forums

If this Manny Experiment doesn’t

Angry Ibis said:
Golden got an extra year than Shannon likely due to the NCAA investigation and not some conspiracy theory.

There’s a lot of consistent discussion/rhetoric around our hiring failures... I’m not disagreeing that they were failures, but rather commenting that major schools around the country have also failed, and many of the “home run” hires out there aren’t bringing in the wins at a rate we’d be happy with here...
Click to expand...

OK; I follow u.

I believe there’s a difference, subtle that is, between hiring failures v. hirings not working out.

So let’s discuss our failures, first:

With Coker, I actually didn’t have a problem w/ the hire. It made sense, initially. Here’s a guy who’s the OC of a team that was a “BCS glitch” away from being the Nat’l champions, and apart of the restoration of our dark times. Once the ***** started showing, it became clear he wasn’t the man for the job. I wouldn’t necessarily call that a failure; the end results showed he wasn’t equipped.

The failures began w/ Shannon. An internal hire from a failed regime. Unlike Coker who was apart of the restoration, Shannon was a part of a staff that began the deterioration of the program, so why hire him? That’s a failure.

So what do we do to remedy this? We hire a G5 coach who was a sub .500 winner, and actually took a step BACK before we hired him. OK; we hired him & the whole cloud situation which lasted for exactly 2 yrs. He won 9 games yr 3, and ghosted us. Literally ghosted us. Comes back the following yr and, like typical Temple fashion, took a step back. That’s a failure.

Hiring a fired Richt, hiring a Richt who wanted to retire....hiring a Richt who put a clause in to come on board if we allowed his non-experienced son on staff....that’s a failure. The different between JJ coming to Miami & Richt is JJ coached at little brother in Oklahoma. JJ didn’t have the resources, yet he had the best stretch in OK St history despite being handicapped. Richt?? Georgia is big brother w/ tons of resources & re$ources & he could never make it happen, especially his latter yrs (1st 7 yrs [72-19 (.791) v. last 8 yrs 73-32 (.695)])

So what do we do? As the team deteriorated, we hire a guy who was on the same staff. That’s a failure in leadership in judgement.

Now let’s discuss some of the names u mentioned:
Let’s say we hired a Herman, Harbaugh, Mullen, Pruitt, a Baber & they failed. Could that be constituted as a bad hire? Not necessarily; imo, it would be a hind sight 20/20 hire. Like Coker, those hires would’ve made absolute sense.

Herman leads Houston to the best two yr stretch in forever.

Harbaugh successful every where he’s been as a HC including the NFL

Mullen, an Urban disciple and had much successful at Lil’ Bro Mississippi

Pruitt, while no HC experience, a Saban disciple dripping w/ NC rings from both FSU & Bama

Babers turned around two G5 schools into 10+ game winners w/in 2 yrs

I don’t think any fan would’ve been mad at most of those names. At least it showed the admin tried to hire HOT names, but they didn’t pan out.

That’s the difference.
 
Last edited:
Advertisement
hydro66 said:
He's got a plan
Click to expand...
I’m not saying I don’t see the flaws in his coaching. He has definitely done some questionable things, but my hope is that all of this turns into experience and he’s able to build a successful program. 6-7 to 8-3 this year is a positive, whether you want to say it was because of King or not, overhauls the offense after first season woes, built two great recruiting classes the last two years, and has addressed any recruiting and roster deficiencies through the portal. He’s doing all the right things, will it pan out for him? I hope so because I’d rather him turn us into a powerhouse again than wait around to see what the next coach can do
 
MaxKesselhaut said:
I wasn't a fan of instantly hiring Manny Diaz without doing a coaching search last time however, I think if Manny does get fired, the first person on the interview list has to be Rhett Lashlee, I don't think he should be in instant hire YET, he needs to show what he can do this year in terms of expanding the playbook, but when I think of a head coach, I think of Rhett Lashlee, he has the discipline that I believe Manny Diaz lacks.

You bump Likens to OC/WR coach. Lashlee calls plays and coaches QBs, holds onto TRob and DVD on defense MINIMUM, with Simpson hopefully staying as well if the DC hired is okay with keeping the position coaches

Fire Baker and potentially Patke
Click to expand...
No more first year wannabes..
 
Rellyrell said:
He’s not getting fired, so no need to continue to start another thread on this.

The only guy that got ZERO leeway was Randy Shannon. BJ would look like a complete imbecile if he didn’t have a real coaching search, paid $4m to get the guy to come here & then fire him after 3 yrs?? That means he wasted a golden opportunity Richt gave him, he failed at his job, and he would be on the hottest AD seat in America.

That’s not happening, imo. He’s getting at least 4 yrs
Click to expand...

Four years is zero leeway?
 
Advertisement
RVACane said:
I think people still go by the Shannon was shorted thing because Golden came right after him and got more time. If Manny has a bad year this year, he’ll be gone after 3 seasons sooo...
Click to expand...

So Golden got what? Instead of 4, he got like 4.5 seasons. Not a big difference
 
Rellyrell said:
Going 9-4 then 7-5 (fired) vs. going 9-4 (disappear) then 6-7 (retained)....

Yeah
Click to expand...

That’s not zero leeway. Four full seasons, including losses that were just as embarrassing. Year after year.

He got plenty of leeway. His team was going nowhere, his recruiting was going down the drain.

I mean don’t even start rewriting history.

He actually should’ve never been hired in the first place. So stop with the he got zero leeway bullshlt.

Criticize Manny all you want, I won’t disagree, but Shannon was clearly a disaster after the first season and he got a full three seasons after that.
 
Rellyrell said:
OK; I follow u.

I believe there’s a difference, subtle that is, between hiring failures v. hirings not working out.

So let’s discuss our failures, first:

With Coker, I actually didn’t have a problem w/ the hire. It made sense, initially. Here’s a guy who’s the OC of a team that was a BCS glitch away from being the Nat’l champions, and apart of the restoration of our dark times. Once the ***** started showing, it became clear he wasn’t the man for the job. I wouldn’t necessarily call that a failure; the end results showed he wasn’t equipped.

The failures began w/ Shannon. An internal hire from a failed regime. Unlike Coker who was apart of the restoration, Shannon was a part of a staff that began to deterioration of the program, so why hire him? That’s a failure.

So what do we do to remedy this? We hire a G5 coach who was a sub .500 winner, and actually took a step BACK before we hired him. OK; we hired him & the whole cloud situation which lasted for exactly 2 yrs. He won 9 games yr 3, and ghosted us. Literally ghosted us. Comes back the following yr and, like typical Temple fashion, took a step back. That’s a failure.

Hiring a fired Richt, hiring a Richt who wanted to retire....hiring a Richt who put a clause in to come on board if we allowed his non-experienced son on staff....that’s a failure. The different between JJ coming to Miami & Richt is JJ coached at little brother in Oklahoma. JJ didn’t have the resources, yet he had the best stretch in OK St history despite being handicapped. Richt?? Georgia is big brother w/ tons of resources & re$ources & he could never make it happen, especially his latter yrs (1st 7 yrs [72-19 (.791) v. last 8 yrs 73-32 (.695)])

So what do we do? As the team deteriorated, we hire a guy who was on the same staff. That’s a failure in leadership in judgement.

Now let’s discuss some of the names u mentioned:
Let’s say we hired a Herman, Harbaugh, Mullen, Pruitt, a Baber & they failed. Could that be constituted as a bad hire? Not necessarily; imo, it would be a hind sight 20/20 hire. Like Coker, those hires would’ve made absolute sense.

Herman leads Houston to the best two yr stretch in forever.

Harbaugh successful every where he’s been as a HC including the NFL

Mullen, an Urban disciple and had much successful at Lil’ Bro Mississippi

Pruitt, while no HC experience, a Saban disciple dripping w/ NC rings from both FSU & Bama

Babers turned around two G5 schools into 10+ game winners w/in 2 yrs

I don’t think any fan would’ve been mad at most of those names. At least it showed the admin tried to hire HOT names, but they didn’t pan out.

That’s the difference.
Click to expand...
That’s a **** fair take. Reality is the majority aren’t thinking as deep as this small discussion we’re having that should be over a drink or several
 
FYI if the Manny experiment doesn’t work, then it’s on to the Mario Cristobal experiment. Not that he would be my first choice, by any stretch of the imagination, but he has major supporters in the Athletic Department, and would leave Oregon in a second to be HC here. He was a candidate for the job back in 2010 and 2015, and apparently had his agent reach out to Blake after Richt resigned (per the reporting at the time).

No way we’d ever offer Hugh Freeze (remember, to the NCAA, if Freeze did 10% of what he did at Ole Miss here, we’d get the death penalty). Campbell is a great candidate but is probably waiting for an opening in the Big 10. We could take a risk on a coordinator, but I doubt we’d pull an elite one (e.g Venables).

At the least, if CMD doesn’t work out, the usual suspects will be on the coaching search list like they have been since 2010 (Greg Schiano and Rob Chudzinski for sure). Otherwise, it’s Cristobal’s job if he wants it.
 
Advertisement
Rellyrell said:
OK; I follow u.

I believe there’s a difference, subtle that is, between hiring failures v. hirings not working out.

So let’s discuss our failures, first:

With Coker, I actually didn’t have a problem w/ the hire. It made sense, initially. Here’s a guy who’s the OC of a team that was a BCS glitch away from being the Nat’l champions, and apart of the restoration of our dark times. Once the ***** started showing, it became clear he wasn’t the man for the job. I wouldn’t necessarily call that a failure; the end results showed he wasn’t equipped.

The failures began w/ Shannon. An internal hire from a failed regime. Unlike Coker who was apart of the restoration, Shannon was a part of a staff that began to deterioration of the program, so why hire him? That’s a failure.

So what do we do to remedy this? We hire a G5 coach who was a sub .500 winner, and actually took a step BACK before we hired him. OK; we hired him & the whole cloud situation which lasted for exactly 2 yrs. He won 9 games yr 3, and ghosted us. Literally ghosted us. Comes back the following yr and, like typical Temple fashion, took a step back. That’s a failure.

Hiring a fired Richt, hiring a Richt who wanted to retire....hiring a Richt who put a clause in to come on board if we allowed his non-experienced son on staff....that’s a failure. The different between JJ coming to Miami & Richt is JJ coached at little brother in Oklahoma. JJ didn’t have the resources, yet he had the best stretch in OK St history despite being handicapped. Richt?? Georgia is big brother w/ tons of resources & re$ources & he could never make it happen, especially his latter yrs (1st 7 yrs [72-19 (.791) v. last 8 yrs 73-32 (.695)])

So what do we do? As the team deteriorated, we hire a guy who was on the same staff. That’s a failure in leadership in judgement.

Now let’s discuss some of the names u mentioned:
Let’s say we hired a Herman, Harbaugh, Mullen, Pruitt, a Baber & they failed. Could that be constituted as a bad hire? Not necessarily; imo, it would be a hind sight 20/20 hire. Like Coker, those hires would’ve made absolute sense.

Herman leads Houston to the best two yr stretch in forever.

Harbaugh successful every where he’s been as a HC including the NFL

Mullen, an Urban disciple and had much successful at Lil’ Bro Mississippi

Pruitt, while no HC experience, a Saban disciple dripping w/ NC rings from both FSU & Bama

Babers turned around two G5 schools into 10+ game winners w/in 2 yrs

I don’t think any fan would’ve been mad at most of those names. At least it showed the admin tried to hire HOT names, but they didn’t pan out.

That’s the difference.
Click to expand...
A bcs glitch??? Umm, they fvcked us my brother, @Rellyrell ..... but you know this.
 
Angry Ibis said:
That’s a **** fair take. Reality is the majority aren’t thinking as deep as this small discussion we’re having that should be over a drink or several
Click to expand...

And that, my friend, is the problem.
OriginalCanesCanesCanes said:
That’s not zero leeway. Four full seasons, including losses that were just as embarrassing. Year after year.

He got plenty of leeway. His team was going nowhere, his recruiting was going down the drain.

I mean don’t even start rewriting history.

He actually should’ve never been hired in the first place. So stop with the he got zero leeway bullshlt.

Criticize Manny all you want, I won’t disagree, but Shannon was clearly a disaster after the first season and he got a full three seasons after that.
Click to expand...

So if u take a look at my post to Angry Ibis, all this rah-rah u doing ain’t f’ing necessary. The last person on this mutha fcka that revise history is me.

The fact is, he got 4, while his successor got 5 & probably 6 had the media not made such a huge deal of that embarrassing loss.

I’m going to assume if Manny wins 7 this yr, he’ll be retained. I’m going to assume if he wins 8 the following yr, he’ll be retained.
 
Advertisement
FL Cane said:
FYI if the Manny experiment doesn’t work, then it’s on to the Mario Cristobal experiment. Not that he would be my first choice, by any stretch of the imagination, but he has major supporters in the Athletic Department, and would leave Oregon in a second to be HC here. He was a candidate for the job back in 2010 and 2015, and apparently had his agent reach out to Blake after Richt resigned (per the reporting at the time).

No way we’d ever offer Hugh Freeze (remember, to the NCAA, if Freeze did 10% of what he did at Ole Miss here, we’d get the death penalty). Campbell is a great candidate but is probably waiting for an opening in the Big 10. We could take a risk on a coordinator, but I doubt we’d pull an elite one (e.g Venables).

At the least, if CMD doesn’t work out, the usual suspects will be on the coaching search list like they have been since 2010 (Greg Schiano and Rob Chudzinski for sure). Otherwise, it’s Cristobal’s job if he wants it.
Click to expand...

And this would be f’ing b.s. lol. This is y we need a new AD w/ an actual football mind (yes the AD is much more than football, but as Covid clearly featured, football is God for school’s funding). We need a fresh pair of eyes on the BOT that’s not stuck in their ways, too, meaning being OK with going outside the normal.

Edit: first thing first; hopefully, despite my reservations, we don’t have to even remotely entertain this thought. Hoping that if Manny leaves, he’s leaving b/c an NFL team wants him as a HC due to his time here.
 
Advertisement
Rellyrell said:
We’re going to find out real soon if Manny made the right decision or if he gave himself too much rope to hang himself.
Click to expand...
My question to you is, if manure has problems running the program as a HC, how will he ALSO run the D... at the same time?

Asking for a friend
 
Go Canes!! said:
Someone please make it stop
Click to expand...
moved to tears crying GIF
 
LustNCanes said:
My question to you is, if manure has problems running the program as a HC, how will he ALSO run the D... at the same time?

Asking for a friend
Click to expand...

I put it like this:
When u have experienced, championship level coaches who were previously OC or DC giving up that aspect to focus solely on being a HC due to it being too much to handle, I have reservations on a green HC baring both responsibilities.

It’s one thing to still be involved in that aspect, like most former OC or DC coaches do, but it’s a totally different animal when you are trying to be at two places at one time.
 
Advertisement
Back
Top