forums

15 - 17, best finish was tied for 3rd in the Coastal twice..

INCaneFan

INCaneFan

Band
Banned
Joined
Nov 5, 2011
Messages
3,240
So explain this to me....

15 - 17 ACC Coatal record, that's Butch at UNC. Four of those wins came against us, with what people were saying was our worst coach in history, Randy Shannon. People prop those wins up as something special, but should they? I think not, but for the record, Randy had a better ACC record than Butch albeit barely. Golden Al, he was 17 - 18, so it's a push.

Moving on, let's look at where his Tarheels finished in the Coastal.

He tied for 3rd and finished 4th his other two season. Randy Shannon finished 2nd and 3rd (no tie, but outright) and our worst coach ever tied for 1st once and tied for 2nd another time. Both of our last two coaches had higher finishes in the Coastal and were fired.

Butch never finished the season ranked at UNC, that's alarming as well. Even Randy had one season ranked, Al never.

Butch's best record at UNC was 8 - 5, he did that three times. He never managed 9 wins, something Randy and Al both did. To his credit, if you want to call it that, he did win a bowl game while neither of our past coaches managed that. Don't get too excited, he was 1 for 3 in that department

Final four year record for Butch at UNC, 28 - 23. Randy was 28 - 22. Al was 32 - 25.

Butch versus his school's arch rival in football, NC State....0 - 4. That's basically Golden-esque with us against FSU.

Yes, UNC is different than Miami, but he got talent there as all the Butch people are proud to point out with the NFL first rounders and overall draftees. So where were all the results? People justifiably hammer Golden for his lack of results last year with the NFL talent on the team, why does Butch get a pass? Suspensions, then don't bring up the Maryland game, we had suspensions there so we'll excuse that going forward.

So if we hire this guy, nobody would with his recent resume, he'll assemble a great staff some are saying. Riddle me this then, why didn't he at UNC?

Butch did something amazing a decade and a half ago, but since then I'm completely unimpressed. If not for ancient history, he looks just like the last two guys we've fired. I don't care to hear excuses, we didn't excuse their results, why should we Butch?
 
Advertisement
proxy.php
 
I'm right there with you IN. There are definite questions and red flags about Butch. He wouldn't be the worst hire because we all know he's an incredible evaluator of talent but what will he do on game day when he doesn't have the greatest college football team ever to coach?
 
Advertisement
trolls. close thread & stop this nonsense. this is like the 4th thread about this same thing.
 
Ok, lets talk about the 2010 season, the NFL talent that got drafted, and the 13 players who were suspended.

First round, player 14, Robert Quinn. Suspended the entire year. That means did not play one game in 2010.
Second round 40th player overall, Bruce Carter. Missed the last three games of the season with a knee injury. Team 2-1
Second round 54th player overall, Marvin Austin. Suspended the entire year. That means did not play one game in 2010.
Second round 57th player overall, Greg Little. Suspended the entire year. That means did not play one game in 2010.
Fourth round 10th player overall, Da'Norris Searcy. Missed the first three games of the year. Team 1-2
Fifth round 133th player overall, Johnny White. Converted to running back in 2010. Season ending injury in 9th game. Team 2-2
Fifth round 152 player overall, T.J. Yates. Played the whole year 19td- 9int. Has started 5 games in the NFL with 3tds and 7 int. 70.3 rating.
Sixth round 171st player overall, Quan Sturdivant. Played 8 games hard to say how the team did without him but I think they only lost one game while he was gone.
Seventh round 218th player overall, Ryan Taylor. Played in every game.

So, of the players four drafted in the first two rounds, Butch got a total of one guy for 10 games. That's a lot of talent missing, so saying "he had all this talent but couldn't win the Corstal" is smoke and mirrors bull****. Of the nine guys drafted only two of them were available every game. Three of the five losses are by less than a TD. Stop it with this argument already.

Season end ranked teams he beat 4. Ranked teams he beat - 8.

2010 was the year UNC was expected to bust out. That was #BBB 's fourth year, and about where everyone expects a coach to show real progress when he inherits a dumpster fire like UNC. Only two of #BBB 's "NFL talent" played the whole year. He still managed to beat two teams that finished the season ranked.
 
Are you actually comparing what Randy Shannon inherited at UM with what Butch Davis inherited at UNC?

Apples to oranges my friend.
 
Advertisement
Butch beat Miami three out of the four years he was at UNC. The only year he lost was 2010 when his whole team was suspended.
 
Thank you for the correction.

Still a good many excuses for pedestrian win / loss results going on here.
 
So the fact that he made UNC relevant in football, had them competing in games with a bunch of first rounders doesn't mean anything?
Again, NORTH CAROLINA?? Butch even freaking beat us 3 out of 4 times while he was there! With the players HE chose and the players HE developed.

I have a few friends from North Carolina who even today still say "We want Butch back".
 
Advertisement
Anybody seen what Justin Fuente is doing at "a basketball school"?

Anybody know the last time Memphis was relevant in football? ... The last time Memphis won 10 games during a football season? ... What the Memphis record was before he got there?

If y'all think Butch could do damage at Miami, just imagine what Fuente could do!!!

Oh ... And I'm pretty sure Howard S. would give Fuente his stamp of approval. :rickflair2:
 
Op is a ****, but this is a legitimate topic of conversation, and I've yet to see even a good reason for Butch struggling so badly in the coastal with such good talent. I can understand a year or two of struggling while he beefed up that roster, but he struggled the entire time.

I like Butch because we know his floor (likely 9 wins per year) and we know that he will stock the cupboard like no one else ever has. But there are legitimate questions if he's a guy who can consistently compete for championships.
 
The two years before butch 5-19. Butch had three years at UNC. His last year doesn't count as everyone was suspended. So 8 wins was a huge improvement for them but because he was such a good recruiter it felt like a disappointment in 2009. However, we've seen here personally sometimes really talented teams have a tough year before they take off. Jimmy lost five games with a talented team then they took off. Butch had tough losses in 1999 with a talented team but we already know what happened after that.

Judging a guy with three seasons at a team that won 3 games for years before he got there is stupid. Look at the whole piece of work. That includes a super bowl, creating the best team of all time, taking the browns to the playoffs, and saving our team from death in the 90's.

If it wasn't for Butch, we'd be a bottom feeder. We would have never recovered from the sanctions in 1995 and without the success of the 2000's we wouldn't even be remembered enough to get recruits now.
 
Advertisement
The OP is a Notre Dame fan troll.

However.....

If you wouldn't hire JJ, Tubbs, Howard, or Dennis now, then what makes Butch different?

Coaches have their time in the sun and then they fade. Who knows why, but it happens to all of them. I can't recall a situation where a successful coach returned after 15 years and won it all.
 
AllAboutTheU11 said:
So the fact that he made UNC relevant in football, had them competing in games with a bunch of first rounders doesn't mean anything?
Again, NORTH CAROLINA?? Butch even freaking beat us 3 out of 4 times while he was there! With the players HE chose and the players HE developed.

I have a few friends from North Carolina who even today still say "We want Butch back".
Click to expand...

I don't want to hear people use caveats like "at a non football powerhouse" or "he beat us".

The time to bring back butch was in 2006. More than half the fan base then didn't like that idea b/c "of the way he snuck out on us wahhh wahhh".
 
KevinCaneFace said:
The two years before butch 5-19. Butch had three years at UNC. His last year doesn't count as everyone was suspended. So 8 wins was a huge improvement for them but because he was such a good recruiter it felt like a disappointment in 2009. However, we've seen here personally sometimes really talented teams have a tough year before they take off. Jimmy lost five games with a talented team then they took off. Butch had tough losses in 1999 with a talented team but we already know what happened after that.

Judging a guy with three seasons at a team that won 3 games for years before he got there is stupid. Look at the whole piece of work. That includes a super bowl, creating the best team of all time, taking the browns to the playoffs, and saving our team from death in the 90's.

If it wasn't for Butch, we'd be a bottom feeder. We would have never recovered from the sanctions in 1995 and without the success of the 2000's we wouldn't even be remembered enough to get recruits now.
Click to expand...

Butch should be in the UM Hall of Fame for sure. He accomplished a ton here, and I personally revere the guy. I also revere JJ and Howard, and wouldn't hire them right now b/c that time has past. Most coaching careers have an arc. Even the best ones. I'd rather hire the guy who is at his apex than the guy who was at his apex 15 years ago.
 
Advertisement
Back
Top