Josh Pate Mail Bag 10/25

[NJshoreCane]

Hey @Liberty City El, @crossover22[]_[], @FrancisSawyer, @BS85, @UMFarArcher …remember when the slurp crew were blaming the players (because Pepperidge Farm remembers)?

Now the narrative has changed to it’s the media’s fault because they hate Miami. Apparently it’s also the fans fault for not showing up in mass to see this atrocity of a corching staff as they butcher anything and everything scheme and play call related.

I’m here for the laughs! You can’t make this up.

I still haven't seen where anyone said we are where we are because of the media and fans.

 

[WestEndZone]

Lol, Manny Navarro playing dumb.

Josh Pate is talking about you, Manny — you ******* clown.

In gonna troll that fat fuuc

 

[WestEndZone]

Hey @Liberty City El, @crossover22[]_[], @FrancisSawyer, @BS85, @UMFarArcher …remember when the slurp crew were blaming the players (because Pepperidge Farm remembers)?

Now the narrative has changed to it’s the media’s fault because they hate Miami. Apparently it’s also the fans fault for not showing up in mass to see this atrocity of a corching staff as they butcher anything and everything scheme and play call related.

I’m here for the laughs! You can’t make this up.

I don’t think this is factually correct.

 

[Calinative]

its the same thing when Manny was here. its fine to get a spot starter or a guy who could push you over the top, but if youre depending on the portal to fill half the roster (obviously exaggerating) or making up for what your class lacks, its a failure.

Bro he hasn't even had one full ******* recruiting class yet, and already he's failed at building the roster? Yall are not using your entire brains.

 

[hoops156]

Bro he hasn't even had one full ******* recruiting class yet, and already he's failed at building the roster? Yall are not using your entire brains.

when did I say eh failed? I said something about use of transfer portal. I didnt say he failed at the roster. he hasn't even built his roster. good job though inferring what you want though

 

[Yoyo423]

Lol, Manny Navarro playing dumb.

Josh Pate is talking about you, Manny — you ******* clown.

There's a group of powerful people in Miami who were bypassed and basically thrown out of power when Manny and Blake were fired including the former mayor of the city and several BOT members. There's lots of people who want to see Mario fail. It wouldn't be surprising to see some of them feeding negative narratives to the media. Don't forget what happened during our coaching or AD search.

 

[Calinative]

when did I say eh failed? I said something about use of transfer portal. I didnt say he failed at the roster. he hasn't even built his roster. good job though inferring what you want though

"its already 1/3 Mario guys. it will be 2/3s by fall kick. I think if youre digging into the portal vs recruiting you failed to an extent"

"but if youre depending on the portal to fill half the roster (obviously exaggerating) or making up for what your class lacks, its a failure."

So this offseason when Mario has to use the transfer portal extensively, does that mean he failed? Pretty simple and logical inference.

 

[hoops156]

"its already 1/3 Mario guys. it will be 2/3s by fall kick. I think if youre digging into the portal vs recruiting you failed to an extent"

"but if youre depending on the portal to fill half the roster (obviously exaggerating) or making up for what your class lacks, its a failure."

So this offseason when Mario has to use the transfer portal extensively, does that mean he failed? Pretty simple and logical inference.

extensively? hes not bringing in 30 guys from the portal so no he wont fail there. hes gonna bring about 22 kids via class and prolly another 5-8 more portal kids to get you around 30 which is about what he brought in last year. that isnt filling half the roster. that just filling around the edges.

regarding this class, the weaknesses in it are there - WR in a loaded year, DB, DT, and RB. well see where the recruiting class ends there but if he doenst fill those spots up w young great talent, I think he would fail to fill the needs through recruiting regarding THIS class and he'd prolly tell you the same. its a good class but has weaknesses. I am not a fan of grabbing everyone from the portal bc you couldn't attract talent at the weaknesses. I think he portal is fine to fill around the edges or stop gap here or there. everyones opinions are different. I didnt like when Manny would overly rely on the portal either. I do trust Mario as a recruiter but I do not trust his OC/WR coach, his DB coach, and Joe (If he recruits the DTs).

 

[JG14]

@HurricanePhilly got excited thinking he was going to see a male bag when opening the thread

 

[FrancisSawyer]

The thing is, they weren’t sunshine pumpers. Lol.

The most “fans” that I witness say 10 win or bust, ACCCG or bust yr 1 weren’t objective, nor were they sunshine pumpers. They were fans who had their own agendas in either wanting Manny to remain here b/c “the guys played hard, so let‘a give him another year” or Lane Train fans. They never wanted Mario here; same ones were openly rooting against him while he was at UO. So for them, it’s vindication & I “told u so” high.

Most objective fans, would say this team would be an 8-9 win team, where we would see some growing pains. ****, even if u said 6-8 wins, that was still reasonable & objective.

@Rellyrell You're the man Rell. You know I mean that but I'm going to have to disagree with you here a bit. Now I agree that the dynamic you described above is something that does exist. There are guys on this board who fit that profile but where I disagree is in your assertion that the majority of the posters who thought we could be a 10 win team and thought that making the ACCCG was a very reachable goal fit that profile.

You know that fandom can be a very slippery slope in terms of maintaining objectivity. I would venture to say that a whole heck of a lot of posters here who had those expectations are genuine fans who mean well but got caught up in the high that comes with a coaching change. Not just any coaching change mind you but a change in AD and a sea change in the way the program is run. We decided to spend money. No just money but Clemson, Bama Ohio St type money and we brought in arguably the best staff we have ever had here(on paper anyway).

Fans see a team who went 7-5 last year with a young yet elite QB under a total clown of a coach under a clown AD . They see these changes in the program and are understandably excited. They figure with the portal additions, nearly the entire team coming back, TVD and the hiring of Mario coming off the success he had at Oregon and the star studded staff he put together that we definetely improve. Add in the schedule seeming soft and it's very easy to understand how myopia could set in.

I'll even admit that all the hype had me for awhile. There was a time during the off-season when I had actually allowed myself to believe that we had a 9-3/10-2 type ceiling for the regular season. I think we all know from personal experience how easy it is to get sucked into an orange and green echo chamber and let your imagination get away from you. Fandom is a serious drug. Its alluring it's seductive it's addicting but worst of all it's insidious in the way it gradually pushes you away from rationality and objectivity without you realizing it until reality slaps you down cold and hard.

Yep I admit I too drank the Kool aid but something I read here snapped me out of it and back to my senses. What I read was a post/thread by you. I can't recall the title and I haven't tried to search for it but I'm sure you know the one I mean. You posted it before the season began and you made some very good arguments for why the fan base shouldn't expect so much in year 1. You went into into from several angles. It was cogent, well reasoned, logical, articulate and informative.

Mario was not my first choice but I didn't have a problem with the hire as I knew that regardless of my opinion of his game day coaching ability, Cristobal possessed the necessary gravitas required to get the money flowing and to in essence completely rebuild the program from infrastructure on up at every level. In my view this was not only necessary but crucial in the process of getting this program back up to a nationally elite level.

Like many, I don't like what I have seen so far and despite the obvious rebuild going on here, Mario has made his share of mistakes. However, I will give Mario the same respect and amount of time to get this thing going as I have with every coach who preceded him and that's 3 years. Not 3 years to win the National Title but 3 years to build a rock solid foundation and start looking like a team that other teams want no part of.

 

[Calinative]

extensively? hes not bringing in 30 guys from the portal so no he wont fail there. hes gonna bring about 22 kids via class and prolly another 5-8 more portal kids to get you around 30 which is about what he brought in last year. that isnt filling half the roster. that just filling around the edges.

regarding this class, the weaknesses in it are there - WR in a loaded year, DB, DT, and RB. well see where the recruiting class ends there but if he doenst fill those spots up w young great talent, I think he would fail to fill the needs through recruiting regarding THIS class and he'd prolly tell you the same. its a good class but has weaknesses. I am not a fan of grabbing everyone from the portal bc you couldn't attract talent at the weaknesses. I think he portal is fine to fill around the edges or stop gap here or there. everyones opinions are different. I didnt like when Manny would overly rely on the portal either. I do trust Mario as a recruiter but I do not trust his OC/WR coach, his DB coach, and Joe (If he recruits the DTs).

"to get you around 30 which is about what he brought in last year"... See one of the issues is you are acting like last recruiting class was Marios. It wasn't - at least not close to fully.

And now after ONE recruiting class with Mario, next year if these True Freshman aren't starting and playing good, it's going to be - "Mario failed". But like he's had one year to build his roster. So again, the ONLY way the talent dramatically shifts by next year is if he extensively uses the portal (extensively doesn't have a number - doesn't mean it has to be as high as 30), and if he does that you literally are saying that is a failure. You can't have it both ways - using the portal is a failure, and building through recruiting is a failure - because we won't know those results for 2+ years.

Like do you not see how you are literally setting this up to say Mario is failing?

 

[Rellyrell]

@Rellyrell You're the man Rell. You know I mean that but I'm going to have to disagree with you here a bit. Now I agree that the dynamic you described above is something that does exist. There are guys on this board who fit that profile but where I disagree is in your assertion that the majority of the posters who thought we could be a 10 win team and thought that making the ACCCG was a very reachable goal fit that profile.

You know that fandom can be a very slippery slope in terms of maintaining objectivity. I would venture to say that a whole heck of a lot of posters here who had those expectations are genuine fans who mean well but got caught up in the high that comes with a coaching change. Not just any coaching change mind you but a change in AD and a sea change in the way the program is run. We decided to spend money. No just money but Clemson, Bama Ohio St type money and we brought in arguably the best staff we have ever had here(on paper anyway).

Fans see a team who went 7-5 last year with a young yet elite QB under a total clown of a coach under a clown AD . They see these changes in the program and are understandably excited. They figure with the portal additions, nearly the entire team coming back, TVD and the hiring of Mario coming off the success he had at Oregon and the star studded staff he put together that we definetely improve. Add in the schedule seeming soft and it's very easy to understand how myopia could set in.

I'll even admit that all the hype had me for awhile. There was a time during the off-season when I had actually allowed myself to believe that we had a 9-3/10-2 type ceiling for the regular season. I think we all know from personal experience how easy it is to get sucked into an orange and green echo chamber and let your imagination get away from you. Fandom is a serious drug. Its alluring it's seductive it's addicting but worst of all it's insidious in the way it gradually pushes you away from rationality and objectivity without you realizing it until reality slaps you down cold and hard.

Yep I admit I too drank the Kool aid but something I read here snapped me out of it and back to my senses. What I read was a post/thread by you. I can't recall the title and I haven't tried to search for it but I'm sure you know the one I mean. You posted it before the season began and you made some very good arguments for why the fan base shouldn't expect so much in year 1. You went into into from several angles. It was cogent, well reasoned, logical, articulate and informative.

Mario was not my first choice but I didn't have a problem with the hire as I knew that regardless of my opinion of his game day coaching ability, Cristobal possessed the necessary gravitas required to get the money flowing and to in essence completely rebuild the program from infrastructure on up at every level. In my view this was not only necessary but crucial in the process of getting this program back up to a nationally elite level.

Like many, I don't like what I have seen so far and despite the obvious rebuild going on here, Mario has made his share of mistakes. However, I will give Mario the same respect and amount of time to get this thing going as I have with every coach who preceded him and that's 3 years. Not 3 years to win the National Title but 3 years to build a rock solid foundation and start looking like a team that other teams want no part of.

That’s fair, & I guess I should’ve phrased my post better vs. out of shear irritation.

Mario was not my first choice; frankly I was hoping Hugh Freeze would get a shot. I also wished Urban would’ve been line 1. (Oh how I wish Urban would’ve been line 1. lol) However, there became this thick air where “some” fans were openly rooting against Mario, while at UO. To me, hiring Lane, Freeze, Urban, or Mario was OK w/ me, & truth be told, that OP I created would’ve been created for any of those coaches.

i get all that comes w/ being a fan. ****, I’m disappointed in this yr; I had us losing to A&M (road game in an Uber hostile environment), UNC , Clemson, & FSU (b/c I had them as an improved team 3 yrs in the same system). Losing to MTSU & Duke, nah…not on my radar. I knew we would have bumps, set backs, b/c I’m not in love w/ this roster & the Spring Game made me love it worst.

I guess it’s the particular fans that I’ve seen chime in the most & at times looks like they relish in the fact, not the University of Miami is struggling this year, but Mario is, simply b/c they didn’t want him here in the first place. What I’ve come to realize is that whether it’s consciously or subconsciously, but two guys that some segments of this fan base go to great lengths to discredit are Butch & Mario. Maybe it’s b/c how they both left, so maybe there’s still a hint of unresolved resentment, but go to any Butch or Mario thread & u’ll see some of the most lengthy debates.

My only thing was & still is, compartmentalize the frustration this season; stop saying a recruit shouldn’t come here & all this sabotage talk. This program needs a whole make over, and that includes some on the coaching staff. Hopefully we’ll finish out strong w/ a better record than last season.

 

[HurricanePhilly]

@HurricanePhilly got excited thinking he was going to see a male bag when opening the thread

 

[ItsAUThing.com]

Go re-read what you posted and the number of insults and then answer for yourself why the board has the potential to turn into a **** show…

Oh please. Calling out two decades of stupidity isn't the problem. If the stupid ceased to exist, there'd be nothing to call out.

Those of us who lived on Grassy's site back in the nineties—we endured probation and some really dark days of Hurricanes football—but it was processed, discussed and dealt with logically.

The wheels fell off this thing long ago and too many in this new-look fan base have lost their marbles.

They are the sh*t-show; not those of us calling it out and tired of the barrage of over-emotional daily sky-is-falling rants.

C'mon now.

 

[ItsAUThing.com]

I guess it’s the particular fans that I’ve seen chime in the most & at times looks like they relish in the fact, not the University of Miami is struggling this year, but Mario is, simply b/c they didn’t want him here in the first place. What I’ve come to realize is that whether it’s consciously or subconsciously, but two guys that some segments of this fan base go to great lengths to discredit are Butch & Mario. Maybe it’s b/c how they both left, so maybe there’s still a hint of unresolved resentment, but go to any Butch or Mario thread & u’ll see some of the most lengthy debates.

My only thing was & still is, compartmentalize the frustration this season; stop saying a recruit shouldn’t come here & all this sabotage talk. This program needs a whole make over, and that includes some on the coaching staff. Hopefully we’ll finish out strong w/ a better record than last season.

Yes. This.

The portion of this fan base pointing to the scoreboard, going "See??" regarding the Cristobal hire—half a year in—are the problem. Fact; there are countless people here who actually relish in Miami losing, so they can be "right" about Cristobal.

Either way, it's the first quarter regarding his hiring, so pointing to the scoreboard anytime before 2024-2025 is laughable. Let it play out and stop wasting energy on the conversation.

Same to be said for who could've been hired or other pipe dreams; like this narrative that Cristobal passed over Dorsey for Gattis—as if Kenny was ever coming back to Miami as OC this year, after spending years building his NFL coaching trajectory.

Miami has enough real on-the-field losses to absorb; people need to stop making up coaching losses that were never going to happen.

 

[hoops156]

"to get you around 30 which is about what he brought in last year"... See one of the issues is you are acting like last recruiting class was Marios. It wasn't - at least not close to fully.

And now after ONE recruiting class with Mario, next year if these True Freshman aren't starting and playing good, it's going to be - "Mario failed". But like he's had one year to build his roster. So again, the ONLY way the talent dramatically shifts by next year is if he extensively uses the portal (extensively doesn't have a number - doesn't mean it has to be as high as 30), and if he does that you literally are saying that is a failure. You can't have it both ways - using the portal is a failure, and building through recruiting is a failure - because we won't know those results for 2+ years.

Like do you not see how you are literally setting this up to say Mario is failing?

I agree the roster isnt Marios fault.

this is his first class. its a good class but there are obvious holes in this class (WR, RB, DT, DB). just like when richts classes lacked DBs (I think there was one that didnt even have a single DB), it fell on richt. the past is Manny and richt obviously bc they filled those classes and left roster holes. this class that will be finishing up is on Mario. again im talking about this specific class when I mean holes in it. when I mean roster holes, thats on the past regimes. Mario can't control what the old coaches did or didnt do. he can only mend it (which I think he did to an extent w the portal). ive just seen posters say we need 30 portal kids now which isnt realistic and also imo not a good way to build. Mario isnt on the clock so I think building through recruiting Classes and filling a spot here or there w the portal (when the right kid comes along) is a good way to build. just. my opinion. you dont have to agree and I dont want you to either lol. literally the whole point is if we have to use the portal to make up for what we didnt get in the recruiting cycle, yes somewhere something went wrong w this current cycle. example being if we fail to sign CJ at RB and dont bring any other HS back on board.

 

[JustAFanHTX]

The thing is, they weren’t sunshine pumpers. Lol.

The most “fans” that I witness say 10 win or bust, ACCCG or bust yr 1 weren’t objective, nor were they sunshine pumpers. They were fans who had their own agendas in either wanting Manny to remain here b/c “the guys played hard, so let‘a give him another year” or Lane Train fans. They never wanted Mario here; same ones were openly rooting against him while he was at UO. So for them, it’s vindication & I “told u so” high.

Most objective fans, would say this team would be an 8-9 win team, where we would see some growing pains. ****, even if u said 6-8 wins, that was still reasonable & objective.

No one on this site has ever called me objective so I have to disagree. They think I’m an undercover A&M fan. I said 8 wins is what I would be ecstatic with and i got a million downvotes

 

[hoops156]

That’s fair, & I guess I should’ve phrased my post better vs. out of shear irritation.

Mario was not my first choice; frankly I was hoping Hugh Freeze would get a shot. I also wished Urban would’ve been line 1. (Oh how I wish Urban would’ve been line 1. lol) However, there became this thick air where “some” fans were openly rooting against Mario, while at UO. To me, hiring Lane, Freeze, Urban, or Mario was OK w/ me, & truth be told, that OP I created would’ve been created for any of those coaches.

i get all that comes w/ being a fan. ****, I’m disappointed in this yr; I had us losing to A&M (road game in an Uber hostile environment), UNC , Clemson, & FSU (b/c I had them as an improved team 3 yrs in the same system). Losing to MTSU & Duke, nah…not on my radar. I knew we would have bumps, set backs, b/c I’m not in love w/ this roster & the Spring Game made me love it worst.

I guess it’s the particular fans that I’ve seen chime in the most & at times looks like they relish in the fact, not the University of Miami is struggling this year, but Mario is, simply b/c they didn’t want him here in the first place. What I’ve come to realize is that whether it’s consciously or subconsciously, but two guys that some segments of this fan base go to great lengths to discredit are Butch & Mario. Maybe it’s b/c how they both left, so maybe there’s still a hint of unresolved resentment, but go to any Butch or Mario thread & u’ll see some of the most lengthy debates.

My only thing was & still is, compartmentalize the frustration this season; stop saying a recruit shouldn’t come here & all this sabotage talk. This program needs a whole make over, and that includes some on the coaching staff. Hopefully we’ll finish out strong w/ a better record than last season.

this happens w every hire no matter the name. everyone will have their preferences. at the end of the day, people want to win. the expectations were higher bc Mario is supposed to be a better coach (He is a better coach) than the previous guy and at the very least some areas of improvement should show up. we also thought we were done w the FIU, LA Tech, Duke type losses. we aren't in either case so fans are upset especially after the hype train from when Mario was Hired. it doesn't mean Mario wont get time and it also doesn't matter what you or I think. its a U thing or w..e online twitter persona he wants to create w that need to stop worrying about fans. Mario is here for the long haul even if the fans boo him everyday for the next 6 years. his contract says so. idc if fans complain or support. its better than having no fans at all (Marlins just hired a manager and most of the city couldn't care) or apathetic ones (that happened to the fins for a while down here). ****, do most people even know Inter Miami made the playoffs this year? prolly not. so for me, complain, cheer, idc. just care.

 

[hoops156]

No one on this site has ever called me objective so I have to disagree. They think I’m an undercover A&M fan. I said 8 wins is what I would be ecstatic with and i got a million downvotes

most of this site picked 10 wins in that poll. idk why were not changing that fact.

 

[JustAFanHTX]

most of this site picked 10 wins in that poll. idk why were not changing that fact.

A bunch of revisionist history happening