. That man could cover so much ground
 
How do I say this... I had the very fortunate experience of witnessing Devin McCourty and Darrelle Revis and then later Stephon Gilmore. D-Mac is one of the underrated safeties in the past 30 years of this sport, people avoided throwing into his zone knowing he'll pick it if it's slightly off. The moment he was playing robber, you better not look his direction.

That being said, I'll take Revis and Gilmore, and therefore, the shutdown corner. If you can eliminate a top receiving option with one guy in todays game, it's such a huge advantage. Really good safeties elevate the play of the secondary, but only to such an extent. Shutdown corners basically eliminate one receiver and deconstruct gameplans.

And before anyone ***** on me for mentioning Gilmore, dude was the first DPOY as a CB in a decade in a timeline with Aaron Donald playing.
 
There are so many factors that could work their way into the optimal decision on this topic.

What defense do you run?
How often do you blitz?
What are the strengths of the offenses you will face?
Run stopping skill of DT, DE, & LB?
Pass rush skill of those same positions?
Pass coverage skill of MLB?
Current skill level of Nickel, CB, and S?
Are the scholarships of Lou Christobal and Isaiah Taylor holding us back from a portal WR1?

Generally speaking, if we have a good run stopping front 7, I’ll take the CB. If we have a good pass rushing front 7 I’ll take the safety. If we have both, it doesn’t really matter either way.
 
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Bender said:
How do I say this... I had the very fortunate experience of witnessing Devin McCourty and Darrelle Revis and then later Stephon Gilmore. D-Mac is one of the underrated safeties in the past 30 years of this sport, people avoided throwing into his zone knowing he'll pick it if it's slightly off. The moment he was playing robber, you better not look his direction.

That being said, I'll take Revis and Gilmore, and therefore, the shutdown corner. If you can eliminate a top receiving option with one guy in todays game, it's such a huge advantage. Really good safeties elevate the play of the secondary, but only to such an extent. Shutdown corners basically eliminate one receiver and deconstruct gameplans.

And before anyone ***** on me for mentioning Gilmore, dude was the first DPOY as a CB in a decade in a timeline with Aaron Donald playing.
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Gilly is the best corner of his era nobody should say **** lol
 
This is an interesting debate because to me its hard to say unless i know the actual player im picking lol

But im definitely picking cb if i had to choose who im building my defense around. Im a broncos fan so i have seen firsthand our defense go from good to great with a great corner. First with champ, then talib and chris harris jr now surtain jr
 
canes732 said:
Was gonna say when that first guy wrote Seattle played cover 4 I just assume typo until I kept reading. Cover3 was what they ran Cover 1. Earl Thomas made that Defense go. That man could cover so much ground
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I wasn't gonna keep responding in this thread cause it's pointless. Everyone has an opinion and they all valid. But @Coach Macho apparently thought he was teaching me something so I figured what the ****. I'm perfectly aware what they ran Macho. However no matter how it's worded a corner IS reliant on a safety at the very least consistently doing his job.as I said a lockdown corner has his most value when he's the final piece on a defense to take them over the top. When you have holes in your defense an offense simply schemes around your strengths.
 
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Brains said:
Safety is the more important position overall, but this team would benefit more from a corner.
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To build on this, I blieve the concept of a "shutdown" corner is grossly overused by our fans, and outdated in college football.

This is a team sport, and others' deficiancies are going to hinder a CB's ability to truly "shut down" his field.

Further, CB has become the "baseball" position of football, i.e., you have to accept that you're gonna lose your share of battles. That's the way it goes.

What really helps, though, is a CB who can at least SLOW DOWN the opposition, or make them alter their tactics. And if you get two of those guys, you're gravy.

As we often disagree, I will not that I agreed with @calinative umstudent 's earlier assessment.
 
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