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Attrition and signing #s question

ghost2

Retired staff
Joined
Nov 3, 2011
Messages
4,466
Not sure if this is "recruiting" or just "football" so I'm posting it on both boards:

Can somebody smarter than me (re: most of the board) remind me how and if our offseason attrition affects our recruiting numbers?

I know some of the hard/fast numbers: 85 total schollies, 25 signees per class. We have up to 11 EEs (a few are still waiting.) Do the players who we just found out are leaving affect this year's recruiting class at all?
 

John77

Junior
Joined
Jan 14, 2012
Messages
2,752
It allows us to bring in more recruits, but the coaches probably already factored attrition into how many they plan on signing so I doubt it will have an affect.

Pete reported in the past that this class should be 28-30. That number indicates the coaches are expecting even more attrition.
 

DerekDohrman

Senior
Joined
Dec 18, 2012
Messages
2,761
Not sure if this is "recruiting" or just "football" so I'm posting it on both boards:

Can somebody smarter than me (re: most of the board) remind me how and if our offseason attrition affects our recruiting numbers?

I know some of the hard/fast numbers: 85 total schollies, 25 signees per class. We have up to 11 EEs (a few are still waiting.) Do the players who we just found out are leaving affect this year's recruiting class at all?


yes.

it will depend on how many of the 10 EE's are allowed to count towards last year's class & how many scholarship kids we now currently have on our roster heading into 2017.

more or less:

start at 25. for every EE that counts towards the 2016 class, add 1 to the 25. that is your absolute MAX you can sign.

start at 85, subtract how many scholarship kids we have returning for 2017. that number is the absolute MAX you can enroll for your 2017 class.

you need two numbers to truly know the answer to our class size:

1. the amount of kids we signed that actually COUNTED towards our 2016 class(keeping in mind that some 2016 kids were EE's that counted towards 2015).
2. the amount of kids we currently have on our roster with eligibility left that are actually on a football scholarship.
 
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Al Foil

Coach Pepe MAGA!
Joined
Feb 5, 2015
Messages
2,866
Cannot go over 85 scholarship players at any time.

Maximum of 25 new enrolled football scholarships per term.

However, early enrollees can retroactively be counted to the prior class assuming it did not have a full 25 players enroll.

Example...

23 players enroll in May 2015 at Miami.

You can bring in a maximum of 2 spring enrollees in January 2016 and count it back to the 2015 class.

A maximum of 25 can enroll in May 2016 provided you do not go over 85 total.

YOU CAN NEVER GO OVER 85 TOTAL ENROLLED SCHOLARSHIP PLAYERS. Commitments don't factor in, only enrollees.

If you don't understand that please stop trying. You are just dumb.
 

90scane

Sophomore
Joined
Dec 26, 2015
Messages
1,531
DerekDohrman pretty much nailed it. We can assume most of the '16 EEs were '15 class counters. Most of the '17 EEs will likely count toward '16. Our limiter will be the 85. As of today, I believe we are at around 25-26 spots. Come May, I expect another 4-5 departures from kids that won't play another down at Miami.
 

90scane

Sophomore
Joined
Dec 26, 2015
Messages
1,531
Cannot go over 85 scholarship players at any time.

25 new scholarships per term.

However, early enrollees can retroactively be counted to the prior class assuming it did not have a full 25 players enroll.

Example...

23 players enroll in May 2015 at Miami.

You can bring in a maximum of 2 spring enrollees in January 2016 and count it back to the 2015 class.

A maximum of 25 can enroll in May 2016 provided you do not go over 25 total.

YOU CAN NEVER GO OVER 85 TOTAL ENROLLED SCHOLARSHIP PLAYERS. Commitments don't factor in, only enrollees.

If you don't understand that please stop trying. You are just dumb.

Well, you assume all 23 in 2015 counted toward '15. We had 5 EEs so the number is likely closer to 18 than 23.

2015 class: 18 spring/summer/fall, 5 EEs ('14 counters) leaving 7 open for '16 EEs
2016 class: 14 spring/summer/fall, 6 EEs ('15 counters) leaving 11 open for '17 EEs (Added LSU Transfer Brown)
2017 class: ? spring/summer/fall, 11 EEs ('16 counters)

I don't know of all the inbound transfers which also count. The Marshill FB may have used a '16 counter as an example.

The only other important number is 105 for the total roster spots.
 

DerekDohrman

Senior
Joined
Dec 18, 2012
Messages
2,761
transfers, including 5th year grad transfers & juco's do count as incoming counters against the 25 limit.

giving a walk-on a scholarship counts as an initial counter against the 25 IF that scholarship is granted within the players first 2 years on campus.

you can count EE's towards last year's class up to that class filling up to 25. once it reaches its' 25 max, the EE's will count towards your current years class.

In order to know the true number, you have to be able to trace the actual countable #'s back several years.
 

iLoveTDs

Junior
Joined
Dec 30, 2014
Messages
2,964
Not sure if this is "recruiting" or just "football" so I'm posting it on both boards:

Can somebody smarter than me (re: most of the board) remind me how and if our offseason attrition affects our recruiting numbers?

I know some of the hard/fast numbers: 85 total schollies, 25 signees per class. We have up to 11 EEs (a few are still waiting.) Do the players who we just found out are leaving affect this year's recruiting class at all?


yes.

it will depend on how many of the 10 EE's are allowed to count towards last year's class & how many scholarship kids we now currently have on our roster heading into 2017.

more or less:

start at 25. for every EE that counts towards the 2016 class, add 1 to the 25. that is your absolute MAX you can sign.

start at 85, subtract how many scholarship kids we have returning for 2017. that number is the absolute MAX you can enroll for your 2017 class.

you need two numbers to truly know the answer to our class size:

1. the amount of kids we signed that actually COUNTED towards our 2016 class(keeping in mind that some 2016 kids were EE's that counted towards 2015).
2. the amount of kids we currently have on our roster with eligibility left that are actually on a football scholarship.

So if it has to be 25 + EEs towards last year (let's say there's 8 EE)... 33 would be the max even if our team total schollies is 80?

Why can't we bring in 38 (I know we wouldn't want to do that) to hit our 85 schollies mark?
 
Last edited:

ghost2

Retired staff
Joined
Nov 3, 2011
Messages
4,466
If we had 80 on scholly (I don't know that we do, I don't have the numbers but just for the sake of argument):

Let's say we're losing Kaaya, Yearby, Edwards, Gray, Williams, Coley, Lewis, Njoku, Dobard, Isidora, Gall, Knighton, Loftus, C. Jenkins, Elder, Colbert, R. Jenkins, Carter, Mayes, Henley, and Vogel - that's 21 guys taking us down to 59 scholarship players. (Let me know if I miss somebody.)

That would give us 85-59 = 26 open spots on the 2017 roster. So no matter what, we would have to enroll 26 guys in 2017 to stay at 85 or below...right?

Again, I'm not sure we have 80 on scholarship right now, it might actually be less, but either way, that's the process, yes?
 

Cane6

Freshman
Joined
Nov 6, 2015
Messages
2,350
With a team like Miami that is just coming off reduced scholarships, are there any exceptions to the 25 ships per calendar year class?
 

Ohio_Cane

WE NOT BACK....
Joined
Dec 5, 2012
Messages
3,949
If we had 80 on scholly (I don't know that we do, I don't have the numbers but just for the sake of argument):

Let's say we're losing Kaaya, Yearby, Edwards, Gray, Williams, Coley, Lewis, Njoku, Dobard, Isidora, Gall, Knighton, Loftus, C. Jenkins, Elder, Colbert, R. Jenkins, Carter, Mayes, Henley, and Vogel - that's 21 guys taking us down to 59 scholarship players. (Let me know if I miss somebody.)

That would give us 85-59 = 26 open spots on the 2017 roster. So no matter what, we would have to enroll 26 guys in 2017 to stay at 85 or below...right?

Again, I'm not sure we have 80 on scholarship right now, it might actually be less, but either way, that's the process, yes?

Correct. IF that were the numbers. I believe we don't have 80 right now, though.
 

DerekDohrman

Senior
Joined
Dec 18, 2012
Messages
2,761
If we had 80 on scholly (I don't know that we do, I don't have the numbers but just for the sake of argument):

Let's say we're losing Kaaya, Yearby, Edwards, Gray, Williams, Coley, Lewis, Njoku, Dobard, Isidora, Gall, Knighton, Loftus, C. Jenkins, Elder, Colbert, R. Jenkins, Carter, Mayes, Henley, and Vogel - that's 21 guys taking us down to 59 scholarship players. (Let me know if I miss somebody.)

That would give us 85-59 = 26 open spots on the 2017 roster. So no matter what, we would have to enroll 26 guys in 2017 to stay at 85 or below...right?

Again, I'm not sure we have 80 on scholarship right now, it might actually be less, but either way, that's the process, yes?


yes, that's essentially the process.

and, that 85 doesnt really come into play until fall 2017, so kids(not yet on your list) leaving between now and then will open up more spots.
 

AV1994

Redshirt Freshman
Joined
Sep 8, 2015
Messages
268
If we had 80 on scholly (I don't know that we do, I don't have the numbers but just for the sake of argument):

Let's say we're losing Kaaya, Yearby, Edwards, Gray, Williams, Coley, Lewis, Njoku, Dobard, Isidora, Gall, Knighton, Loftus, C. Jenkins, Elder, Colbert, R. Jenkins, Carter, Mayes, Henley, and Vogel - that's 21 guys taking us down to 59 scholarship players. (Let me know if I miss somebody.)

That would give us 85-59 = 26 open spots on the 2017 roster. So no matter what, we would have to enroll 26 guys in 2017 to stay at 85 or below...right?

Again, I'm not sure we have 80 on scholarship right now, it might actually be less, but either way, that's the process, yes?

Correct. IF that were the numbers. I believe we don't have 80 right now, though.

I remember reading somewhere on this site that we had around 78. Could be wrong, but for some reason thats the number I keep remembering.
 

DerekDohrman

Senior
Joined
Dec 18, 2012
Messages
2,761
Cannot go over 85 scholarship players at any time.

25 new scholarships per term.

However, early enrollees can retroactively be counted to the prior class assuming it did not have a full 25 players enroll.

Example...

23 players enroll in May 2015 at Miami.

You can bring in a maximum of 2 spring enrollees in January 2016 and count it back to the 2015 class.

A maximum of 25 can enroll in May 2016 provided you do not go over 25 total.

YOU CAN NEVER GO OVER 85 TOTAL ENROLLED SCHOLARSHIP PLAYERS. Commitments don't factor in, only enrollees.

If you don't understand that please stop trying. You are just dumb.

Well, you assume all 23 in 2015 counted toward '15. We had 5 EEs so the number is likely closer to 18 than 23.

2015 class: 18 spring/summer/fall, 5 EEs ('14 counters) leaving 7 open for '16 EEs
2016 class: 14 spring/summer/fall, 6 EEs ('15 counters) leaving 11 open for '17 EEs (Added LSU Transfer Brown)
2017 class: ? spring/summer/fall, 11 EEs ('16 counters)

I don't know of all the inbound transfers which also count. The Marshill FB may have used a '16 counter as an example.

The only other important number is 105 for the total roster spots.


i actually have our 2015 class as being full at 25 before any 2016 EE's were able to count against it. (this includes transfer gerald willis & assumes badgley and vogel were given scholarships, which was reported to be true, and assumes 2014 was maxed out so that no 2015 EE's could count towards it)

i have 22 kids as counting towards our 2016 class(includes transfers marquez williams, george brown, Adrian Colbert, and yes, sam bruce counts too).

which would mean we'd be able to max out at 28 kids for 2017, with 3 of the EE's counting towards 2016.
 
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CaneStuck@USF

Junior
Joined
Jan 27, 2012
Messages
1,925
Richt is going to self impose scholly reductions so that when we win #6 , its that much more impressive. Gotta love his bravado.
 

ghost2

Retired staff
Joined
Nov 3, 2011
Messages
4,466
If we had 80 on scholly (I don't know that we do, I don't have the numbers but just for the sake of argument):

Let's say we're losing Kaaya, Yearby, Edwards, Gray, Williams, Coley, Lewis, Njoku, Dobard, Isidora, Gall, Knighton, Loftus, C. Jenkins, Elder, Colbert, R. Jenkins, Carter, Mayes, Henley, and Vogel - that's 21 guys taking us down to 59 scholarship players. (Let me know if I miss somebody.)

That would give us 85-59 = 26 open spots on the 2017 roster. So no matter what, we would have to enroll 26 guys in 2017 to stay at 85 or below...right?

Again, I'm not sure we have 80 on scholarship right now, it might actually be less, but either way, that's the process, yes?

Correct. IF that were the numbers. I believe we don't have 80 right now, though.

I think you're right. Let's count - (somebody check my math):

2016 Roster -
QB (4) - Allison, Kaaya, Rosier, Sherriffs
RB/FB (6) - Williams, Edwards, Gray, Homer, Walton, Yearby
WR (8) - Berrios, Cager, Coley, Harris, Langham, Lewis, Mullins, Richards
TE (4) - Haskins, Herdon, Irvin, Njoku
OL (14) - Brown, Darling, Gall, Gauthier, Isidora, Johnson, Jones, Knighton, Linder, Mahoney, McDermott, Milo, Odogwu, St. Louis
DL (14) - Bethel, Dobard, Fines, Harris, DJackson, JJackson, Jenkins, Martin, McIntosh, Moten, Norton, Patchan, Thomas, Willis
LB (8) - Gordinier, McClould, McCray, Owens, Perry, Pinckney, Quarterman, Smith
DB (14) - Carter, Colbert, Elder, Finley, Henley, Jackson, James, Jenkins, Johnson, Knowles, Mayes, Redwine, Wright, Young
K/P (2) - Badgley, Vogel

I come up with 74 scholarship players unless I'm missing somebody.
 

ghost2

Retired staff
Joined
Nov 3, 2011
Messages
4,466
Cannot go over 85 scholarship players at any time.

25 new scholarships per term.

However, early enrollees can retroactively be counted to the prior class assuming it did not have a full 25 players enroll.

Example...

23 players enroll in May 2015 at Miami.

You can bring in a maximum of 2 spring enrollees in January 2016 and count it back to the 2015 class.

A maximum of 25 can enroll in May 2016 provided you do not go over 25 total.

YOU CAN NEVER GO OVER 85 TOTAL ENROLLED SCHOLARSHIP PLAYERS. Commitments don't factor in, only enrollees.

If you don't understand that please stop trying. You are just dumb.

Well, you assume all 23 in 2015 counted toward '15. We had 5 EEs so the number is likely closer to 18 than 23.

2015 class: 18 spring/summer/fall, 5 EEs ('14 counters) leaving 7 open for '16 EEs
2016 class: 14 spring/summer/fall, 6 EEs ('15 counters) leaving 11 open for '17 EEs (Added LSU Transfer Brown)
2017 class: ? spring/summer/fall, 11 EEs ('16 counters)

I don't know of all the inbound transfers which also count. The Marshill FB may have used a '16 counter as an example.

The only other important number is 105 for the total roster spots.


i actually have our 2015 class as being full at 25 before any 2016 EE's were able to count against it. (this assumes badgley and vogel were given scholarships, which was reported to be true)

i have 22 kids as counting towards our 2016 class.

which would mean we'd be able to max out at 28 kids for 2017, with 3 of the EE's counting towards 2016.

Sweet - thanks for doing the legwork on that! So we're sitting at 20 commits right now with room for 8 more (give or take.)
 
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