Miami of old

Joined
Nov 15, 2017
Messages
10
#1
Am a lifelong Canes fan but am trying to get everyone's opinion. Been a long time since Miami dominated teams like they did in the 80s and early 2000s. What is it about those teams that is missing from Miami teams of the last 15 years? Back then they can pretty much do what they wanted against their opponent. Remembering the days of players such as Warren Sapp, Ed Reed, Jon Vilma, Ray Lewis, Jeremy Shockey, Frank Gore, Andre Johnson, Devin Hester, etc. Granted these are the best players from the U but why is it that a team like Alabama, year in and year out has that dominance that Miami used to possess? I would have thought by bringing in Mark Richt who was well respected at Georgia would have helped immensely with recruiting at Miami. I know Miami currently has a lot of talent but what is Nick Saban doing at Alabama that Richt can't do here? Are high school recruits just looking to play for teams such as Alabama who has an amazing winning tradition? What is lacking at Miami that these 5 star recruits aren't coming to the U? Do they need to build a stadium on campus? Is the fact that they have to play their games at Hard Rock a deterrent since it's so far away from campus? I would think you would want to come to Miami to build on the tradition of old and make them once again dominant. I'm just frustrated as to why it hasn't happened yet, it's been over 15 years since their last NC but then again they were robbed of another NC with that stupid pass interference call that wasn't against that team that I hate more than any other so I refuse to say their name. What will it take to get back to what they once were?
 
Joined
Apr 11, 2018
Messages
310
#2
1. Better OL
2. Much improved QB play
3. Get rid of the Golden guys
 
Joined
Jan 19, 2014
Messages
717
#3
Just my thoughts: Perhaps we are lacking momentum in wins at this point, which would help with stacking talent. Also, we have had reduced scholarships, just now getting back to full roster.
 
Joined
Oct 13, 2017
Messages
3,090
#4
 
Joined
Oct 16, 2017
Messages
1,020
#6
Two thoughts to your query:
1. The U did not get "all" the great players back in the day. Many went to various places (FSU, LSU, GA eat.) What did occur is
under Schnellenberger, Jimmy Johnson and Butch the talent evaluation was off the charts. Santana Moss, Ed Reed, Cortez
Kennedy, Russell Maryland, Ken Dorsey etc were not highly recruited but the talent evaluation made by the staff ... recruited
Diamonds.

2. When we were winning Championships ... we recruited Championship QB's. Further we had top notch coaching staffs,
especially under Jimmy J.
 

canefrank

Redshirt Freshman
Joined
Nov 26, 2011
Messages
675
#7
Ive been an attentive fan since the 70s and I will tell you in the 80s we got some key recruits but our classes were full of players that our coaches scouted based on athleticism, I remember the coaches looking for players that played BB and ran track. Lots of Miami-Dade (broward was not as good then) recruits in the 80s, 90s were committing to FSU and Florida. We lost tons of battles, we also won a few key recruits, but our classes were a mix of top recruits, equivalent of 4 and 5* stars today and a bunch of athletes with low ranking but could play. Moving Safeties to LB, LB to DE, DE to DT, etc. Our OL were a mix of players from PA, Canada and Florida mix with maybe one top recruit.

Now we had an Attitude that if you walked thru the doors at Miami, you automatically become a top player, the practices were intense and our coaching staff truly developed the kids. Players pushed each other and held their peers accountable. It was intense.
 

DTP

Section 102
Joined
Dec 30, 2015
Messages
3,503
#9
College football is not what it was in the 1980's. It would literally take me pages to explain every difference and why things aren't the same. One thing that never changes though is money. If you have it, you can buy a lot of shiny trophies.
 
Joined
Jul 21, 2016
Messages
2,231
#10
Good post, but the stadium is, if anything at this point, a benefit. What does playing on campus do for you, as a player?

More importantly I think kids have changed as much as the program has, kids want immediate playing time, exposure, and winning you can get that at a ton of schools now.
 
Joined
Jan 2, 2017
Messages
66
#12
College football is not what it was in the 1980's. It would literally take me pages to explain every difference and why things aren't the same. One thing that never changes though is money. If you have it, you can buy a lot of shiny trophies.
$$'s and Car dealerships......and restaurants.....I could go on...
The new Red shirt rule, will also make it's mark on College ball, as we know it today, compared to the 80's.
 
Joined
Jul 21, 2016
Messages
2,231
#13
Another thing is Bama is not going anywhere in the near future until they get caught. And before you say that's all sour grapes Tau's whole family relocated to Alabama shortly after he committed, supposedly his dad got a great job offer, how convenient, and wouldn't you know it his 5 star brother has committed to Bama as well.
FFS the Bama booster club just paid off Saban's house a while back. Have you even seen his house? I didn't even know they built houses like that in Alabama, it looks like a small resort.
 
Joined
Jan 20, 2013
Messages
8,944
#14
Am a lifelong Canes fan but am trying to get everyone's opinion. Been a long time since Miami dominated teams like they did in the 80s and early 2000s. What is it about those teams that is missing from Miami teams of the last 15 years? Back then they can pretty much do what they wanted against their opponent. Remembering the days of players such as Warren Sapp, Ed Reed, Jon Vilma, Ray Lewis, Jeremy Shockey, Frank Gore, Andre Johnson, Devin Hester, etc. Granted these are the best players from the U but why is it that a team like Alabama, year in and year out has that dominance that Miami used to possess? I would have thought by bringing in Mark Richt who was well respected at Georgia would have helped immensely with recruiting at Miami. I know Miami currently has a lot of talent but what is Nick Saban doing at Alabama that Richt can't do here? Are high school recruits just looking to play for teams such as Alabama who has an amazing winning tradition? What is lacking at Miami that these 5 star recruits aren't coming to the U? Do they need to build a stadium on campus? Is the fact that they have to play their games at Hard Rock a deterrent since it's so far away from campus? I would think you would want to come to Miami to build on the tradition of old and make them once again dominant. I'm just frustrated as to why it hasn't happened yet, it's been over 15 years since their last NC but then again they were robbed of another NC with that stupid pass interference call that wasn't against that team that I hate more than any other so I refuse to say their name. What will it take to get back to what they once were?
First off, we had a coach in shannon who wasn't ready and HATED recruiting. Then we had a guy in golden who preferred to play big 10 style football and recruit kids like him. He also spent more time making excuses and playing stupid games then fixing his coaching issues.
Saban has succeeded because a generation of kids grew up never seeing what agood miami teams looks like. they just know bama plus he has unlimited resources along with being a great coach.

btw, we were robbed out of multiple nc's.
 

3GC

Recruit
Joined
Oct 30, 2017
Messages
497
#16
Am a lifelong Canes fan but am trying to get everyone's opinion. Been a long time since Miami dominated teams like they did in the 80s and early 2000s. What is it about those teams that is missing from Miami teams of the last 15 years? Back then they can pretty much do what they wanted against their opponent. Remembering the days of players such as Warren Sapp, Ed Reed, Jon Vilma, Ray Lewis, Jeremy Shockey, Frank Gore, Andre Johnson, Devin Hester, etc. Granted these are the best players from the U but why is it that a team like Alabama, year in and year out has that dominance that Miami used to possess? I would have thought by bringing in Mark Richt who was well respected at Georgia would have helped immensely with recruiting at Miami. I know Miami currently has a lot of talent but what is Nick Saban doing at Alabama that Richt can't do here? Are high school recruits just looking to play for teams such as Alabama who has an amazing winning tradition? What is lacking at Miami that these 5 star recruits aren't coming to the U? Do they need to build a stadium on campus? Is the fact that they have to play their games at Hard Rock a deterrent since it's so far away from campus? I would think you would want to come to Miami to build on the tradition of old and make them once again dominant. I'm just frustrated as to why it hasn't happened yet, it's been over 15 years since their last NC but then again they were robbed of another NC with that stupid pass interference call that wasn't against that team that I hate more than any other so I refuse to say their name. What will it take to get back to what they once were?
The 80s teams had the benefit of more Legal practices than today.
Coaches, coaches & coaches.
When Bear Bryant retired, Bama was just another FB.
Same at OSU when Woody Hayes was fired, for Slugging an opposing player during a game....and so on.
When we had JJ, Erickson, & Schnell we caught lightning in a bottle..
 
Joined
Jun 19, 2013
Messages
3,439
#17
We were always one step ahead on of the rest of the cfb world on one side of the ball. Howard was doing pro-style before most. Jimmy had the 4-3. Erickson was doing crazy things with his offenses. Butch eval skills were maybe the best ever.
 

LPK2006

Redshirt Freshman
Joined
Oct 9, 2017
Messages
443
#18
Miami was going for speed at the time, at almost every position on the field. FSU, in its eternal quest to copycat Miami, was doing the same. The rest of college football looked slow and plodding by comparison. The speed advantage was very real back then. Obviously, the rest of college football eventually caught up to the point where even the worst ACC teams, for example, have plenty of burners. Terrible teams like UNC and Louisville have speed. Hell, FIU and FAU have speed. We do not have a decided speed advantage over the rest of college football simply by virtue of being Miami anymore. That kind of dominance won't be seen again.

To your other points, I think the recruiting is getting there. Is this not the most talented Miami team you've seen in well over a decade? I think that it is.

Beyond sheer speed, our best teams always had very disruptive defensive lines. Old Saint Bobby even said it himself, that you know Miami is "back" when our D is consistently getting in the backfield with the front 4. By that criterion alone, the team seems to be on the right track.
 

Ethnicsands

All-American
Joined
Nov 2, 2011
Messages
14,464
#20
Am a lifelong Canes fan but am trying to get everyone's opinion. Been a long time since Miami dominated teams like they did in the 80s and early 2000s. What is it about those teams that is missing from Miami teams of the last 15 years? Back then they can pretty much do what they wanted against their opponent. Remembering the days of players such as Warren Sapp, Ed Reed, Jon Vilma, Ray Lewis, Jeremy Shockey, Frank Gore, Andre Johnson, Devin Hester, etc. Granted these are the best players from the U but why is it that a team like Alabama, year in and year out has that dominance that Miami used to possess? I would have thought by bringing in Mark Richt who was well respected at Georgia would have helped immensely with recruiting at Miami. I know Miami currently has a lot of talent but what is Nick Saban doing at Alabama that Richt can't do here? Are high school recruits just looking to play for teams such as Alabama who has an amazing winning tradition? What is lacking at Miami that these 5 star recruits aren't coming to the U? Do they need to build a stadium on campus? Is the fact that they have to play their games at Hard Rock a deterrent since it's so far away from campus? I would think you would want to come to Miami to build on the tradition of old and make them once again dominant. I'm just frustrated as to why it hasn't happened yet, it's been over 15 years since their last NC but then again they were robbed of another NC with that stupid pass interference call that wasn't against that team that I hate more than any other so I refuse to say their name. What will it take to get back to what they once were?
You're skipping over a lot of logic to ask the question you do. Saban is perhaps the most successful college coach ever. What does he do that Coker couldn't do? That Shannon couldn't do? That Golden couldn't do? You seem to assume that Richt is somehow Saban level good. We should all hope the future proves your case, but the past doesn't.

The coaches who built greatness at Miami were top of their profession guys. Guys the pros coveted. Guys who were great talent evaluators (not just recruiters) -- with the exception of DE, who was good at winning with Jimmy's guys but didn't maintain the program despite being a terrific schematic innovator.

Richt is clearly better than the past three coaches we've had. But that doesn't mean he's going to rebuild a dynasty. That takes more than good. It takes great.

Things have changed, also. Word gets out. Camps and social and digital media and the Internet and now all the best local kids know what they can get elsewhere, and the best national teams know what they can get in So Fla. So it's not easy to hang onto all those guys, or even most of them. If we win enough, then it will get easier. Until you can say that the right decision for local kids is to stay home, you can't really complain about them not doing so. As fans, we want that. But if you're Amari Cooper, do you regret going to Alabama? For most of the past 15 years, the kids who left in many cases made reasonable decisions. Until we prove as a program that staying home is a great decision, we won't be back. And when we do, most kids will want to stay home. For all the reasons most kids everywhere do.
 
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