Lil B

Fawk_U Haters

Junior
Joined
Jan 11, 2015
Messages
3,503
Bruh, you are only seeing half the issue. Our development is ****. Look at punting. We had to bring in a transfer punter so we could stop having -4 yard shanked punts. Kids being developed or not is only a small % of a reason why they might transfer.
Again, our best players were all transfers and yes they were already "that guy". Look at King, he was literally in the heisman race one year. Look at players like our ST players. Look at players like KJ Osborn. Yes, they were already that guy. Bubba bolden, Jaelan Philips, etc. All of our best players were transfers. Hopefully things start to look up with these new coaches.
The only player I can even think of in recent years that was developed here was Greg Rousseau.

But I don't take back my comments about Patke. I may like him as a person, but I don't feel like we have a good special teams, and if we do it is despite him, not due to him. Also again, the development issue is mainly across the board, not just ST. Just sayin that as a joke about Lil B.
So Jalean Phillips was already that guy when he transferred? You do know he was medically retired from football when he came to us right. that doesn't sound like "that guy."

Bubba Bolden played in the 3 games at USC and was not "that guy" when he came to us either.

I will agree with you about King, KJ, and Roche, but i will also say we developed QR2 into something he was not seen as before he came to MIami. He's getting a lot of looks at a 3-4 rush LB and we put those skills on tape for evaluators. he wasn't taught those at temple i don't believe.

I have a kid we've developed and had probably one of the best year over year performances in recent memory.....Zion Nelson. We've developed a lot of kids, but i guess unless they're first rounders then we didn't develop them according to you. I can think of more than a few players weve developed over the last couple of years that come to mind.
 

Fawk_U Haters

Junior
Joined
Jan 11, 2015
Messages
3,503
Your initial comment clearly took issue with his purported failure to "even take the time to ok it up." My comment was in response to that, demonstrating: (a) you guys are arguing over semi-finalist vs. finalist; and (b) if he looked it up on Google or Wikipedia, it would have told him Jose was a 2018 Groza Finalist.
But i did look it up on google, I just didn't go to Jose's page.
 

No_Fly_Zone

Not a scientist or engineer
Joined
Dec 28, 2016
Messages
4,872
I agree with the Perry comment. Bubbas prob was never leg he was a head case

On your second paragraph...my whole point is if Patke gets all the blame for the horrible 2019, then he should get the credit for 2020.

We both agree on the third paragraph

We can agree to disagree on the last paragraph. Our coverage units, minus 1 kick against NC state, in which we had 17 players not playing due to covid were good last year. Most of those 17 kids were on our kickoff units which meant our starters, who already were tired because their backups were out, had to play specials that game too. Hell out punt coverage was historically great.

As for punt return can you really blame Patke for the kid dropping the ball? I mean we could blame him if he continually trotted him out there, but he made the change. Then gurvan put the ball on the ground, then X put the ball on the ground. Do you blame the coach for the kids putting hte ball on the ground when they work on catching punts, ad nauseum, during practice?

I'm not blaming him for Baxa's poor kicking. I can't even blame him for recruiting Baxa (that was Hartley). For better or worse, he was stuck with Baxa. On the flip side of that coin, I'm also not going to give him credit for recruiting Hedley, though (also Hartley), and I'm going to give him only the tiniest bit of credit for recruiting Jose (I firmly believe the logo and the history it carries recruited Jose more than any coach).

On the point re: my previous last paragraph and our ST performance, to quote you earlier in this thread, "stats don't lie":

Here's where UM's return/coverage units ranked in 2020...
  • UM was ranked No. 121 out of No.127 in average punt return length;
  • UM was ranked No. 69 of 127 in punt return defense (would have been worse but for our stud punter);
  • UM was ranked No. 101 of 127 in kick return defense;
  • UM was ranked No. 60 of 127 in average kick return length.
As far as the COVID excuse, every team in America that played football dealt with COVID-19 and had players out. For better or worse, the rankings are what they are under an environment that all the schools dealt with.

And yes, I am going to blame Patke for nobody being able to field a punt. Of course there is hand/eye coordination involved, but that's a taught skill. The fact nobody could do it suggests we may have a problem teaching that skill. Agreed the kids all needed to put the work in and rep it to death, but he simply has to find a decent option back there (or turn somebody into a decent option). I view that as way more within his sphere of control/influence than teaching the technical aspects of kicking/punting.
 

r0fl_57omp7

Sophomore
Joined
Dec 4, 2018
Messages
574
So Jalean Phillips was already that guy when he transferred? You do know he was medically retired from football when he came to us right. that doesn't sound like "that guy."

Bubba Bolden played in the 3 games at USC and was not "that guy" when he came to us either.

I will agree with you about King, KJ, and Roche, but i will also say we developed QR2 into something he was not seen as before he came to MIami. He's getting a lot of looks at a 3-4 rush LB and we put those skills on tape for evaluators. he wasn't taught those at temple i don't believe.

I have a kid we've developed and had probably one of the best year over year performances in recent memory.....Zion Nelson. We've developed a lot of kids, but i guess unless they're first rounders then we didn't develop them according to you. I can think of more than a few players weve developed over the last couple of years that come to mind.
Yeah, that's exactly what I'm saying. He was literally the #1 recruit in his recruiting class. The #1 overall recruit. Let that sink in. Bolden was a big profile player as well. I cant speak to Pac 12 schools as I don't follow that pussy conference. Being medically retired and not already being good/having talent are 2 different things. Good on us for taking a risk, rehab'ing him and getting 1 good season of production out of him.
With the exceptions of a couple players like Asa Martin and Tate "literally who?" Martell, we've done extremely well in the portal and our best players have been out of it.

I agree Nelson is doing great. Maybe we developed him or maybe him getting fed to the wolves and getting a bunch of starting experience as a true freshman before even having time to get up to D1 level strength and conditioning had something to do with it. The point is that for every 1 player we develop we have way too many that don't. Not everyone is going to be great. Not everyone is going to the league, but boy it sure does seem like we waste talent sometimes.
 
Joined
Feb 7, 2013
Messages
23,089
Borregales actually had better stats as a Freshman at FIU than his Sophomore and Junior seasons. But nobody can seriously dispute that his best season was last year as a Cane. Hedly has also steadily improved his game.

That is all you needed to say. I was just referring to people using them as an example of no improvement.

The rest of it is pretty pedestrian or below average. I’m not defending special teams play.

Did special-teams cost us any games this year though? No. Not like in prior years. So that was a major improvement. Is there room for much greater improvement. Yes. Especially in the return game.

I’m not trying to defend nor condemn Patke, I’m just trying to provide context.

First rule in special teams, like medicine: first, do no harm. Special teams were killing us prior to this year. Now let’s improve the return game.
 
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