WR's running free... Question for people who know X's & O's

[SWFLSWAGG17]

In the James Coley OC era I can't remember even once seeing a WR catch a ball with no defender in the tv screen. I watch games religiously. I only claim to be an expert on common sense, but do not have an X & O knowledge of offensive schemes.
Watching Baylor and many other teams find the kind of gimmie busted coverage TD's or even receptions (like Nick O'leary breaking our back on a long 3rd down last year) almost weekly makes me wonder if it's the route trees, coaching or something else all together? I'm really curious to hear the thoughts of people that know more than me.

 

[McGahee2TheHouse]

Lu used the words "**** poor" to describe our route combinations earlier, in a thread about the receivers.

 

[jerzeycane]

His concepts suck. Doesn't even utilize basic combinations that religiously leave WR's wide open. It's like he picks routes for plays out of a grab bag.

 

[SamBruceMyBabyDaddy]

I have noticed a few times say on like a 3rd and 7 all of the receivers will run 8-10 yards down the field before making a cut. That's really stupid because someone needs to go underneath and or across for the deeper routes to become open. Plus Kaaya has no hot option in case of a blitz if all the receivers have their backs turned 10 yards down the field

 

[gogeta4]

he only studied under Jimbo. What you seen from the LSU/fSU OFFENSES IS WHAT WE SEE HERE....bunch of quick screens and b.s. route combos..i rarely see under routes or pick routes used.

Coley int an x and o guy never was...he's learning on the job. Still is better than No frio/Golden combo though

 

[CanesAreAble]

Coley Montana stinks.

 

[SWFLSWAGG17]

he only studied under Jimbo. What you seen from the LSU/fSU OFFENSES IS WHAT WE SEE HERE....bunch of quick screens and b.s. route combos..i rarely see under routes or pick routes used.

Coley int an x and o guy never was...he's learning on the job. Still is better than No frio/Golden combo though

So a glorified QB coach with a rare eye for talent. I hope he studies under some different coaching staffs again this offseason. If not too stubborn of course

 

[Coach Macho]

He doesn't use route concepts that get guys open. It just looks like he's got guys running random routes and leaving it to the QB to find the open guy.

I don't see us attempting to "high/low" a defender. The coaches at these innovative spread teams are using concepts that put defenders in a bind and force them to make split decisions on who they will cover. (i.e. run a hitch in front of a linebacker and a dig behind him)

Maybe I'm wrong but I seldom see guys open in this offense. Definitely doesn't look anything like the spread offenses I see around the country.

 

[M3N]

Coley and Jedd have the same issues. No feel. No rhythm. No identity.

Since Golden got here, I've never seen a WR hit in stride on slant, dig, cross, etc. either we run all outs or all verts. The entire staff needs to be relieved. ICE could call a better game.

 

[Cane2]

He doesn't use route concepts that get guys open. It just looks like he's got guys running random routes and leaving it to the QB to find the open guy.

I don't see us attempting to "high/low" a defender. The coaches at these innovative spread teams are using concepts that put defenders in a bind and force them to make split decisions on who they will cover. (i.e. run a hitch in front of a linebacker and a dig behind him)

Maybe I'm wrong but I seldom see guys open in this offense. Definitely doesn't look anything like the spread offenses I see around the country.

The hours of live fire is just not there for Coley. Regardless from whom or what he has learn, dude has barely called two dozen games. Most ingenious OC would create where player bust loose is spot x on the field leading to the first down marker. With this version of UM, every caught ball seems contested and if not, it's a screen.

 

[fincane]

Coley and Jedd have the same issues. No feel. No rhythm. No identity.

Since Golden got here, I've never seen a WR hit in stride on slant, dig, cross, etc. either we run all outs or all verts. The entire staff needs to be relieved. ICE could call a better game.

Funny you mention the slant stuff because Coley got hurt when he was hit in stride on a slant. Berrios beat his man on the ball Kaaya threw behind. Should've been an easy completion for a first down on that slant.

Scott dropped a crosser that would've gone for a first down. Kaaya and Scott are probably the best bet for those type of routes. S. Coley in the slot would be dangerous running slants if he wasn't allergic to any type of contact.

 

[blackvern]

He doesn't use route concepts that get guys open. It just looks like he's got guys running random routes and leaving it to the QB to find the open guy.

I don't see us attempting to "high/low" a defender. The coaches at these innovative spread teams are using concepts that put defenders in a bind and force them to make split decisions on who they will cover. (i.e. run a hitch in front of a linebacker and a dig behind him)

Maybe I'm wrong but I seldom see guys open in this offense. Definitely doesn't look anything like the spread offenses I see around the country.

We had a true freshman who didnt enroll early and is not that talented go for 26 and 12 last year.....Cmon Macho u better than this...Plus two of his top 3 receivers went down first drive against bethune

 

[Marcelo2988]

Not sure about Coley as an OC just yet but that **** has an eye for QBs and that's good enough for me

 

[FrancisSawyer]

He doesn't use route concepts that get guys open. It just looks like he's got guys running random routes and leaving it to the QB to find the open guy.

I don't see us attempting to "high/low" a defender. The coaches at these innovative spread teams are using concepts that put defenders in a bind and force them to make split decisions on who they will cover. (i.e. run a hitch in front of a linebacker and a dig behind him)

Maybe I'm wrong but I seldom see guys open in this offense. Definitely doesn't look anything like the spread offenses I see around the country.

I've been saying this since the very first game he coached for us. It seems that there is little to no conscious effort put into utilizing route concepts to exploit certain coverages or to "scheme" guys open. When you watch our passing game you mostly get the sense that the opposing DC has studied our route tree and different combinations but you never get the sense that Coley ever plays off of that.

This really fits the overarching philosophy of this staff which to this point at least has been to be reactive as opposed to proactive. In this sense, the Golden/Coley combo is truly the antithesis of the Belichick/McDaniels duo.

 

[Canesontherise]

he only studied under Jimbo. What you seen from the LSU/fSU OFFENSES IS WHAT WE SEE HERE....bunch of quick screens and b.s. route combos..i rarely see under routes or pick routes used.

Coley int an x and o guy never was...he's learning on the job. Still is better than No frio/Golden combo though

Your right.

 

[Supercane85]

You guys are discussing route combinations when your best Receiver is Rashawn Scott?

The issue is that Golden missed out on almost every receiver. Travis Rudolph should be playing for UM. Under James Coley our wide receivers have done excellent.

Allen Hurns 1162 Yards
Phillip Dorsett 880 Yards
Clive Walford 700 Yards

If UM had elite talent at the WR position you would see a huge difference

 

[LuCane]

He doesn't use route concepts that get guys open. It just looks like he's got guys running random routes and leaving it to the QB to find the open guy.

I don't see us attempting to "high/low" a defender. The coaches at these innovative spread teams are using concepts that put defenders in a bind and force them to make split decisions on who they will cover. (i.e. run a hitch in front of a linebacker and a dig behind him)

Maybe I'm wrong but I seldom see guys open in this offense. Definitely doesn't look anything like the spread offenses I see around the country.

We had a true freshman who didnt enroll early and is not that talented go for 26 and 12 last year.....Cmon Macho u better than this...Plus two of his top 3 receivers went down first drive against bethune

There is a reason we struggle with 3rd down conversion, Vern. Part of it is overall strategy to get to manageable down and distance, another part of it is that his route combinations rarely put pressure on coverages. As was noted, his routes are rarely layered. Another indicator is how much we have struggled against zone vs how well we've often done vs man. This is not new to this season, so the "we have average talent at WR" argument is weakened.

He's actually a very good scripter of plays, it seems, and will sometimes scheme his way to a big play (see: big Walford TD vs FSU), but when the planned bullets are all out, it seems we're unable to counter the opponent's adjustments.

Hope that changes this year. Kaaya should be a big help in being more dynamic vs zone.

 

[Supercane85]

He doesn't use route concepts that get guys open. It just looks like he's got guys running random routes and leaving it to the QB to find the open guy.

I don't see us attempting to "high/low" a defender. The coaches at these innovative spread teams are using concepts that put defenders in a bind and force them to make split decisions on who they will cover. (i.e. run a hitch in front of a linebacker and a dig behind him)

Maybe I'm wrong but I seldom see guys open in this offense. Definitely doesn't look anything like the spread offenses I see around the country.

We had a true freshman who didnt enroll early and is not that talented go for 26 and 12 last year.....Cmon Macho u better than this...Plus two of his top 3 receivers went down first drive against bethune

There is a reason we struggle with 3rd down conversion, Vern. Part of it is overall strategy to get to manageable down and distance, another part of it is that his route combinations rarely put pressure on coverages. As was noted, his routes are rarely layered. Another indicator is how much we have struggled against zone vs how well we've often done vs man. This is not new to this season, so the "we have average talent at WR" argument is weakened.

He's actually a very good scripter of plays, it seems, and will sometimes scheme his way to a big play (see: big Walford TD vs FSU), but when the planned bullets are all out, it seems we're unable to counter the opponent's adjustments.

Hope that changes this year. Kaaya should be a big help in being more dynamic vs zone.

The bottom line that you and other are missing is talent. If you want to do all that you have stated then Golden is going to have to wins some recruiting battles. Are you guys really discussing route trees when your wide outs average a 4.6 forty?

 

[CanesAreAble]

The bottom line that you and other are missing is talent. If you want to do all that you have stated then Golden is going to have to wins some recruiting battles. Are you guys really discussing route trees when your wide outs average a 4.6 forty?

It's college. You don't have to have 4 guys running 4.3/40s. Besides, most coaches would've killed to work with Dorsett, Coley, and Clive with Duke coming out of the backfield.

 

[sstcane]

I'm pretty sure Coley and Waters are both low 4.4 - high 4.3 40 guys

He doesn't use route concepts that get guys open. It just looks like he's got guys running random routes and leaving it to the QB to find the open guy.

I don't see us attempting to "high/low" a defender. The coaches at these innovative spread teams are using concepts that put defenders in a bind and force them to make split decisions on who they will cover. (i.e. run a hitch in front of a linebacker and a dig behind him)

Maybe I'm wrong but I seldom see guys open in this offense. Definitely doesn't look anything like the spread offenses I see around the country.

We had a true freshman who didnt enroll early and is not that talented go for 26 and 12 last year.....Cmon Macho u better than this...Plus two of his top 3 receivers went down first drive against bethune

There is a reason we struggle with 3rd down conversion, Vern. Part of it is overall strategy to get to manageable down and distance, another part of it is that his route combinations rarely put pressure on coverages. As was noted, his routes are rarely layered. Another indicator is how much we have struggled against zone vs how well we've often done vs man. This is not new to this season, so the "we have average talent at WR" argument is weakened.

He's actually a very good scripter of plays, it seems, and will sometimes scheme his way to a big play (see: big Walford TD vs FSU), but when the planned bullets are all out, it seems we're unable to counter the opponent's adjustments.

Hope that changes this year. Kaaya should be a big help in being more dynamic vs zone.

The bottom line that you and other are missing is talent. If you want to do all that you have stated then Golden is going to have to wins some recruiting battles. Are you guys really discussing route trees when your wide outs average a 4.6 forty?