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How to avoid a 2004-2016 slide again?

ThomasM said:
" I'm talking about playing styles, coaching styles, confidence, communication methods."

That's exactly the culture I was talking about. When JJ was hired ALL those things were questioned.
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Ok then. But, that argument could basically be used to support the hiring of anyone then. "Why not hire Al Golden? Or Willie Taggart? JJ worked out and he didn't have a strong track record and wasn't a popular hire when we brought him in either."

JJ is da real gawwwd, not Butch. But when JJ was hired we had one NC to our name and hadn't proven we were anything but a one year wonder under Schnellenberger.

By the time we're talking Alvarez/Coker, we had won 4 titles, played for many more, had run up some of the longest winning streaks in NCAA history, including 58 at home, and SHOULD have won the title in Butch's last year, 2000. Coker was the popular choice with the team, had been there to watch and presumably help Butch put together those teams, and was basically a shoo-in to bring us a title. Alvarez was a coach who had been at Wisconsin for 16 years and rang up a %60 win percentage over those 16 years, ie he averaged a 6-4 record. He had 5 losing seasons out of 16, and was just three games above .500 in conference play. He took over a terrible program, you say? In his last five seasons, he went 39-25, again winning just 6 out of 10 games, chalking up one of his 5 losing seasons, and going 2-2 in bowl games. I just don't get how hiring this guy was going to have been some massive savior for the program.

Bottom line, we should have been looking at bigger and better coaches than anyone brought in during Big D's tenure, including her pet rock, Alvarez.
 
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We are still about 10 years behind. We should have a bigger pool for HC and assistants.

With addidas and the ACC NETWORK deal it should help, but will see if that gets pumped back into the program
 
Somebody buy the rights to the book Shapiro is writing in prison, and bury it. Because it doesn't matter if its all vindictive bull****, it will come back like a wrecking ball on the back swing, to wreck the program again by reversing all the good Richt has done.
 
Bearly said:
Don’t let “Boosters” have free reign over the program, causing years invesitigations, possible sanctions, loss of scholarships, and self imposed punishment?
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That's funny, most of the sec lets the boosters run everything and I hear they're the greatest conference ever.
 
I’ve always wondered why fans think Alvarez would have installed a Big 10 ‘mudder’ offense at Miami. He didn’t have Miami’s team speed at Wisconsin. You don’t believe he would evolved his offense to fit SoFla athletes? I think he’s smarter than that. He knew what kind of players Wisconsin generally has access to, built on that philosophy, and hires HCs who think the same.

Alvarez would have inherited the same veteran team as Coker. I think he would have played a similar offense to what Miami was running. Might have kept Coker as OC. It’s wasn’t broken. Why fix it? He likely would have been more of a disciplinarian than Coker, and less of a player’s coach.

Moot point now, but Alvarez might have enjoyed great success at The U. Without the quick slide the program experienced under Coker.

Don Shula was a ‘three-yards and a cloud of dust HC’ for 20+ seasons. Then he got a gift named Dan Marino. Guess what? Bombs away.
 
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TemplarCane said:
I’ve always wondered why fans think Alvarez would have installed a Big 10 ‘mudder’ offense at Miami. He didn’t have Miami’s team speed at Wisconsin. You don’t believe he would evolved his offense to fit SoFla athletes? I think he’s smarter than that. He knew what kind of players Wisconsin generally has access to, built on that philosophy, and hires HCs who think the same.

He likely would have been more of a disciplinarian than Coker.

Moot point now, but Alvarez might have enjoyed great success at The U. Without the quick slide the program experienced under Coker.
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Interesting take. Sooo.. as we all know, Randy was sketched to all **** by Nevin Shapiro and did everything in his power to keep Shapiro away. Randy, not Shalala putting out her own work of arson, is probably what saved this program from the death penalty.

Meanwhile... Alvarez and his family lost over $1M to Shapiro (thanks in part to a likely intro of the two from Donna Shalala). Barry Alvarez and family claims $1 million in losses in Shapiro scheme

And so we’re supposed to follow all of this data, including Alvarez’s stellar 6-4 average record at Wisco, and somehow conclude that we’d be in better shape today if only we had followed Donna’s advice...

I’m sorry, I’m just not seeing it Elaine.
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-Don’t hire a pos like Shalala every again .
-Keep investing in the athletic program with paying top dollar for great coaches and facilities.
-hire a prolific offensive minded head coach.
 
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1) keep the NCAA out of our house
2) keep the NCAA out of our house
3) keep the NCAA out of our house

Last three teams to have undergone a an extended, high profile anal probe from those hacks are us, Baylor and UNC.

Golden had is countless and indisputable flaws, which eventually led to his inevitable demise. But i give him limited credit for keeping the program from hitting a true rock bottlom . Like the 2-20 or so I believe those other schools dropped this year.

A long investigation kills any program. We’ve seen it happen here twice.

Going forward those Cane hating suits in Indy can’t be given a reason to ***** us long...then hard.
 
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Silver King said:
Somebody buy the rights to the book Shapiro is writing in prison, and bury it. Because it doesn't matter if its all vindictive bull****, it will come back like a wrecking ball on the back swing, to wreck the program again by reversing all the good Richt has done.
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Nobody’s worried about any books Shapiro may be writing. That’s all over and done with. There’s no double jeopardy for us.
 
Well hopefully Richt will retire and then move into the AD role. That in itself will help insure we don’t slide backwards like we did those 15yrs between Coker, Shannon, and Golden. Continue to pay competitive wages to the HC and his assistants. Maintain the slight edge we have in facilities now with the IPF and the redo of the locker room, Hecht Center, and weight room. And keep an eye out for talented coaches who are moving up the FCS to FBS ranks so that when Richt does decide to hang up his HC duties that we have some viable candidates whenever that time does come along.
 
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g8rh8rMD said:
Interesting take. Sooo.. as we all know, Randy was sketched to all **** by Nevin Shapiro and did everything in his power to keep Shapiro away. Randy, not Shalala putting out her own work of arson, is probably what saved this program from the death penalty.

Meanwhile... Alvarez and his family lost over $1M to Shapiro (thanks in part to a likely intro of the two from Donna Shalala). Barry Alvarez and family claims $1 million in losses in Shapiro scheme

And so we’re supposed to follow all of this data, including Alvarez’s stellar 6-4 average record at Wisco, and somehow conclude that we’d be in better shape today if only we had followed Donna’s advice...

I’m sorry, I’m just not seeing it Elaine.
6944444678_1e9d033011.jpg
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You make plenty of good points.

Wisconsin was usually a second-tier Big 10 team, but was far worse before Alvarez was hired. Alvarez made Wisconsin very competitive in a conference with traditional national powerhouses like Michigan, Ohio State, and later Penn State. He went 1-10 his first season, 10-1-1 and a Rose Bowl win in his fourth season. Three Big 10 championships, and a 3-0 record in the Rose Bowl (not counting a 1-game interim HC loss). He’s not Urban Meyer or Nick Saban, but he’s far better than Larry Coker, Randy Shannon, and Al Golden.

My main point was concern Alvarez would have turned The U into a slow, power-running team may have been unfounded. We’ll never know, and it doesn’t matter.

Alvarez falling for Shapiro’s scheme doesn’t mean much to me. A lot smart people fall for financial scams. We’re a greedy species.

I think we agree The U is back on track with Mark Richt.
 
TemplarCane said:
Alvarez falling for Shapiro’s scheme doesn’t mean much to me.
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I hear ya man. No way can we know what kind of offense he would have tried to run. And just like Al Golden, he took a moribund program to never before achieved heights. (sarcastic, but couldn’t help myself, forgive me)

I just want to highlight the one comment you made, which I’ve isolated above. Alvarez falling for Shapiro SHOULD mean a lot to anyone when we’re talking about an argument that Shalala wanted to bring in Alvarez, and that hiring him would have somehow saved us from our lost decade and a half. There’s a million reasons that argument just doesn’t hold water, Foremost of which is that this guy trusted Shapiro with his own money while Shannon wouldn’t even let him in the building. If Shalala had gotten her way bringing in Alvarez, we might not even have a football team anymore. Not always a fan of how Randy handles his business, but he very likely saved our bacon.

CMR has us on the righteous path, regardless of the past, happy days are here again.
 
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For those ripping Alvarez's overall record, do they understand what he took over in 1990?

He simply engineered one of the great rebuilds in college football history

Just simply going by his overall record is highly short-sighted and myopic. Give him Coker's roster in 2001 to start off with...
 
g8rh8rMD said:
I hear ya man. No way can we know what kind of offense he would have tried to run. And just like Al Golden, he took a moribund program to never before achieved heights. (sarcastic, but couldn’t help myself, forgive me)

I just want to highlight the one comment you made, which I’ve isolated above. Alvarez falling for Shapiro SHOULD mean a lot to anyone when we’re talking about an argument that Shalala wanted to bring in Alvarez, and that hiring him would have somehow saved us from our lost decade and a half. There’s a million reasons that argument just doesn’t hold water, Foremost of which is that this guy trusted Shapiro with his own money while Shannon wouldn’t even let him in the building. If Shalala had gotten her way bringing in Alvarez, we might not even have a football team anymore. Not always a fan of how Randy handles his business, but he very likely saved our bacon.

CMR has us on the righteous path, regardless of the past, happy days are here again.
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Your point on Shannon spotting Shaprio a mile away is well taken, and valid. Shapiro could have done much more damage than he did. I hadn’t considered that angle. Thanks.
 
ShadowSpring said:
Don't let winning football coaches leave!!!! Pay them.

If any 1 of Jimmy, Howard, or Butch would've stayed we'd have 10-15 titles.
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There was probably no keeping JJ. Howard and Butch should have been easy to keep. Heck, they all but drove Howard away over the campus stadium stuff. But I agree that football would be different today if any had stayed. Several teams would have less NCs and Bama would have suffered several serious beat downs to go with only a couple titles. Football would be more exciting. We were never a team that would win every title. Too much praise always went to our heads. Our best came out when we got slighted, so teams would have a chance every other year or so.
 
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