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MarioBall

MarioBall

k9cane
k9cane

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First, let me start by saying that I agree with most people in here that Mario must learn to adapt/evolve like other great coaches or he’s going to be in trouble. In Mario’s defense though, I absolutely believe his offensive style/philosophy can work in 2023. The issue is, it’s not built properly at this time to succeed. When you look at Michigan, I think Mario would argue that’s kinda the way he wants his machine to operate while he’s at Miami. Great defense, extremely physical on both sides of the ball, a culture built on toughness, etc. Here’s the problem though - when you look at Michigan what else do you see? You see a team that’s currently ranked #1 in the nation in fewest penalties, #7 in the nation in turnover margin, et. Bottom line…they’re not just a physical team, but a smart one. For contrast, Miami is terrible in both of those categories. And see, there’s the rub. If you’re going to be that kind of team/program there’s very little room for error. Your QB, most of all, needs to protect the football and not turn it over.
 
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skydogcane6 said:
This is purely because I think you know a thing or two and have utilized actual data in your analysis a bit.

Mario is going to be here for a while so this is purely for my own entertainment and curiosity. If you had a clean slate in this moment and financial backing, who are some of your favorite coaches in CFB that you’d be targeting? And you think would realistically take the opportunity. I just enjoy tracking some really good lesser known coaches that maybe I don’t even know.

Would like to hear your thoughts because **** at this point I’d promote Guidry and stick him with a high powered OC. Make it a short term deal with performance escalators and then if things are trending right extend him with a fair raise.
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Thanks for the fair and reasonable post, brother!

I’ll start with experienced and proven winners at the P5 level. My list would be as follows, and in no particular order:

Lane Kiffin - His personality and swag would be a perfect fit for our team. I know that he’s a risk lifestyle wise, but winning at anything in life takes risk taking. Besides, it seems like he’s matured some. He has taken Ole Miss from a bad to middle of the pack program and has made them perennial winners in a way tougher conference than the ACC, and without top notch talent. If he ever wins an SEC title or reaches the playoffs watch out, the floodgates in recruiting will open up for him.

Dan Mullen - He has proven to be an offensive football savant, and his teams typically perform above their talent level. Recruiting would be the concern here. But to me, winning is always the most important part. Win and look good doing it, and then we can easily sell everything else about the U.

Mike Gundy - Another guy high up on my list. Has always done way more with way less. Never has top recruiting classes, but has consistently fielded excellent football teams that play hard and compete on both sides of the ball. Has had multiple 10 win (7 to be exact) seasons as OSU coach, including winning 11 and 12 games. Miami’s BoT and Admin would probably hate him, but that’s a good thing. Those village idiots don’t know what a good football coach is, and have repeatedly proven it to be so.

Tom Herman - I think he would kill it at Miami, and we would actually be able to land most of the top recruits in South Florida. Kids want to play in an exciting kind of offense, not in a meat grinder offense. It seems like our dudes are never healthy since Mario got here. That’s what happens when you run into 8-9 man fronts up the middle with your RB’s repeatedly.

Gary Patterson - Jimmy Johnson endorsed him years ago as our next HC, and of course our idiotIc BoT ignored him. Proven winner and a coach that consistently has his teams prepared.

Hugh Freeze - Way too late now, but he would have been another good hire, in my opinion. Another football coach that doesn’t try to fit square pegs into circles.


Now for the guys with some to no head coach experience at the P5 level:

Dan Lanning - Wishful thinking on my part, but has done a fantastic job of both recruiting and game day coaching during his first two seasons as a HC. His teams are always prepared and play with lots of intelligence and controlled/focused emotion. He’d be nuts to leave Oregon at this point.

Rhett Lashlee - In my opinion, he’s going to do great things at SMU. Player’s coach that can also scheme guys open and isn’t scared to be aggressive on offense. Recruiting at SMU is about to go through the roof.

Jedd Fisch - I’ve followed him since he left the U, and always liked how he molds his offense to fit his player’s strengths. If not for Folden and D’No, we would have won a lot more with him as our OC.
 
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CaneTheGaytors said:
But you’re one of the reasonable posters on this board, and always try to be fair. Some people may not like you for being honest, and some are just jealous of you because of the life you’ve had, and the people that you know or are friends with.

I’ve always respected your input, and appreciated the stories and memorabilia that you share with the board. It keeps those great memories alive of a time that now seems like a century ago.

Hopefully someway, somehow, we’ll be able to get out of this nightmare, and preferably sooner rather than later.
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Look....I like Mario, I know he's a Great father, husband, very good recruiter, and that he Bleeds Orange & Green....but some drastic changes need to be addressed moving forward.
 
www.espn.com

A sputtering offense, a stubborn coach and a $76 million buyout: Inside Jimbo Fisher's Texas A&M downfall

Jimbo Fisher was brought to Texas A&M with a record contract. He now leaves with a record buyout. What went so wrong with the Aggies?
www.espn.com www.espn.com



At least for 2 years (granted Fisher got 6) ...lots of similarities to Fisher with Mario - Mario HAS to change and adapt.

"Modern-day football requires, to me, a certain type of leadership," Bjork said. "You're moving forward and you're making change and you're dialed into what the young men want and what they expect in terms of style of play and the system and the culture and the day-to-day."

Fisher runs a complex, pro-style offense and multiple staffers indicated that while Petrino was calling the plays, a large portion of the plays he was calling were still Fisher's offense.

The offense worked when everything clicked, but proper execution became increasingly difficult with the revolving door at quarterback and the transfer portal leading to the addition of new players unfamiliar with the system.

Even when it didn't work, Fisher stayed the course.

Other schools made Fisher's stagnant offense a point of emphasis. Johntay Cook II, a Texas high school receiver who was No. 32 in the 2023 ESPN 300, told On3 during his recruitment it was a concern.

"A&M has the players but not the scheme," Cook said. "I mean A&M is running like the Wishbone offense. It's cool and all, but if Jimbo opened it up that would be serious."
 
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I didn't believe it when smarter people on here talked about Mario Bro Ball when he was announced as our new head coach, I didn't believe it when he hired Gattass, and last season I gave him a mulligan because he inherited a hot mess. But I am convinced Bro Ball is a real, and that even if we had Lamar Jackson or Tom Brady back there we would still be pounding the rock between the tackles as part of our core offensive philosophy.

But I have a couple questions to the Mario doubters. Ones I honestly can't answer myself. First, do you think we can replicate what he was doing at Oregon or what Harbaugh does at Michigan and consistently get to 10+ wins with Bro Ball? Second, on a related note, let's say we do find a Top 10 QB. Will Mario will loosen the reigns to some degree so that we're more dynamic. Why even bring in a Carr or recruit a Smith if you're not going to weaponize them?

Essentially, I'm hopeful Bro Ball is a base philosophy like Guidry's 4-3 is a base defense, and we go multiple as we build the talent and start trusting our player leadership (which is nonexistent with TVD right now). Wishful thinking?
 
I don't want the goal to be Michigan

For one, im still not sold on antying they have done. They play in a garbage Conference and until proven other wise they will wilt in the Playoff

Physical, maybe, but if you want the team to be physical, look at Bama, look at even Oregon under Lanning. I want a team that can be physical and beat you with the running game but also a team that if need be can score 40 and beat you with pure athletes
 
Mario can win with his style of Bro Ball, but he must have a Wartime Consigliere at OC and let that OC do his thing. Think Lane Kiffin at Bama before he left. That game at FSU was ours for the taking, but we went conservative and playing Not To Lose in the Third, with predictable results.

That's something that will kill us against Louisville and going forward. No 5 Star QB in his right mind will come here just to hand the ball off in a Woody Hayes-style system.

Mario has to decide to trust his OC. If that's Dawson, then so be it. If it's Chip Kelly or someone else, then so be it. I prefer he keep Dawson because I think OC turnover is killing us.
 
DoctorKrazey said:
First, let me start by saying that I agree with most people in here that Mario must learn to adapt/evolve like other great coaches or he’s going to be in trouble. In Mario’s defense though, I absolutely believe his offensive style/philosophy can work in 2023. The issue is, it’s not built properly at this time to succeed. When you look at Michigan, I think Mario would argue that’s kinda the way he wants his machine to operate while he’s at Miami. Great defense, extremely physical on both sides of the ball, a culture built on toughness, etc. Here’s the problem though - when you look at Michigan what else do you see? You see a team that’s currently ranked #1 in the nation in fewest penalties, #7 in the nation in turnover margin, et. Bottom line…they’re not just a physical team, but a smart one. For contrast, Miami is terrible in both of those categories. And see, there’s the rub. If you’re going to be that kind of team/program there’s very little room for error. Your QB, most of all, needs to protect the football and not turn it over.
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Michigan also plays a bunch of ****** Midwest teams.

Their offensive EPA against Ohio State last year was horrible.

That style only works against teams with talent IF the Michigan defense can stop the other team enough to allow Harbaugh to burn possessions.

Michigan has had one game all year with an offensive value generated over 20.

Their defense just dominates Big 10 teams, allowing Harbaugh to play “man ball” until the opposing defense breaks from the battering ram.

But that means you better have an elite defense every year.

And it limits your offensive ceiling, while exposing the floor.

Which is what you see over Mario’s career.

LSU has more 20+ offensive value generated games this year alone, than Mario has his entire career.

It’s an offense that, even when it’s working, it doesn’t generate a ton. And because it’s difficult to work, it bottoms out too frequently. Leading to too many close wins and too many upsets.

That’s Mario’s career.
 
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section9 said:
Mario can win with his style of Bro Ball, but he must have a Wartime Consigliere at OC and let that OC do his thing. Think Lane Kiffin at Bama before he left. That game at FSU was ours for the taking, but we went conservative and playing Not To Lose in the Third, with predictable results.

That's something that will kill us against Louisville and going forward. No 5 Star QB in his right mind will come here just to hand the ball off in a Woody Hayes-style system.

Mario has to decide to trust his OC. If that's Dawson, then so be it. If it's Chip Kelly or someone else, then so be it. I prefer he keep Dawson because I think OC turnover is killing us.
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Now that Dorsey may be available I would not mind seeing something like what happened with LSU that year to save Orgeron when they brought in Brady and still kept their OC. Brady was able to infuse some of his NFL pass concepts into LSU's base offense which was meh up to that point to make it more dynamic. Maybe getting Dorsey as analyst or passing game coordinator to shore up the offense. I would definitely be intrigued. Only question is whether Dorsey wants to stay in the NFL or take a step back and reboot.
 
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Hurracanes said:
Yes and no. Mario demanded the university to invest into the program through various ways to position itself to compete for years to come. We needed that desperately. That doesn’t happen without Mario. In the coming years, we are going to be a problem.

That being said, I also am concerned with Mario’s stubbornness and pray the QB play is the sole reason we changed our offense as the season went on but if I am being honest with myself, I believe Mario wanted this to a degree. Perhaps, not to this extent (I hope) but at some level he wants to pound the rock. We’ll see what it is next year.

Now i am about to really upset the board, everyone better pray it works with Mario here instead of cheering for his failure because if Mario does fails, it’s over for this program. Back to the cheap Shalala days we go. University wants to see results with all the money being pumped into this program. I believe we will see it soon.
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This is where I’m at with it. I get everyone being upset by the bro ball and TVD/Dawson/Mario chicken or the egg discussion as to what happened to the offense. It’s maddening. I get it.. But for people to be so consumed by being more excited about being correct that Mario isn’t the guy rather than not seeing the big picture with budget/investment and why Mario NEEDS to work for the sake of this program, is insane. They’d rather be correct that Mario will fail than to be wrong and Mario succeed. That is ******* wild.

Mario was the only one that was going to get this type of $ commitment. So if that is our best odds to being nationally relevant again, then what the ****. Root for the guy and this program. Everyone wanted Butch’s head on a spike how soon? And then he assembled the most talent ever on a collegiate field. And yet people want to forget **** like that. It’s a process. This program was/is broken.

If Mario does not succeed here, the investment, infrastructure, money discussed and all that will not be given to another head coach and we are officially dead.
 
mossmadness said:
Michigan also plays a bunch of ****** Midwest teams.

Their offensive EPA against Ohio State last year was horrible.

That style only works against teams with talent IF the Michigan defense can stop the other team enough to allow Harbaugh to burn possessions.

Michigan has had one game all year with an offensive value generated over 20.

Their defense just dominates Big 10 teams, allowing Harbaugh to play “man ball” until the opposing defense breaks from the battering ram.

But that means you better have an elite defense every year.

And it limits your offensive ceiling, while exposing the floor.

Which is what you see over Mario’s career.

LSU has more 20+ offensive value generated games this year alone, than Mario has his entire career.

It’s an offense that, even when it’s working, it doesn’t generate a ton. And because it’s difficult to work, it bottoms out too frequently. Leading to too many close wins and too many upsets.

That’s Mario’s career.
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This is my whole problem with conservative offenses. It's not that I don't want to run the ball or I think we need to run at hyper speed, no huddle, throw every down type of offense. We just need to have an offense that gives a little more room for error. When you play as slow as possible, you're not only limiting your opponent's possessions, you're limiting your own. That means you have to be hyper efficient every week. There's very little room for error. You NEED your defense to be completely lights out every week otherwise you have no chance at winning because you can't outscore anyone if you end up in a shootout. If you fall behind by more than 10 points in the second half, the game might as well be over because your offense can't score fast enough to get back into the game. Even if your offense is highly efficient the fact that you're only getting a handful of possessions a half means you're never going to score a ton of points and unless your defense is equally as efficient, you're going to get stuck playing in close games too often. I'd rather not get stuck in a bunch of games where a single bonehead coaching call or late game turnover can completely change the outcome of a game.
 
Hurracanes said:
Yes and no. Mario demanded the university to invest into the program through various ways to position itself to compete for years to come. We needed that desperately. That doesn’t happen without Mario. In the coming years, we are going to be a problem.

That being said, I also am concerned with Mario’s stubbornness and pray the QB play is the sole reason we changed our offense as the season went on but if I am being honest with myself, I believe Mario wanted this to a degree. Perhaps, not to this extent (I hope) but at some level he wants to pound the rock. We’ll see what it is next year.

Now i am about to really upset the board, everyone better pray it works with Mario here instead of cheering for his failure because if Mario does fails, it’s over for this program. Back to the cheap Shalala days we go. University wants to see results with all the money being pumped into this program. I believe we will see it soon.
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we can be very supportive of Cristobal AND be critical and concerned

Its' fine to be both

Thats where Im at
 
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mossmadness said:
Michigan also plays a bunch of ****** Midwest teams.

Their offensive EPA against Ohio State last year was horrible.

That style only works against teams with talent IF the Michigan defense can stop the other team enough to allow Harbaugh to burn possessions.

Michigan has had one game all year with an offensive value generated over 20.

Their defense just dominates Big 10 teams, allowing Harbaugh to play “man ball” until the opposing defense breaks from the battering ram.

But that means you better have an elite defense every year.

And it limits your offensive ceiling, while exposing the floor.

Which is what you see over Mario’s career.

LSU has more 20+ offensive value generated games this year alone, than Mario has his entire career.

It’s an offense that, even when it’s working, it doesn’t generate a ton. And because it’s difficult to work, it bottoms out too frequently. Leading to too many close wins and too many upsets.

That’s Mario’s career.
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You’re right. I guess what my point was is that Mario’s philosophy CAN work, but it’s dependent on so many other things being done at an elite level. You need to recruit at an elite level, you need to have a great defense, you have to play turnover free and can’t commit a bunch of stupid penalties, an intelligent QB who doesn’t make silly mistakes and put your D in tough spots, etc. The reason why these things are important is because if you’re going to run that kind of offense you aren’t equipped to come back from a 21 point deficit the same way these explosive offenses are. It’s definitely not ideal, but if you’re going to infuse that philosophy into your program you better make sure all these things are buttoned up and running like a well oiled machine.
 
DoctorKrazey said:
You’re right. I guess what my point was is that Mario’s philosophy CAN work, but it’s dependent on so many other things being done at an elite level. You need to recruit at an elite level, you need to have a great defense, you have to play turnover free and can’t commit a bunch of stupid penalties, an intelligent QB who doesn’t make silly mistakes and put your D in tough spots, etc. The reason why these things are important is because if you’re going to run that kind of offense you aren’t equipped to come back from a 21 point deficit the same way these explosive offenses are. It’s definitely not ideal, but if you’re going to infuse that philosophy into your program you better make sure all these things are buttoned up and running like a well oiled machine.
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Everyone always pounded the table about getting a recruiter in here because we’re in a hotbed of local talent that has left to go elsewhere and that was because we had poor recruiters.

I always felt that was the wrong mindset. Those kids live here. They were born and raised and played here their whole lives. The only recruiting pitch they need is

‘we will have you put up stats and send your *** to the NFL as quickly as possible.’

Let your on field productivity carry the bulk weight of the recruiting. The talent is already here.

That always seemed backwards to me. You need a great recruiter when the talent is hard to find. That’s not the case here. We just need **** good coaches that develop and the recruiting will handle itself.
 
So many moral victories. Wasn't TVD a freshman with a new OC in 2021? We fired that coach for being better than Mario.

Excuses and moral victories left and right.
 
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