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3rd down conversion

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We’re far from a great team. Tons of holes. Yesterday’s results are semi-useless. But it was still fun and relaxing to watch.

We’ll still struggle every week against P5 teams because we don’t do anything particularly well yet. I can see us hammering a decent P5 team when we click in all 3 phases and then turn around the next week and lose to a team we were favored to beat.

Much of that has to do with the holes like this 3rd Down inefficiency.
 
atlCanesFan said:
One has to wonder how 3rd down efficiency can be so bad now going into our 3rd regime. Coaches have come and gone, same as players, how does this remain a constant ?
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Ol? How many of the third downs were third and shorts? I know we had a big issue concerting those in the past
 
I wonder how many of the 3rd downs had a penalty or sack in the 1st/2nd down play leading to 3rd and 5+ yards vs. 3rd and short. Just asking as I'm not going to look at the 34 cases.
 
LuCane said:
We’re definitely in ‘protectionist’ mode. I think the obvious reason for that is our inability to click on OL. For multiple reasons.
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OT to this thread, anyone see Diaz rip into Baker on that 3rd down TO before the fumble? They still converted the play but I thought that was tepidly interesting.
 
hopefully "issaih" walker sees that he can probably start day 1 next year.
 
brock said:
The oline personnel is still not there. Still seeing guys penetrating on 3rd and short/4th and short etc . Got to recruit better on the oline it’s simple. Also the plays with the fullback in on 3rd and short aren’t necessarily working that well imo
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Nelson and Clark were both good on some snaps and sieves on others. They will keep getting better. But when I see a 3-year starter and Freshman AA in Donaldson still making bigtime mistakes against a team of Bethune's caliber, I just don't understand what the **** Searels and Felder were doing. I hope Barry and Feeley can make strides quickly.
 
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LuCane said:
Yesterday's game doesn't need to be deeply analyzed but for a handful of aspects that can actually carry over into meaningful games. Of the very few, the primary one I've watched since the beginning of the season is 3rd down conversion rate.

We didn't convert our first 3rd down until 6 minutes left in the 3rd quarter. The 4/9 3rd down conversion final stat is skewed by the backups in the 4th quarter, as we were 0/5 with the starters until that mid-3rd quarter conversion.

Coming into the game, we were something like 127th of 130 teams in this metric. We'll likely still be in the 100s, as we're now 9/34 on the season for 26.4%.

Make of it what you will.
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Lu,

We are weak in the trenches. Its been a while since I played the game, but usually a poor red zone/3 down conversion team is missing the horses up front. It may improve as we move through the year (as the line gels) but the fact is we are slow on block pickups, stunts, etc and our communications across the line is still lacking. Also, and this has been going on for a while, there is still a lack of awareness among skill players where the first down stick are. Its floors me when a TE or receiver breaks 1 or 2 yards in front of the sticks and doesn't get the first down. Hopefully all of this gets fixed, but I think we have a ways to go. We struggle to get OL recruits. And up till now even harder time developing them. I do like our OL coach. I think he is the first quality guy we have had since Jeff Stoutland. So with a season or two under his belt he can turn this group around...as long as we can recruit guys that can play.
 
IMO we are still going under center and running slow developing plays out of the power I far too often, and I think that is contributing to the poor 3rd and 4th down conversion rates. We seem to move the ball very well out of a spread formation/shotgun, but then Enos goes back to playing in a phone booth in short yardage situations, or he does it on 1st or 2nd down for no gain which puts us in 3rd and long situations.

We do not have the OL to line it up and impose our will on opposing defenses. I hope Enos eventually realizes this. Our most explosive plays have generally come out of the shotgun and spread formations. The TD to Harley was a good example of this. We got the ball to one of our fastest players in space and let him make a play. And it seems like any time we run the ball out of that formation it goes for a positive game instead of TFL.
 
We’re going to continue to have 3rd down issues until we can field a serviceable OL.

Would REALLY like to see Williams use his legs even just a little more. That conversion % (both in general and in red zone) would inevitably go up if he did. Unfortunately he always seems to pass first. Some designed run plays might help.
 
fllcane said:
Lu,

We are weak in the trenches. Its been a while since I played the game, but usually a poor red zone/3 down conversion team is missing the horses up front. It may improve as we move through the year (as the line gels) but the fact is we are slow on block pickups, stunts, etc and our communications across the line is still lacking. Also, and this has been going on for a while, there is still a lack of awareness among skill players where the first down stick are. Its floors me when a TE or receiver breaks 1 or 2 yards in front of the sticks and doesn't get the first down. Hopefully all of this gets fixed, but I think we have a ways to go. We struggle to get OL recruits. And up till now even harder time developing them. I do like our OL coach. I think he is the first quality guy we have had since Jeff Stoutland. So with a season or two under his belt he can turn this group around...as long as we can recruit guys that can play.
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Our OL right now, even in a game against Bethune, is like playing Whack a Mole. When there's a good playcall, 2 guys make good blocks, then one guy totally breaks down. I don't know if it'll come together soon enough, but it's fairly crazy to watch. You hit on a lot of the root causes.
 
5Rings&an Asterisk said:
We had nearly 500 yards last week and 600 yards this week. That's a good day on offense no matter what. That poor 3rd down conversion percentage is interesting. We have to ripping chunks of yards on first and second to avoid third downs. Is the problem, that we're not setting ourselves up for manageable third downs with our first and second down play calling and or execution?
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Not a good day when you arent scoring enough points to win
 
Pleased with direction of offense though. We have committed to a balance attack Ratio pass/run is good. The 3rd conversion will improve has the season / OL develops
 
brock said:
The oline personnel is still not there. Still seeing guys penetrating on 3rd and short/4th and short etc . Got to recruit better on the oline it’s simple. Also the plays with the fullback in on 3rd and short aren’t necessarily working that well imo
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In the 3rd and short situations I would like to see less long developing run plays. Maybe see more PA off the running game or some counter/misdirection. Play off the aggressiveness of the defense trying to stop a usual running down.
 
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LuCane said:
Impossible to react to an 0-2 start and ‘clean’ everything up. Just ignore **** and try to have relevant football discussions.... is my best attempt.
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There areas for improvement and areas we've gotten better. The problem is when people focus entirely on the negative. It makes reading anything a chore.
 
LuCane said:
Yesterday's game doesn't need to be deeply analyzed but for a handful of aspects that can actually carry over into meaningful games. Of the very few, the primary one I've watched since the beginning of the season is 3rd down conversion rate.

We didn't convert our first 3rd down until 6 minutes left in the 3rd quarter. The 4/9 3rd down conversion final stat is skewed by the backups in the 4th quarter, as we were 0/5 with the starters until that mid-3rd quarter conversion.

Coming into the game, we were something like 127th of 130 teams in this metric. We'll likely still be in the 100s, as we're now 9/34 on the season for 26.4%.

Make of it what you will.
Click to expand...
Enos might not be the answer! Took me three games to see that!
 
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