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Chicken Or The Egg

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Rellyrell said:
Which came first; the chicken or the egg? No seriously; which came first, The Culture of Miami Football or The New Staff?

Check my post history; I’m not & never have been a coach defender. This post, thread is not to justify, excuse, bargain, or even reason upon the monstrosity of yesterday’s game. It started funky with the tailgate being completely demolished by heavy rains, to MTSU completely & throughly smashing us. Again, while the off season was filled w/ the usual chest thumping, 15-0 / 10+ win or bust posters, along w/ the usual Green Tree Practice Reports adding Kool-Aid, there were a handful of posters, like myself, who cautioned season 1.

BCU game had everyone feeling good, & again, I posted historical data of us crushing FCS opponents in previous yrs & the end results. So often fans get caught up in the hype, they don’t have an honest evaluation of their team. I gotta frat bro right now in line to lose $50 to me b/c he think our Chi Bears is winning 8 games this yr b/c we got a new coach. Lol. That’s fans, bro; hard headed af, w/ the inability to see reality b/c they think w/ their emotions & not mind.

Question for all those who said bench Ivey: have u seen what’s behind him? Did u see a young Jaden Harris slide farther on the field than Manny ever did, as he was burnt? Have u seen Green Tree All-American, Graves, get BBQ chicken? So who’s replacing Ivey? Speaking of, how about that effort by Ivey on that 90+ TD? Did u see him run full sprint or jog?

Question for all those who said J Will is the next: did u see his **** poor efforts in tackling yesterday?

Question for all those who praised the portal moves, including crowning Messidor: where have they been?

Question for all those who thought the camp reports of half-assed efforts from the WRs in practice: are u now convinced of the ?able hands these guys have? Are u concerned that our go to guys are Redding & Ladson?

There’s never an excuse to lose to a MTSU team, not when you are a P5 squad. I don’t care who’ve they’ve upset in the past, the fact this team is a middling G5 team, but fans look at roster vs. something u can’t account for, culture. To illustrate, one of my boys in FL, young guy at 35 and into health & fitness like myself. Externally, he looks great, but no one knows internally he deals w/ depression & mood swings, & those things derails him a lot. Fortunately, he has a loving wife who helps him navigate through those times.

Externally, based upon 247 rankings, this roster should be competing for ACC titles & beating the snot out of all these teams we’ve faced. So why haven’t we? In the last 4 yrs, we’ve lost to more unranked G5 teams than we have in the last 40 yrs. alone. Chicken or Egg, folks?

I’ve clearly warned the make up of this roster, the mentality that’s crept in, and somehow you’ve convinced urself that was going to change b/c of a coach? The overwhelming data shows when a coach takes over a dumpster fire, it takes 2-3 yrs to clear out the filth. I remember Bama losing to ULM at home in 2007 & the vitriol that was spewed by friends who r Bama fans who wanted him gone. I remember SC fans hating the Carroll hire & hated him even more going 6-6 yr 1, including a baffling, pathetic performance against Utah in their bowl game (MWC Utah, not Pac-12 Utah)

The fans who r chirping the most r the ones who didn’t want Mario here in the 1st place. This is ur “See, I told u he was a bum” moment. Lol. It takes time to change culture, at least 2 yrs, but generally by year 3. Unless u’re Lincoln Riley & can bring ur squad w/ you to replace current players & a Belitnikoff WR, it’s incredibly difficult to have a 1 yr turn around. I’ve seen Saban, Carroll, Dabo, Aranda, Stoops (both of them) all look like Corches yr 1.

Things take time; if by year 3 we look like this, then we know it wasn’t the chicken; it was the egg
Click to expand...
Translation = Stop whining, support these coaches 100%, get out to the games & embrace the changes which are going to take a while.
 
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Rellyrell said:
Respectfully, u’re adding 20 inch rims on a wheel base that can only hold 13’s.

Mistake 1: We have a TE that was ranked 2nd at his position behind Brevin.
1. This is not true; Mallory was the 8th ranked TE in the nation, not 2nd.

2. Even if Mallory was ranked by a recruiting service as the #2 TE, what has 4 yrs of data shown prior to Mario? That either he was overrated or he’s been a bust.

Mistake 2: Arroyo who was top 5 at his position coming out.
1. Again, not true. He was ranked as the 7th TE coming out

2. He’s a true sophomore learning under his 2nd OC in two yrs. He’ll be that guy next yr w/o splitting reps

Mistake 3: Jaleel Skinner being top 3 in his class at his position
1. Yes, Skinner was top 3 in his class; but, he’s a true freshman learning how to be a college TE. If a team is relying upon true freshmen to save them, that’s the 1st problem.

Mistake 4: Zion projected to be a 1st rounder
1. L-O-L

2. Zion projection as a 1st rounder was his Jr year. After his Jr year, his draft status plummeted, which is y he’s back for his Sr yr. He’s already behind the 8-ball w/ his off season surgery. I can guaran-****-tee u he won’t come close to sniffing the 1st round.

Mistake 5: Thad & Rooster both top 5 in their counties.
1. What does this even mean? Lol So now we’re emphasizing counties? Well ****, partner, I know several 2 star guys in Kings County who are top 5.

2. Thad had his opportunities. U wanna know Thad stats?
BCU: 9 carries 78 yrds (8.7 ypc) 2 TDs
SoMU: 12 carries 49 yrds (4.1 ypc) 1 TD
TAMU: 1 carrie -1 yrds
MTSU: 15 carries 36 yrds (2.1 ypc) 2 TDs
So it appears since BCU, when facing FBS competition, his production has waned considerably. Maybe that’s b/c it’s been reported for 2 yrs now his work ethic ain’t the best.

3. How did Rooster fair under Rhett? He avg. 3.9 ypc. Now? He’s avg. 4.4 ypc, still far behind Parrish. Now I will say, wheel routes for Rooster could be better utilized, however the reason Rooster don’t get the burn a Parrish gets is b/c he has a tendency to give the opponents the rock w/ his notion to fumble (like he did against MTSU). As a matter of fact, Rooster has fumbled 6x so far in his 2.3 yr career, losing 3. U can’t trust that.

4. Chaney can’t stay healthy, so I don’t care if he was the #1 ranked or #21st ranked, if he ain’t available, it don’t matter.

Mistake 6: Ladson, a 4 star receiver who went to Clemson when they were rolling.
1. L-O-L

2. Again, what does this even mean? U mean when they were rolling & he couldn’t sniff the field?

3. What does 4-star have to do anything? Wasn’t Pope a 4-star? Wasn’t Jeremiah Payton a 4 star? Do u know how many 4 & 5 star WRs we’ve had that’s amounted to chit over the past 15 yrs alone? So Ladson flashed by what? 6 catches for 65 yrds & 0 tubs against MTSU? Or was it his 2 catches for 33 yrds against BCU that gave u the warm & fuzzies? If Ladson couldn’t do chit w/ a 1st overall pick QB, what’s he going to do here?

Mistake 7: Jake Garcia top 5 QB at his position coming out.
1. Again, NO HE WASN’T. He was the #8 QB coming out

Which leads me to
Mistake 8: TVD was a Heisman candidate & strong first round candidate.
1. Yeah? So was Brad Kaaya. Stephen Morris was on the Maxwell Award, Davey O'Brien Award, & Manning Award watch list in 2013 & Bucky Brooks, said he could possess the most talent out of anyone in his class. Who cares about preseason hype.

2. Even if the hype was legit, u can only play one QB at a time, so they both can be Elway clones & it’s a moot point.

This is the reality; this is y fans don’t see big picture problems. For all the chit that’s talked about the gators star-checking, we do a **** good job in star checking too. Stars mean chit if the infrastructure ain’t there. We had zero infrastructure, & all that lack of effort u saw on defense is a by-product of years of it.

Finally, I don’t think Steele is an excellent coach; I think he’s a decent coach, and the holes we have is something that he can’t overcome.
Click to expand...
This is all I’ve been saying. Rellyrell just types better haha. We build these guys up all offseason and board the hype train only to see that they aren’t that good.

What’s worse about the ENTIRE roster is that even though they aren’t very good, they THINK they are superstars because of the stars next to their names. Very entitled and very wrong
 
Rellyrell said:
Which came first; the chicken or the egg? No seriously; which came first, The Culture of Miami Football or The New Staff?

Check my post history; I’m not & never have been a coach defender. This post, thread is not to justify, excuse, bargain, or even reason upon the monstrosity of yesterday’s game. It started funky with the tailgate being completely demolished by heavy rains, to MTSU completely & throughly smashing us. Again, while the off season was filled w/ the usual chest thumping, 15-0 / 10+ win or bust posters, along w/ the usual Green Tree Practice Reports adding Kool-Aid, there were a handful of posters, like myself, who cautioned season 1.

BCU game had everyone feeling good, & again, I posted historical data of us crushing FCS opponents in previous yrs & the end results. So often fans get caught up in the hype, they don’t have an honest evaluation of their team. I gotta frat bro right now in line to lose $50 to me b/c he think our Chi Bears is winning 8 games this yr b/c we got a new coach. Lol. That’s fans, bro; hard headed af, w/ the inability to see reality b/c they think w/ their emotions & not mind.

Question for all those who said bench Ivey: have u seen what’s behind him? Did u see a young Jaden Harris slide farther on the field than Manny ever did, as he was burnt? Have u seen Green Tree All-American, Graves, get BBQ chicken? So who’s replacing Ivey? Speaking of, how about that effort by Ivey on that 90+ TD? Did u see him run full sprint or jog?

Question for all those who said J Will is the next: did u see his **** poor efforts in tackling yesterday?

Question for all those who praised the portal moves, including crowning Messidor: where have they been?

Question for all those who thought the camp reports of half-assed efforts from the WRs in practice: are u now convinced of the ?able hands these guys have? Are u concerned that our go to guys are Redding & Ladson?

There’s never an excuse to lose to a MTSU team, not when you are a P5 squad. I don’t care who’ve they’ve upset in the past, the fact this team is a middling G5 team, but fans look at roster vs. something u can’t account for, culture. To illustrate, one of my boys in FL, young guy at 35 and into health & fitness like myself. Externally, he looks great, but no one knows internally he deals w/ depression & mood swings, & those things derails him a lot. Fortunately, he has a loving wife who helps him navigate through those times.

Externally, based upon 247 rankings, this roster should be competing for ACC titles & beating the snot out of all these teams we’ve faced. So why haven’t we? In the last 4 yrs, we’ve lost to more unranked G5 teams than we have in the last 40 yrs. alone. Chicken or Egg, folks?

I’ve clearly warned the make up of this roster, the mentality that’s crept in, and somehow you’ve convinced urself that was going to change b/c of a coach? The overwhelming data shows when a coach takes over a dumpster fire, it takes 2-3 yrs to clear out the filth. I remember Bama losing to ULM at home in 2007 & the vitriol that was spewed by friends who r Bama fans who wanted him gone. I remember SC fans hating the Carroll hire & hated him even more going 6-6 yr 1, including a baffling, pathetic performance against Utah in their bowl game (MWC Utah, not Pac-12 Utah)

The fans who r chirping the most r the ones who didn’t want Mario here in the 1st place. This is ur “See, I told u he was a bum” moment. Lol. It takes time to change culture, at least 2 yrs, but generally by year 3. Unless u’re Lincoln Riley & can bring ur squad w/ you to replace current players & a Belitnikoff WR, it’s incredibly difficult to have a 1 yr turn around. I’ve seen Saban, Carroll, Dabo, Aranda, Stoops (both of them) all look like Corches yr 1.

Things take time; if by year 3 we look like this, then we know it wasn’t the chicken; it was the egg
Click to expand...
Impressive post. Impressive reactions to it.

Of the over 100 icon reactions so far, the "most negative" are 3 'laughs'.

Looks like none of us want to believe this will take a few years, but we mostly agree.

Thanks for temporarily helping me down from the ledge. But my spot on the ledge is now reserved for me after 2024.

Until then, I'll have 3 glorious Off Seasons to enjoy and temporarily forget reality.
 
Last edited:
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You know it's hard to have a take around here w/o someone taking a small point and blowing it out of proportion.
So here goes: why should Miami be exempt from being 'shocked' by a non-P5? AND THAT'S NOT TO EXCUSE OR RATIONALIZE Saturday's debacle. How does ND lose to Marshall? A&M to Appy? For God's sake, Florida was very fortunate to escape USF. Every week a middling P-5 (that's us btw) is being picked off. For the majority of programs, other than the powerhouses, the term 'any given Saturday' is applicable. Teams with first year coaches seem particularly succeptible. "Well it's just UNACCEPTABLE.." - the batte cry of MANY. And yes, this loss was ALARMING, but not uncommon. As mentioned, it even happened to Saban; and that's NOT to say Mario's in Satan's neighborhood. Simply an illustration.

Disclaimer: none of this is to say Mario doesn't need to seriously think about his approach on the offensive side of the ball.
 
Rellyrell said:
Which came first; the chicken or the egg? No seriously; which came first, The Culture of Miami Football or The New Staff?

Check my post history; I’m not & never have been a coach defender. This post, thread is not to justify, excuse, bargain, or even reason upon the monstrosity of yesterday’s game. It started funky with the tailgate being completely demolished by heavy rains, to MTSU completely & throughly smashing us. Again, while the off season was filled w/ the usual chest thumping, 15-0 / 10+ win or bust posters, along w/ the usual Green Tree Practice Reports adding Kool-Aid, there were a handful of posters, like myself, who cautioned season 1.

BCU game had everyone feeling good, & again, I posted historical data of us crushing FCS opponents in previous yrs & the end results. So often fans get caught up in the hype, they don’t have an honest evaluation of their team. I gotta frat bro right now in line to lose $50 to me b/c he think our Chi Bears is winning 8 games this yr b/c we got a new coach. Lol. That’s fans, bro; hard headed af, w/ the inability to see reality b/c they think w/ their emotions & not mind.

Question for all those who said bench Ivey: have u seen what’s behind him? Did u see a young Jaden Harris slide farther on the field than Manny ever did, as he was burnt? Have u seen Green Tree All-American, Graves, get BBQ chicken? So who’s replacing Ivey? Speaking of, how about that effort by Ivey on that 90+ TD? Did u see him run full sprint or jog?

Question for all those who said J Will is the next: did u see his **** poor efforts in tackling yesterday?

Question for all those who praised the portal moves, including crowning Messidor: where have they been?

Question for all those who thought the camp reports of half-assed efforts from the WRs in practice: are u now convinced of the ?able hands these guys have? Are u concerned that our go to guys are Redding & Ladson?

There’s never an excuse to lose to a MTSU team, not when you are a P5 squad. I don’t care who’ve they’ve upset in the past, the fact this team is a middling G5 team, but fans look at roster vs. something u can’t account for, culture. To illustrate, one of my boys in FL, young guy at 35 and into health & fitness like myself. Externally, he looks great, but no one knows internally he deals w/ depression & mood swings, & those things derails him a lot. Fortunately, he has a loving wife who helps him navigate through those times.

Externally, based upon 247 rankings, this roster should be competing for ACC titles & beating the snot out of all these teams we’ve faced. So why haven’t we? In the last 4 yrs, we’ve lost to more unranked G5 teams than we have in the last 40 yrs. alone. Chicken or Egg, folks?

I’ve clearly warned the make up of this roster, the mentality that’s crept in, and somehow you’ve convinced urself that was going to change b/c of a coach? The overwhelming data shows when a coach takes over a dumpster fire, it takes 2-3 yrs to clear out the filth. I remember Bama losing to ULM at home in 2007 & the vitriol that was spewed by friends who r Bama fans who wanted him gone. I remember SC fans hating the Carroll hire & hated him even more going 6-6 yr 1, including a baffling, pathetic performance against Utah in their bowl game (MWC Utah, not Pac-12 Utah)

The fans who r chirping the most r the ones who didn’t want Mario here in the 1st place. This is ur “See, I told u he was a bum” moment. Lol. It takes time to change culture, at least 2 yrs, but generally by year 3. Unless u’re Lincoln Riley & can bring ur squad w/ you to replace current players & a Belitnikoff WR, it’s incredibly difficult to have a 1 yr turn around. I’ve seen Saban, Carroll, Dabo, Aranda, Stoops (both of them) all look like Corches yr 1.

Things take time; if by year 3 we look like this, then we know it wasn’t the chicken; it was the egg
Click to expand...
It does take time to change a culture, but evidently only one offseason to destroy a pretty good O. ;)
 

Rellyrell said:
Check my post history; I’m not & never have been a coach defender. This post, thread is not to justify, excuse, bargain, or even reason upon the monstrosity of yesterday’s game. It started funky with the tailgate being completely demolished by heavy rains, to MTSU completely & throughly smashing us. Again, while the off season was filled w/ the usual chest thumping, 15-0 / 10+ win or bust posters, along w/ the usual Green Tree Practice Reports adding Kool-Aid, there were a handful of posters, like myself, who cautioned season 1.

BCU game had everyone feeling good, & again, I posted historical data of us crushing FCS opponents in previous yrs & the end results. So often fans get caught up in the hype, they don’t have an honest evaluation of their team. I gotta frat bro right now in line to lose $50 to me b/c he think our Chi Bears is winning 8 games this yr b/c we got a new coach. Lol. That’s fans, bro; hard headed af, w/ the inability to see reality b/c they think w/ their emotions & not mind.

Question for all those who said bench Ivey: have u seen what’s behind him? Did u see a young Jaden Harris slide farther on the field than Manny ever did, as he was burnt? Have u seen Green Tree All-American, Graves, get BBQ chicken? So who’s replacing Ivey? Speaking of, how about that effort by Ivey on that 90+ TD? Did u see him run full sprint or jog?

Question for all those who said J Will is the next: did u see his **** poor efforts in tackling yesterday?

Question for all those who praised the portal moves, including crowning Messidor: where have they been?

Question for all those who thought the camp reports of half-assed efforts from the WRs in practice: are u now convinced of the ?able hands these guys have? Are u concerned that our go to guys are Redding & Ladson?

There’s never an excuse to lose to a MTSU team, not when you are a P5 squad. I don’t care who’ve they’ve upset in the past, the fact this team is a middling G5 team, but fans look at roster vs. something u can’t account for, culture. To illustrate, one of my boys in FL, young guy at 35 and into health & fitness like myself. Externally, he looks great, but no one knows internally he deals w/ depression & mood swings, & those things derails him a lot. Fortunately, he has a loving wife who helps him navigate through those times.

Externally, based upon 247 rankings, this roster should be competing for ACC titles & beating the snot out of all these teams we’ve faced. So why haven’t we? In the last 4 yrs, we’ve lost to more unranked G5 teams than we have in the last 40 yrs. alone. Chicken or Egg, folks?

I’ve clearly warned the make up of this roster, the mentality that’s crept in, and somehow you’ve convinced urself that was going to change b/c of a coach? The overwhelming data shows when a coach takes over a dumpster fire, it takes 2-3 yrs to clear out the filth. I remember Bama losing to ULM at home in 2007 & the vitriol that was spewed by friends who r Bama fans who wanted him gone. I remember SC fans hating the Carroll hire & hated him even more going 6-6 yr 1, including a baffling, pathetic performance against Utah in their bowl game (MWC Utah, not Pac-12 Utah)

The fans who r chirping the most r the ones who didn’t want Mario here in the 1st place. This is ur “See, I told u he was a bum” moment. Lol. It takes time to change culture, at least 2 yrs, but generally by year 3. Unless u’re Lincoln Riley & can bring ur squad w/ you to replace current players & a Belitnikoff WR, it’s incredibly difficult to have a 1 yr turn around. I’ve seen Saban, Carroll, Dabo, Aranda, Stoops (both of them) all look like Corches yr 1.

Things take time; if by year 3 we look like this, then we know it wasn’t the chicken; it was the egg
Click to expand...
Rellyrell said:
Which came first; the chicken or the egg? No seriously; which came first, The Culture of Miami Football or The New Staff?

Check my post history; I’m not & never have been a coach defender. This post, thread is not to justify, excuse, bargain, or even reason upon the monstrosity of yesterday’s game. It started funky with the tailgate being completely demolished by heavy rains, to MTSU completely & throughly smashing us. Again, while the off season was filled w/ the usual chest thumping, 15-0 / 10+ win or bust posters, along w/ the usual Green Tree Practice Reports adding Kool-Aid, there were a handful of posters, like myself, who cautioned season 1.

BCU game had everyone feeling good, & again, I posted historical data of us crushing FCS opponents in previous yrs & the end results. So often fans get caught up in the hype, they don’t have an honest evaluation of their team. I gotta frat bro right now in line to lose $50 to me b/c he think our Chi Bears is winning 8 games this yr b/c we got a new coach. Lol. That’s fans, bro; hard headed af, w/ the inability to see reality b/c they think w/ their emotions & not mind.

Question for all those who said bench Ivey: have u seen what’s behind him? Did u see a young Jaden Harris slide farther on the field than Manny ever did, as he was burnt? Have u seen Green Tree All-American, Graves, get BBQ chicken? So who’s replacing Ivey? Speaking of, how about that effort by Ivey on that 90+ TD? Did u see him run full sprint or jog?

Question for all those who said J Will is the next: did u see his **** poor efforts in tackling yesterday?

Question for all those who praised the portal moves, including crowning Messidor: where have they been?

Question for all those who thought the camp reports of half-assed efforts from the WRs in practice: are u now convinced of the ?able hands these guys have? Are u concerned that our go to guys are Redding & Ladson?

There’s never an excuse to lose to a MTSU team, not when you are a P5 squad. I don’t care who’ve they’ve upset in the past, the fact this team is a middling G5 team, but fans look at roster vs. something u can’t account for, culture. To illustrate, one of my boys in FL, young guy at 35 and into health & fitness like myself. Externally, he looks great, but no one knows internally he deals w/ depression & mood swings, & those things derails him a lot. Fortunately, he has a loving wife who helps him navigate through those times.

Externally, based upon 247 rankings, this roster should be competing for ACC titles & beating the snot out of all these teams we’ve faced. So why haven’t we? In the last 4 yrs, we’ve lost to more unranked G5 teams than we have in the last 40 yrs. alone. Chicken or Egg, folks?

I’ve clearly warned the make up of this roster, the mentality that’s crept in, and somehow you’ve convinced urself that was going to change b/c of a coach? The overwhelming data shows when a coach takes over a dumpster fire, it takes 2-3 yrs to clear out the filth. I remember Bama losing to ULM at home in 2007 & the vitriol that was spewed by friends who r Bama fans who wanted him gone. I remember SC fans hating the Carroll hire & hated him even more going 6-6 yr 1, including a baffling, pathetic performance against Utah in their bowl game (MWC Utah, not Pac-12 Utah)

The fans who r chirping the most r the ones who didn’t want Mario here in the 1st place. This is ur “See, I told u he was a bum” moment. Lol. It takes time to change culture, at least 2 yrs, but generally by year 3. Unless u’re Lincoln Riley & can bring ur squad w/ you to replace current players & a Belitnikoff WR, it’s incredibly difficult to have a 1 yr turn around. I’ve seen Saban, Carroll, Dabo, Aranda, Stoops (both of them) all look like Corches yr 1.

Things take time; if by year 3 we look like this, then we know it wasn’t the chicken; it was the egg
Click to expand...
You wanna give him til year 3? Cool
I’m down but recruits wont be. Part of the mess needs to be fixed now before recruits say “same shît, diff day” starts with a hopeful unc win!
 
cway313 said:
I think Parrish and Jackson were solid portal additions but I said in the summer we missed. Still no pash rushers all our LBs still mid no corner and WR no comment. No matter if you agree with me or not about WR value it's a top 3 position with DE and QB we have none of them.
Click to expand...
We (and anyone else) can debate the hierarchy of position importance, but I'll make a corollary point: you can survive with a position group that is clearly the weakest link, but you can't have any group that doesn't perform at all.

LB is just not there, and WR is also a near-total failure. That just can't happen. The other groups, no matter how good (and we ain't), cannot make up for that.
 
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Rellyrell said:
Let me simplify it:

Is it a talent culture/issue or a coaching issue? Which came 1st?

Supportive data shows these issues, such as not showing up against inferior competition & this apathetic attitude have shown up since 2004.

Ppl chitted on Norvell, including me; but, u can find several post where me & @Liberty City El were high on FSU hiring him. It looked like a massive failure. Again, what I didn’t account for was culture & how far it sunk under Jimbo & Taggart. But once the bad seeds started to exit, FSU started looking better. U can find me saying FSU actually looked like a competent team last yr, so this 4-0 start doesn’t shock me. It takes TIME to fix bull chit, so I’m not ready to say fly the planes, “right now.” Come yr 2 & 3, if I see the same chit, I’ll humbly acknowledge I was wrong on Mario & the hire.
Click to expand...
Good post. Maybe MTSU is our Jacksonville State.
 
FL Cane said:
Great post; these are my sentiments exactly. The reality is that Miami has had a culture of complacency and mediocrity for more than 18 years. We've gone through almost a generation of rosters that have embraced a broken culture. Losing to MTSU should never happen, but when we've lost to FIU and LA Tech in recent years, it's not very surprising. Our broken culture has conditioned our players to be fine with mediocrity.

Here's the reality. Mario inherited a team that was 28-21 over the past four seasons. No player on this team has ever won a bowl game or more than nine games in a season. Richt and Diaz were terrible recruiters who missed on the overwhelming majority of their evals. There isn't any position on this team other than RB that you can look at and say is a Top 40 unit in the country, let alone a Top 25 unit. We are 2 years away from being a team that can consistently put together 9-win seasons, and we're 3-4 years away from being nationally relevant. We get back to being good by 1) stacking talent and 2) completely revamping our culture.

Also, as you said (and like most people on this board are ignoring), almost any good HC in CFB today had a rough first year on the job. Some records to consider:
  • Nick Saban: 7-6
  • Dabo Swinney: 4-3 (19-15 going into season #3)
  • Dave Aranda: 3-7
  • Sam Pittman: 3-7
  • Matt Campbell: 3-9
  • Lane Kiffin: 2-5
  • Josh Heupel: 7-6
  • Luke Fickell: 4-8
  • Brian Kelly: 8-5
  • Kirby Smart: 8-5
  • James Franklin: 7-6 (14-12 going into season #3)
  • P.J. Fleck: 5-7
  • Mel Tucker: 2-5
  • Kyle Whittingham: 7-5
  • *Bonus* - Pete Carrol: 6-6
Point is, it's too early to be writing obituaries. We have to see how this year pans out and the changes this staff makes. Had Bama and Clemson fans had their way a year into Saban and Dabo, the runs would've never happened. TBD on how Mario pans out, but he needs the time to do it.
Click to expand...
Add Jimmy 8-5 in 1984, including blowing a 4 touchdown lead vs Maryland.
 
A lot of teams do use scheme to hide talent deficiencies (at wr).

*and this is kind of a chicken or egg scenario. Same receivers, in a simplified scheme - are they wearing the label they presently have? And I also understand why some would justify this scheme projecting to be successful long-term with more talented personnel. Round and round we go.
 
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FL Cane said:
Great post; these are my sentiments exactly. The reality is that Miami has had a culture of complacency and mediocrity for more than 18 years. We've gone through almost a generation of rosters that have embraced a broken culture. Losing to MTSU should never happen, but when we've lost to FIU and LA Tech in recent years, it's not very surprising. Our broken culture has conditioned our players to be fine with mediocrity.

Here's the reality. Mario inherited a team that was 28-21 over the past four seasons. No player on this team has ever won a bowl game or more than nine games in a season. Richt and Diaz were terrible recruiters who missed on the overwhelming majority of their evals. There isn't any position on this team other than RB that you can look at and say is a Top 40 unit in the country, let alone a Top 25 unit. We are 2 years away from being a team that can consistently put together 9-win seasons, and we're 3-4 years away from being nationally relevant. We get back to being good by 1) stacking talent and 2) completely revamping our culture.

Also, as you said (and like most people on this board are ignoring), almost any good HC in CFB today had a rough first year on the job. Some records to consider:
  • Nick Saban: 7-6
  • Dabo Swinney: 4-3 (19-15 going into season #3)
  • Dave Aranda: 3-7
  • Sam Pittman: 3-7
  • Matt Campbell: 3-9
  • Lane Kiffin: 2-5
  • Josh Heupel: 7-6
  • Luke Fickell: 4-8
  • Brian Kelly: 8-5
  • Kirby Smart: 8-5
  • James Franklin: 7-6 (14-12 going into season #3)
  • P.J. Fleck: 5-7
  • Mel Tucker: 2-5
  • Kyle Whittingham: 7-5
  • *Bonus* - Pete Carrol: 6-6
Point is, it's too early to be writing obituaries. We have to see how this year pans out and the changes this staff makes. Had Bama and Clemson fans had their way a year into Saban and Dabo, the runs would've never happened. TBD on how Mario pans out, but he needs the time to do it.
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My ONLY slight pushback on this theory is..we are playing in the ACC Coastal. Duke, UNC, GTech, VTech all suck and Virginia is not too far behind. This isnt the SEC we are playing in like Saban and many of the names on that list were going up against. (Smart, Pittman, Kiffin, Heupel) Duke just lost to Kansas. GTech just fired there coach. And VTech looks absolutely abysmal. So while we pretty much suck as well..losing to teams that I just mentioned would not make me feel like we are on an upward path. Because if we cant even beat those low level teams, we are really alot farther away from beating Clemson and Wake for the ACC title.
 
I hope you are right @Rellyrell. I think most objective posters knew that it was going to take some time to build a program but losing to MTSU is disheartening. I try not to be reactionary-irrational-sports-guy but I am questioning just about everything today.
 
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AlexCane said:
I hope you are right @Rellyrell. I think most objective posters knew that it was going to take some time to build a program but losing to MTSU is disheartening. I try not to be reactionary-irrational-sports-guy but I am questioning just about everything today.
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Agree.

You can be **** sure that Schnellenburger would NEVER lose an embarrassing game like that in his 4th game at UM.

Look it up and TRY to prove me wrong!
 
As we were losing to FIU, we had Holley dancing on the sidelines. The embodied the complacent attitude among the players and clearly showed a lack of desire to win. It was the team culture personified. At halftime against Southern Miss, we heard the players had stepped up to rally the team to play better before Mario ever got in the locker room. I want to know how the players feel after this loss. Was it just another game or did it hurt?
 
Gables Canes said:
We look WORSE in almost every facet of the game than we did last year. Let that sink in. We have regressed in nearly every category vs. Manuela Diaz, and that's with an incredibly soft first 4 games of the schedule.
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That's not surprising, nor is it a red flag. When you're trying to get a certain negative mindset out of a program, the first step is often backwards.
 
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