Candidate Profile

[Biscayne]

John Shoop is so bad as an OC that Wario's teams had better offensive statistics than UNC.

 

[NVA CANE]

Does it worry anyone else he never had a winning record in the very division he would be coaching here? Or that his predecessor has fared better than he did? Or that his overall profile is very similar to Golden's?

His time at the U was 16 seasons ago, and in a completely different conference. He did beat Florida State once in an epic comeback and Wide Right III. Otherwise his teams were crushed by Florida State (yes, we were decimated by probation).

Butch vs. Florida State: 1-4 (162-78)

Golden vs. Florida State: 0-5 (156-103)

I'm a Butch fan, but I just want to point out there's real risk with Butch, no matter how you want to spin it. There were real concerns with his gameday coaching when he was here, and while in the exact same division we are in now, he never really experienced great success. He certainly never outperformed his talent level at UNC.

I'm just hoping for some actual discussion about the candidates and what they bring, rather than some of tail chasing drivel I've seen lately (and really longer than lately).

Exactly what I've been saying. I don't hate Butch and would gladly take him back if we strike out on some elite guys and a couple young killers. But you gotta realize what you're getting with him. He'll stock the cupboards, but he has proven repeatedly that he can't always win even with a large talent advantage over his opponents.

No one has an answer for those questions cause they're legitimate concerns. These dudes keep whitewashing the real concerns with a Butch hire and they will be the same mouth breathers that will be asking why we are losing to teams less talented than us in year 3 of his tenure.

They've dug their heels in so deeply that they won't be questioning Davis when he Davises against some inferior opponent because they've got too much invested in him. They'll just make excuses and blame it all on Folden and talk about culture and all that bullshyt.

God **** that's truth.

 

[poncho0091]

Does it worry anyone else he never had a winning record in the very division he would be coaching here? Or that his predecessor has fared better than he did? Or that his overall profile is very similar to Golden's?

His time at the U was 16 seasons ago, and in a completely different conference. He did beat Florida State once in an epic comeback and Wide Right III. Otherwise his teams were crushed by Florida State (yes, we were decimated by probation).

Butch vs. Florida State: 1-4 (162-78)

Golden vs. Florida State: 0-5 (156-103)

I'm a Butch fan, but I just want to point out there's real risk with Butch, no matter how you want to spin it. There were real concerns with his gameday coaching when he was here, and while in the exact same division we are in now, he never really experienced great success. He certainly never outperformed his talent level at UNC.

I'm just hoping for some actual discussion about the candidates and what they bring, rather than some of tail chasing drivel I've seen lately (and really longer than lately).

Exactly what I've been saying. I don't hate Butch and would gladly take him back if we strike out on some elite guys and a couple young killers. But you gotta realize what you're getting with him. He'll stock the cupboards, but he has proven repeatedly that he can't always win even with a large talent advantage over his opponents.

No one has an answer for those questions cause they're legitimate concerns. These dudes keep whitewashing the real concerns with a Butch hire and they will be the same mouth breathers that will be asking why we are losing to teams less talented than us in year 3 of his tenure.

They've dug their heels in so deeply that they won't be questioning Davis when he Davises against some inferior opponent because they've got too much invested in him. They'll just make excuses and blame it all on Folden and talk about culture and all that bullshyt.

It's hilarious watching people talk about someone digging in heels and spouting off facts, but then they ignore counter facts (such as Butch beat FSU at UNC, or UNC is playing a super soft schedule, or Butch did not create the NCAA issue), they ignore or try to downplay situations like 30 lost scholarships as if it was nothing, or even better ignore someone giving them an answer, because they don't want to read it because it's long.

Spout your numbers if you want, but keep in mind the surrounding circumstances. The truth is that Butch has never taken a team that was elite. The Miami team he took over had some studs, but the overall team was not that great and he was in his first HC job, yet he still did a respectable job. By the time he got the team past sanctions and the team was rolling (because people forgot he went 11-1 and got robbed of a shot at the National Title), he moved onto a bad, expansion Cleveland Browns team where he is still the only coach to make the playoffs with them, which he then moved onto a bad (3-9) UNC team.

I'm not guaranteeing Butch is going to win it all, but I'll gladly take my chances and he is a better option than the realistic options we have. People seem to forget how our last 3 coaching searches have gone where everyone posts a big name and we end up with the bottom of the barrel and no big name. Butch is a big name and he wants to come. If we don't get Butch, it's going to be Cristobal or Schiano. Herman and Fuente are going elsewhere and we are rolling the dice on all these up and comers. We know what we have in Butch and I'm perfectly comfortable with that. Davis deserves a shot after the school tried to be cheap with him last time and he left for the NFL. If it doesn't work, so be it, but I'll be more excited about a Butch return than any realistic coach mentioned (Chip, Strong, and Gundy are not coming).

 

[OrangetieFatface]

Here's an actual answer.

The administration has proved themselves to be bordering on incompetent.

A lack of communication and no real power structure.

They'll just as easily hire Cristobal after Alabama wins a CFBP, or maybe even some back room bargain shleb none of us have even heard of. They don't watch football.

By applying a touch of context to his career, it's reasonable to believe that Butch Davis will make us relevant and leave us in good shape. Maybe he mismanages some games... Whatever.

Who knows, maybe 4 years from now Frenk will blossom and hire an Actual Athletic director who can competently make decisions and tell the Whigs to suck his ******* and let him do his job.

But until then I'll take Butch Davis and whatever baggage he comes with. I'd rather not leave it in these idiots hands and just hope they get lucky.

 

[MIATL]

I don't want any candidate who wouldn't/won't be considered for the South Carolina gig.

That program was completely irrelevant before Holtz got there, and experienced significant success with Spurrier. They've actually had success bringing old dudes back from the dead!

If Butch is a candidate for them, then I'd be ok with him being in the mix for us. But if NO OTHER SCHOOL has an interest, I don't want him, either.

The nostalgia angle from so many of y'all is ridiculous!

Butch did NOT build Jimmy's teams! "Recruiting coordinator" is an added title to get coaches more money. Jimmy built those team! And you know who the DC was when Butch was on staff at Miami? It was Wannstedt. Butch was a position coach. To put it in simplest terms, Butch was Brennan Carroll when he was on Jimmy's staff. Nobody is giving Carroll credit for our roster, so stop giving Butch credit for Jimmy's roster.

And by default, that means Butch doesn't get credit for Erickson's roster, either.

Butch built his team. Greatest collection of college talent, ever! That's his legacy! He should have stayed to finish what he started, but he bolted back to the league. I'm not knocking him for going to the NFL ... But it was his choice.

Now, he wants to coach again ... Sees an opportunity with Miami. But so what?!? There have been a ton of top jobs open over the last 3 years, and he hasn't been mentioned for any of them, except of Miami boards. Fans worried about him going to Texas or Florida, and he wasn't even in consideration.

There are reasons no ADs are pursuing Butch. We should trust that paid professionals have some insight to things beyond what someone did 15 years ago ...

People keeping claiming we know what we're going to get ... But you don't know anything!

I'm willing to wager some of the folks posting on this site about the talent Butch will bring were also talking about how great it was to get James Coley from FSU, and that he was going to "put a fence up". Lol

No such thing as a fence! Win games, get your pick of kids. It's not about relationships, or about what someone did 15 years ago.

And check the NFL ... We've already had a coach for the past 4+ years who "stocked the cupboard". We need a coach to win ... Now!

 

[RickyDaKing]

Butch Butch and more Butch. Thanks.

 

[MIA42178]

Add this to candidate B.
Previously took NFL team that hasn't been to playoffs in thirty years to playoffs.
Previously took team w 31 scholarship losses over three years to 11-1 and sugar bowl win over Florida.

Or you can just go w his UNC record to suit your agenda.

 

[MIATL]

Do we also add that the NFL team that made the playoffs was a wild card team, based on multiple tie breakers, and finished with a 9-7 record?

Or that the coach followed that success with back to back losing seasons?

Probably depends on if you are Team BBB, or not ...

 

[niner]

Myth he took over a team with only "some" studs? Teams he took over had 10 players drafted in 96 and 97, including 4 first rounders. How much talent do you need to beat a 7-5 UCLA team or ECU?

 

[Billy D Williams]

If his name ain't a former Cane HC named Butch Johnson then the answer is NO! Lots of guys with "positive" or "negative" stats I like, including Butch.

 

[HurricaneVision]

Add this to candidate B.
Previously took NFL team that hasn't been to playoffs in thirty years to playoffs.
Previously took team w 31 scholarship losses over three years to 11-1 and sugar bowl win over Florida.

Or you can just go w his UNC record to suit your agenda.

There's no agenda. That is factual information about a candidate and their performance as a coach within the past 15 years. Is it your position the information we have from 15 years ago- and a different conference- is more pertinent than information from this decade and in the same division?

Sometimes as fans we make more of a situation than it is. This is a simple exercise to get individuals to think. When faced with information that we might not like, wouldn't it make more sense to consider it and understand why it occurred, rather than ignore or deflect it?

 

[HurricaneVision]

If his name ain't a former Cane HC named Butch Johnson then the answer is NO! Lots of guys with "positive" or "negative" stats I like, including Butch.

This is the smartest post yet. Take the combined talents of Butch (eye for talent and developing that talent) with Jimmy's ability to build a coaching staff and mold talented players into a cohesive group.

Bam! Butch Johnson is born.

 

[D.L.I.N.K.D.A.GR8]

Besides Herman and Fuente. These guys need serious serious serious consideration:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dino_Babers

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jeff_Brohm

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hue_Jackson

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dave_Aranda
Paul Chryst is NOT the reason the badgers are 8-2 he is....

Call Gary Patterson, Bob Stoops (yeah big game Bob not lil game mark) Mark D'antonio

If we can't land any of those then ala butch. I think all of those guys with the exception of Aranada would be home run hires. Aranada with be a first time coach but he does wonders with his defenses. We all know defense wins games.

 

[Cane Dynasty]

Myth he took over a team with only "some" studs? Teams he took over had 10 players drafted in 96 and 97, including 4 first rounders. How much talent do you need to beat a 7-5 UCLA team or ECU?

Admit nothing. Deny everything. Make counter accusations.