Manny basically has a one year window

[Torocane]

My bad. It was hard to discern with all the people in this thread actually claiming rankings don't matter.

They matter.
But I also think that the class is a good class for where we are and the next step we need to take.
We need numbers and we have some really good pieces. Also very athletic class I think.
But I think that obviously to complete for NC we will eventually need to be at that recruiting level.

 

[OriginalGatorHater]

No one is arguing against needing blue chips. The arguement is it took time to build the team.

You were insinuating that Dabo was winning with a team full of 3 stars. When really he didn't win anything big until his team was loaded with 5 stars.

Regardless, there is a big difference between Clemson and us that you are forgetting. Dabo had bags. Manny doesn't. If Manny has a bunch of schitty seasons like Dabo there is no coming back unless he starts dropping bags.

 

[Ajcane8]

You are incorrect. We are at a 35% blue chip ratio. Also, 50% is the bare minimum needed to be considered elite. If you look at the 3 teams that have made the finals in the past 4 years their blue chip ratio is closer to 75%.

That’s just false man. 2016 Clem had 4 5* and right around 55% blue chips. By no means were they a recruiting juggernaut with all these stacked chips - that’s just a convenient narrative built after the fact.

What they are doing now is impressive/unprecedented (save the >50% bcr from their 19 class, just ignore that) - but acting like their blueprint can’t be followed is weak. Just takes the right guy under center.

 

[Tony Perps]

Everyone has a short window in a p5 school now a days. I understand the blue chip ratio and I’m not disputing it. But trying to compare what Meyer and saban did is a tall task for anyone.
Your asking Manny a first time head coach to beat out 3 schools that no one is beating on the trail.
Bama Clemson and uga have basically swallowed all the 5 star and elite kids the last few cycles from
Everyone. From what little I know it looks like we at least beat Kirby for Chaney and Rivers.
I know a lot of the dudes are 3 stars. But I just don’t think some of the dudes we have should be ranked that low. But at the very least we are adressing the depth situation that has been horrendous even when cmr was here. I posted that at least we will have practice with dudes who can play instead of with dudes who can’t crack an fcs squad. That was the reason I posted the 2008 class for bama. 32 kids who can play will do wonders for development and competition. Hopefully we put it together and for the 21 class we won’t have to wait for senior year evals for star bumps. But this is more than I expected considering what happened at the end of the season.

I’m not asking him to recruit better than clemson alabama or osu this year. That’s not realistic. But he needs to start recruiting like lsu, texas, oklahoma and those types of schools by the end of the year or else we will be stuck in the same cycle. Because having 2/3 of your class as 3* is fringe top 20

 

[Torocane]

You were insinuating that Dabo was winning with a team full of 3 stars. When really he didn't win anything big until his team was loaded with 5 stars.

Regardless, there is a big difference between Clemson and us that you are forgetting. Dabo had bags. Manny doesn't. If Manny has a bunch of schitty seasons like Dabo there is no coming back unless he starts dropping bags.

I think an important first step will be to consistently win the coastal. We should be that team.

 

[OriginalGatorHater]

That’s just false man. 2016 Clem had 4 5* and right around 55% blue chips. By no means were they a recruiting juggernaut with all these stacked chips - that’s just a convenient narrative built after the fact.

What they are doing now is impressive/unprecedented (save the >50% bcr from their 19 class, just ignore that) - but acting like their blueprint can’t be followed is weak. Just takes the right guy under center.

This is why I said "closer too" not exactly 75%. If you add up the NC Bama teams, NC UGA team, and the NC Clemson teams they are closer to 75% than 50%.

So pretty much what we got out of this is Clemson needed >50% BC ratio and an absolutely elite College QB to win the NC.

Clemson is going to feel the impact of that class last year. They are going to regret when those kids are seniors. Luckily for them they are making up for it with this class.

 

[OriginalGatorHater]

I think an important first step will be to consistently win the coastal. We should be that team.

I agree with that. I can see us being a Wisconsin type. Always winning a weak division with a sub 50% BC ratio squad. However, if we want to take that next step. We need to recruit better.

 

[raincane]

He also ended up having schitty seasons with those non elite classes. By the time he actually made the playoffs his team was stacked with 5 stars so that strengthens the point that you need blue chips to win big.

The sad truth is that UM will never be able to be a top 4 team. On some fluke we could end up in the playoffs in the future, but the fact is that we will never be able to recruit at the bag level. We have a lot more up to go from here, but there is a ceiling for non-bag teams

 

[Al da wiz 426]

Staff let’s go ahead and lock this up. Kid just wants attention.

 

[jw410]

Staff let’s go ahead and lock this up. Kid just wants attention.

She always wants attention

 

[Torocane]

I agree with that. I can see us being a Wisconsin type. Always winning a weak division with a sub 50% BC ratio squad. However, if we want to take that next step. We need to recruit better.

We haven't been that team. We haven't shown that we can consistantly win a weak division. Jesus we have only outright won it once. I think it there is a connection between showing a proven record that you can get to your conference championship every year and recruiting better.

 

[pacusmc]

That’s just false man. 2016 Clem had 4 5* and right around 55% blue chips. By no means were they a recruiting juggernaut with all these stacked chips - that’s just a convenient narrative built after the fact.

What they are doing now is impressive/unprecedented (save the >50% bcr from their 19 class, just ignore that) - but acting like their blueprint can’t be followed is weak. Just takes the right guy under center.

Clemson ain’t here without Watson. They had just enough talent and good enough coaching to win a natty with him. They land some 3 star QBs instead of him and they don’t win enough to make the playoffs. Look the stat sheets the years he was there. It’s just facts. Dude was throwing for 300 and running for over 100 on some games. If Enos is the goods we get a dude like that, we should make the playoffs with the talent we have. Your telling me our defense the last 2 years isn’t better than Oklahoma’s Swiss cheese?

 

[OriginalGatorHater]

We haven't been that team. We haven't shown that we can consistantly win a weak division. Jesus we have only outright won it once. I think it there is a connection between showing a proven record that you can get to your conference championship every year and recruiting better.

I agree 100%. Look at how good our class was when we won the Coastal.

 

[Ajcane8]

So pretty much what we got out of this is Clemson needed >50% BC ratio and an absolutely elite College QB to win the NC.

Yes. That’s exactly what I said. Thanks for agreeing.

 

[bobbydigius]

OP makes a valid point but our bigger picture problem hasn’t been recruiting, it’s been beating teams we should beat. Our recruiting has been meh, but we haven’t even been able to consistently live up to the rankings we have gotten. After a while this has made recruiting harder and harder for the program. We all thought that Richt could have at least gotten us to a consistent 9-10 win season but he **** the bed there last season.

Start dominating the Coastal, VT has been doing this with worse classes than we have gotten and I guarantee recruiting will improve. I do agree that Diaz has to win this season, as he has already been here for a while, so it’s not a new stop for him. We have way more talent than our entire division. He can’t win this year, he probably never wins.

 

[OriginalGatorHater]

Yes. That’s exactly what I said. Thanks for agreeing.

That is what I said originally as well. You were the one that popped in with what I said was false, even though it was 100% correct.

 

[Tony Perps]

Clemson ain’t here without Watson. They had just enough talent and good enough coaching to win a natty with him. They land some 3 star QBs instead of him and they don’t win enough to make the playoffs. Look the stat sheets the years he was there. It’s just facts. Dude was throwing for 300 and running for over 100 on some games. If Enos is the goods we get a dude like that, we should make the playoffs with the talent we have. Your telling me our defense the last 2 years isn’t better than Oklahoma’s Swiss cheese?

The “talent we have.” We have no superstars. We have FOUR first round picks over the last TEN years.

Our talent is not that great. Weve got some good players, and have underperformed, but we are no where close to these other teams. Which is because of our consistent recruiting failures.

 

[Tony Perps]

OP makes a valid point but our bigger picture problem hasn’t been recruiting, it’s been beating teams we should beat. Our recruiting has been meh, but we haven’t even been able to consistently live up to the rankings we have gotten. After a while this has made recruiting harder and harder for the program. We all thought that Richt could have at least gotten us to a consistent 9-10 win season but he **** the bed there last season.

Start dominating the Coastal, VT has been doing this with worse classes than we have gotten and I guarantee recruiting will improve. I do agree that Diaz has to win this season, as he has already been here for a while, so it’s not a new stop for him. We have way more talent than our entire division. He can’t win this year, he probably never wins.

Well that is kind of my point. Beat the teams we should beat, have a good season, and parlay that into better recruiting. That’s what needs to happen. The window is incredibly small. Basically a year because of last year’s nightmarish, depth killing class.

 

[jw410]

Are you unfamiliar with the rankings? Our class is almost filled, that is why we are ranked so highly. Once everyone else finishes up their classes we are going to drop like a ton of bricks.

I don't know if we finish with
Worsham
Walker
Denis
Neal
Brown
Whale NSD

That should keep us top 10. We will drop the lowest two or three guys. Happens every year. I just got a feeling we are going to have a good year. Hold me to it Gator.

 

[Ajcane8]

Clemson ain’t here without Watson. They had just enough talent and good enough coaching to win a natty with him. They land some 3 star QBs instead of him and they don’t win enough to make the playoffs. Look the stat sheets the years he was there. It’s just facts. Dude was throwing for 300 and running for over 100 on some games. If Enos is the goods we get a dude like that, we should make the playoffs with the talent we have. Your telling me our defense the last 2 years isn’t better than Oklahoma’s Swiss cheese?

For sure.

Hypothetically - if we switch Trevor Lawrence and the offensive staff at Clem for Richt/jorn/the donk and rosier/Perry, and everything else about both teams remains identical, which team goes 7-6?

Scheme and qb > “stacked chips”