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X/O questions - now with more OCs!

ghost2

ghost2

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For coaches on the board, or just those with a better understanding of the game than me (most everyone) - how do you feel about the bubble screen? How should it be utilized in a game plan? Is it a staple of the offense, or a wrinkle? How can it be built off of throughout the course of a game?

There are many teams whose bread-and-butter is the bubble screen - I've never been a huge fan, but only because it tends to be a very sink-or-swim kind of play, but obviously when executed it can be deadly (*cough* Stacy Coley *cough*)


What do you think?
 
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Not even pretending to be a know it all but this got my attention because of a previous OC we had that loved it. Every play in the book is a solid play if it is executed properly. When Nix was the OC we used them a lot and people *****ed. Whipped didn't use them and you would see posts ask for more of them. The play itself keeps corners honest and tests their tackling skills. If a corner is always playing off the WR to prevent a big play, there very well could be 4 or more yards there which in most cases is a win. Plus as stated you make a player at a position where tackling isn't always a strong suit make the play near the LOS. The play can work even better with a talent like Coley, but you gotta disguise it or like everything it is to predictable, just like running the stretch on 4th and 1 has been for us, both predictable and retarded in that situation.
 
Great link, Neal! And totally agree on Morris - his short game was atrocious. He was at his best throwing skinny posts and deep outs.

I think our screen game could be special with these athletes if we have a QB who can develop the timing (not just bubble screens but slip screen, middle screen, and more traditional RB screens as well.)
 
The wr screen is a staple in any spread type of offense. The reason for this is simple, ideally you want to stretch the defense horizontally and vertically on the field and try to use every spots on the field as possible to attack the defense.
In today's game where a toss play is very rarely used due to significantly more athletic defenses and stronger ends, it's difficult to get those yards. The toss used to be that play where you stretch defenses horizontally. The bubble screens has since then replaced it. Its high percentage and when used properly you put the corner is a tough spot, pending play type.
Rich rod's offense has a speed option with a bubble screen option, putting some serious pressure on the corner.

Hope that helps. Apologize if there are spelling mistakes, it's a phone response.
 
Great point on the screen subbing for the toss sweep nowadays. Hadn't thought of it like that but it's an excellent comparison.
 
ghost2 said:
Great point on the screen subbing for the toss sweep nowadays. Hadn't thought of it like that but it's an excellent comparison.
Click to expand...

except coley loves tossing it to Duke on the short side not utilizing his speed to get to the edge....
 
Since this discussion is leading that way anyway, let's talk about that a bit - is there a legit rationale for toss/stretch plays to the short side? Is it a matchup decision? I can't believe it's just haphazard (even I'm not that jaded yet.)
 
Gamineal said:
ghost2 said:
Great point on the screen subbing for the toss sweep nowadays. Hadn't thought of it like that but it's an excellent comparison.
Click to expand...

except coley loves tossing it to Duke on the short side not utilizing his speed to get to the edge....
Click to expand...

Being an OC myself for 5 years I know why he's doing it to the short side, here it is.
The weakside de is essentially your sack guy, and the weakside of your oline are generally your most athletic guys. Also, in a base 4-3 defense, the nose is in a 1tech position (line up between center and weakside guard). On most toss plays, OCs pull that guard and has the center take on that dt (in this case the nose, which is easier for the center then a 3tech, which is a dlinemen lined up between guard and tackle.)
You'll see defenses built to funnel run plays to the will cause that's your least athletic but surest tackle, but he is put in front of a fast, less run stopping end.
X's and O's wise it leads to bigger chance of big plays, like the one you saw duke do vs BC on a toss a year or two back with a trips tight bunch on the weakside.
 
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In regards to the stretch play to the weakside it's easier to get that stretch block on the 1tech and you're trying to get that nose to make the play. Essentially making a Curtis Porter type player to run down the line of scrimmage to cover his gap(s) and be more athletic then a guy like Shane McDermott.
 
I love the bubble screen. We run it backside on every single run play we have. It's a good answer to what the defense gives you.

We teach our guy to look for a number advantage. If you can count you can throw the bubble in our offense.
 
Arehel (and other coaches) - as an OC, what are some things you look for week-to-week in preparing your gameplan? If you have some time, I'd love to hear some thoughts on how film is broken down, what an OC looks for when preparing for specific Ds, and how in-game adjustments are made. Welcome to the board, btw!
 
Assuming Berrios stil has his burst, I can definitely see OC using screens to get the ball in his hands in space.
 
Guys who I think should be catching bubble screens:

Coley
Duke
Gray (if he gets here)
Berrios
Waters?
 
ghost2 said:
For coaches on the board, or just those with a better understanding of the game than me (most everyone) - how do you feel about the bubble screen? How should it be utilized in a game plan? Is it a staple of the offense, or a wrinkle? How can it be built off of throughout the course of a game?

There are many teams whose bread-and-butter is the bubble screen - I've never been a huge fan, but only because it tends to be a very sink-or-swim kind of play, but obviously when executed it can be deadly (*cough* Stacy Coley *cough*)


What do you think?
Click to expand...


I'm definitely no coach, nor do I claim to be an expert, but I think it should be used as a wrinkle vs. a staple, as you've alluded to how easily it can be blown up for a loss if the call is predictable.

I would think it's most effective when there's been a tendency towards between-the-tackle run plays and +10yd pass plays --When the opposing D's blitzes/pressure create the need to get the ball out from the QB quickly, and/or when the DB's/scheme allow enough cushion off the LOS to run the play/route successfully. If the CB's are pressing in Cover1 or Cover2/Man underneath, you're just asking for a pick 6 à la Tracy Howard vs. UVA last November.

So I think it should be used sparingly, but often enough to keep the opposing Defense off-balance. --Especially w/ a guy like Stacy Coley. (Also can free up the pump-fake draw play, double-move/pump-fake pass plays, etc.)


That said, if Duke doesn't see @least 2-3 RB screens a game, it's a waste of talent IMO.
 
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ghost2 said:
Arehel (and other coaches) - as an OC, what are some things you look for week-to-week in preparing your gameplan? If you have some time, I'd love to hear some thoughts on how film is broken down, what an OC looks for when preparing for specific Ds, and how in-game adjustments are made. Welcome to the board, btw!
Click to expand...

For us, just general looks. How they line up against trips, what are some things that they have been hurt on , other than that we focus on us more than them.

We are up tempo no huddle and have been very successful on offense, so teams give us a very vanilla look when we play them. The way our offense is set up, we need as much practice as we can running our stuff (and our reads, we have about 3 different reads on just about every single run play alone). We don't do 7on7 or even a scout period (we stole that concept from Oklahoma).
 
So hood, if I understand you right, as a coach you're main concern is execution of your own plays and formation/situational practice as opposed to poring over opposing defensive schemes (makes total sense in a no-huddle scheme.) How much leeway is the QB given in your system vs. what's called from the sideline? Or do you give the QB a grouping of plays and he makes the call based on what he sees at the line?
 
ghost2 said:
For coaches on the board, or just those with a better understanding of the game than me (most everyone) - how do you feel about the bubble screen? How should it be utilized in a game plan? Is it a staple of the offense, or a wrinkle? How can it be built off of throughout the course of a game?

There are many teams whose bread-and-butter is the bubble screen - I've never been a huge fan, but only because it tends to be a very sink-or-swim kind of play, but obviously when executed it can be deadly (*cough* Stacy Coley *cough*)


What do you think?
Click to expand...

Any pass play can be a staple of your offense. If you're able to play action a pass play (in this case a bubble) with one of your money run plays, then it can be a staple. The problem with the bubble screen is that you can't play action it off any two back plays. It might be feasible from a two back twins formation, but alignment would not be favorable. You would have to really depend on the misdirection from play action to hold that force guy (OLB, S$, Nickel). I would assume you would play action inside zone from the shotgun and throw the bubble to trips towards the field or doubles to the boundary. Anything beyond that, bubble screen needs to have a specialized role.

We haven't really run any bubble screens lately here at Miami (under Coach Coley). What Stacey Coley keeps breaking is more of a middle screen or a quick jailbreak type screen. The point of attack for the bubble screen is all way by the sideline, that's why inside zone action is run in the opposite direction. It's designed to stretch the defense to both sidelines. For us, the point of attack is at the Tackle's (the guard too) kick out block of the force man. Coley usually fakes outside and then comes in (inside of the Tackle's block).

The problem (for us) with running that inside zone/bubble game is that your quarterback needs to be a legitimate running threat. Basing your running game on one back/shotgun principles requires you to have a running threat at QB, or the defensive ends will not respect him on zone read plays. If you're playing one back/under center then you can easily hold ends by having a healthy play action/boot game. They have to respect it or get gashed in the passing game or on keepers.
 
Good clarification on the "bubble" vs. "jailbreak"/"middle screen". So basically, a bubble screen works kinda inside-out, and Coley's screen is more outside-in?

Do you see us moving away from those plays with Olsen under center? Maybe more toward a more traditional RB screen/playaction game?
 
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