Where did it go Wrong? Coastal chaos and other questions regarding the ACC

Hoyacane1620

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Some highlights:

-But as the business of college football has gotten bigger, the rewards of success richer, and the battles for conference supremacy more intense, the ACC's role as college football's most colorful band of swashbuckling misfits isn't so fun for the coaches whose careers hang in the balance and the programs desperate to keep pace in a rapidly evolving landscape in which the ACC often feels woefully behind.

"The ACC is becoming a laughingstock," one former ACC coach said. "It's not a cool place to be."

Duke's presence in Charlotte on Saturday is a result of a five-way tie for second place in the league, but also, according to a dozen current and former ACC coaches and administrators who spoke to ESPN, a symptom of longstanding problems -- issues some coaches and ADs saw coming more than a decade ago -- that have put the conference in increasingly difficult circumstances.

"The ACC has two problems," one former ACC coach said. "The real ones and the narrative."

Even in good times, the national perspective is that the ACC is living on borrowed time.

When Phillips was pressed on whether his league was treated fairly -- including by its TV partner -- during the league's kickoff event in July, he admitted he has his frustrations but ultimately put the onus on his own membership to change the talking points.

"You may feel that way, and sometimes I may feel that way," Phillips said about being treated as a lesser league, "but ... one of the things we have to do is we've got to perform better. We have to do our part."

"We were asleep at the wheel for years," said one administrator, who included his own school as a culprit. "We watched investments, negotiations, people positioning for the future being done while we just sat there and looked around. We weren't investing in football as a league, when everybody else knew that was the future. And we're still not."

Many of the coaches and ADs who spoke with ESPN praised Phillips' efforts to modernize the conference but said the culture that led the ACC to fall behind in the past remains embedded into the league's DNA for too many schools. For all of Phillips' efforts to push the ACC toward a more aggressive plan of action, he works for university presidents, who've too often been out of step with the modern college football landscape, according to nearly everyone who spoke with ESPN.

The league's cultural identity as a basketball conference was a common complaint among coaches and ADs who spoke with ESPN, and an engrained philosophy of doing more with less convinced even bigger schools that investment wasn't necessary. After all, if Frank Beamer, Bobby Bowden and a host of Miami coaches had won big without throwing millions of dollars at players and building massive football operations buildings, why couldn't the new cast of coaches?

The national perspective often suggests it's the result of a down league, because the ACC's signature brands haven't met expectations.

Meanwhile, the SEC's big three (Alabama, Georgia, LSU) and the Big Ten's (Ohio State, Penn State, Michigan) have each hit the eight-win mark together six times since the ACC last did.

The reason, one coach who has worked across multiple Power 5 leagues said, is the arrivals of Nick Saban at Alabama and Urban Meyer at Ohio State.

"All colleges suffer from inertia," the coach said, "but Saban came in and wrecked things."

Saban and Meyer wielded massive influence and forced huge investments that dwarfed their competition. As a result, the competition -- particularly at the top of both leagues -- followed suit in an effort to keep up.

The ACC is just recently coming to the same conclusion.

________

this is just part of the article. It's well written and goes into further detail, with examples. It talks about fan engagement and participation in actually GOING to games; the role of basketball in the state of football, etc.
 
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Maybe if the ACC didn't go out of its way to **** us with ****** officiating at every opportunity, we could have more success. Miami has enough of its own problems getting back on track that we don't need officials to face off against as well.

SMU 4th and 9. Should have been game over. Instead refs felt they had to give SMU another chance to score. Why? To make the game interesting? I honestly can’t explain it other than they wanted SMU to win.

When it’s obvious a player can’t hear the whistle over the crowd noise and even tries to hold the qb up when he realizes the play was blown dead, THAT IS NOT ROUGHING THE PASSER. The refs should have quickly convened and said “it looks like the Miami player couldn’t hear the whistle and stopped when he realized it wasn’t a live play- it’s ridiculous to penalize him for that.” Pick up the flag, just like they picked up the flag on the PI that would have won the game.

Phillips should pop in the game tape from Florida - Ole Miss. Florida was driving to win the game, Ole Miss committed an egregious defensive PI. Refs threw the flag and then remembered, “Oh yeah, no one gives a **** about a bad 4 win UF team and giving them a first down could mean Ole Miss misses the playoffs. Let’s pick up the flag.” That’s what the P2 does for the teams they want to push.

So rather than the ACC having a 1 loss Miami team that wins the ACC championship and gets the 5 or 6 seed and would have a real shot at playing in the title game - Miami is on the outside looking in and a 7 win Duke team might win the ACC, meaning no ACC rep in the playoffs.

F#ck Phillips for saying the ACC teams haven’t carried the water. 2 years ago FSU ran the table, but got left out of the final 4 while the ACC commissioner shrugged his shoulders. This year Miami would have returned to prominence and the ACC would have a marquee team again, but instead of that, Phillips and the buffoons he calls referees have managed to turn the conference into a laughingstock.
 
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Maybe if the ACC didn't go out of its way to **** us with ****** officiating at every opportunity, we could have more success. Miami has enough of its own problems getting back on track that we don't need officials to face off against as well.
The ACC as an org decided many years ago seemingly that it was far better to be the personal playground for its core, original members than to be a legitimate conference. It would rather have one representative (Duke or Virginia) versus a second, non core member getting in to the playoffs. And if Duke wins and no ACC member is in the playoffs…that’s fine too. Because a core ACC team won the ACC.
 
SMU 4th and 9. Should have been game over. Instead refs felt they had to give SMU another chance to score. Why? To make the game interesting? I honestly can’t explain it other than they wanted SMU to win.

When it’s obvious a player can’t hear the whistle over the crowd noise and even tries to hold the qb up when he realizes the play was blown dead, THAT IS NOT ROUGHING THE PASSER. The refs should have quickly convened and said “it looks like the Miami player couldn’t hear the whistle and stopped when he realized it wasn’t a live play- it’s ridiculous to penalize him for that.” Pick up the flag, just like they picked up the flag on the PI that would have won the game.

Phillips should pop in the game tape from Florida - Ole Miss. Florida was driving to win the game, Ole Miss committed an egregious defensive PI. Refs threw the flag and then remembered, “Oh yeah, no one gives a **** about a bad 4 win UF team and giving them a first down could mean Ole Miss misses the playoffs. Let’s pick up the flag.” That’s what the P2 does for the teams they want to push.

So rather than the ACC having a 1 loss Miami team that wins the ACC championship and gets the 5 or 6 seed and would have a real shot at playing in the title game - Miami is on the outside looking in and a 7 win Duke team might win the ACC, meaning no ACC rep in the playoffs.

F#ck Phillips for saying the ACC teams haven’t carried the water. 2 years ago FSU ran the table, but got left out of the final 4 while the ACC commissioner shrugged his shoulders. This year Miami would have returned to prominence and the ACC would have a marquee team again, but instead of that, Phillips and the buffoons he calls referees have managed to turn the conference into a laughingstock.
When you look at it through the lense of the ACC’s primary mission of keeping its core, original teams viable and pushed, losses like Miami to SMU make sense.
 
Maybe if the ACC didn't go out of its way to **** us with ****** officiating at every opportunity, we could have more success. Miami has enough of its own problems getting back on track that we don't need officials to face off against as well.
Exactly.
 



Some highlights:

-But as the business of college football has gotten bigger, the rewards of success richer, and the battles for conference supremacy more intense, the ACC's role as college football's most colorful band of swashbuckling misfits isn't so fun for the coaches whose careers hang in the balance and the programs desperate to keep pace in a rapidly evolving landscape in which the ACC often feels woefully behind.

"The ACC is becoming a laughingstock," one former ACC coach said. "It's not a cool place to be."

Duke's presence in Charlotte on Saturday is a result of a five-way tie for second place in the league, but also, according to a dozen current and former ACC coaches and administrators who spoke to ESPN, a symptom of longstanding problems -- issues some coaches and ADs saw coming more than a decade ago -- that have put the conference in increasingly difficult circumstances.

"The ACC has two problems," one former ACC coach said. "The real ones and the narrative."

Even in good times, the national perspective is that the ACC is living on borrowed time.

When Phillips was pressed on whether his league was treated fairly -- including by its TV partner -- during the league's kickoff event in July, he admitted he has his frustrations but ultimately put the onus on his own membership to change the talking points.

"You may feel that way, and sometimes I may feel that way," Phillips said about being treated as a lesser league, "but ... one of the things we have to do is we've got to perform better. We have to do our part."

"We were asleep at the wheel for years," said one administrator, who included his own school as a culprit. "We watched investments, negotiations, people positioning for the future being done while we just sat there and looked around. We weren't investing in football as a league, when everybody else knew that was the future. And we're still not."

Many of the coaches and ADs who spoke with ESPN praised Phillips' efforts to modernize the conference but said the culture that led the ACC to fall behind in the past remains embedded into the league's DNA for too many schools. For all of Phillips' efforts to push the ACC toward a more aggressive plan of action, he works for university presidents, who've too often been out of step with the modern college football landscape, according to nearly everyone who spoke with ESPN.

The league's cultural identity as a basketball conference was a common complaint among coaches and ADs who spoke with ESPN, and an engrained philosophy of doing more with less convinced even bigger schools that investment wasn't necessary. After all, if Frank Beamer, Bobby Bowden and a host of Miami coaches had won big without throwing millions of dollars at players and building massive football operations buildings, why couldn't the new cast of coaches?

The national perspective often suggests it's the result of a down league, because the ACC's signature brands haven't met expectations.

Meanwhile, the SEC's big three (Alabama, Georgia, LSU) and the Big Ten's (Ohio State, Penn State, Michigan) have each hit the eight-win mark together six times since the ACC last did.

The reason, one coach who has worked across multiple Power 5 leagues said, is the arrivals of Nick Saban at Alabama and Urban Meyer at Ohio State.

"All colleges suffer from inertia," the coach said, "but Saban came in and wrecked things."

Saban and Meyer wielded massive influence and forced huge investments that dwarfed their competition. As a result, the competition -- particularly at the top of both leagues -- followed suit in an effort to keep up.

The ACC is just recently coming to the same conclusion.

________

this is just part of the article. It's well written and goes into further detail, with examples. It talks about fan engagement and participation in actually GOING to games; the role of basketball in the state of football, etc.

The ACC has made their bed and they need to lay in it. It’s just been a comedy of errors and biases with this league since the very beginning. You see it in the board rooms, you see it on the field with the referees, it’s just bush league from top to bottom. Fvck the ACC and I can’t wait to get out of this terrible conference! This conference has one of the best teams in the country in Miami, and somehow through incompetence has put a 7-5 Duke team in the conference championship over Miami. Lol That **** would never happen in the Big Ten or the SEC. Smh
 
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The worst part is that last year the ACC, including Miami, doubled down on the league by adding 3 worthless teams. All they did was make the conference's stranglehold over the teams stronger.

And the teams that voted them in didn't even get any concessions to get some kind of leverage on the conference in return.
 
Well, one call in to that replay booth about a fumble overturn at SMU coulda changed some of this trajectory, but nope, **** the school that's showing up nationally for the conference.
 
I will NOT watch the ACC (BS) championship game today for the mere fact I don't want them getting ANY ratings. I hope there's 10,000 ppl in the stands and only 5,000 watching. Fucc this conference.
 
These massive conferences ain't it. THAT'S where it went wrong. There's no good way to fix the ACC at it it's current size.

The ACC tried divisions. But they moved away from divisions because.. what if the two best teams in the conference are in the same division?

They tried going without divisions, but that somehow made things worse. This is the second year in a row where multiple teams could've gone unbeaten in conference play because they somehow didn't play each other.

Yeah they could change tiebreaker rules.. again.. to put the committee's highest ranked teams in. But the committee is ******** us right now. Does anyone really want to put our fate 100% in the hands of the committee?
 
"You may feel that way, and sometimes I may feel that way," Phillips said about being treated as a lesser league, "but ... one of the things we have to do is we've got to perform better. We have to do our part."


**** you, Jim Phillips. Take some lessons from Greg Sankey on how to do your job.

Edit: the fact that he even feels comfortable saying that on the record is very telling.
 
These massive conferences ain't it. THAT'S where it went wrong. There's no good way to fix the ACC at it it's current size.

The ACC tried divisions. But they moved away from divisions because.. what if the two best teams in the conference are in the same division?

They tried going without divisions, but that somehow made things worse. This is the second year in a row where multiple teams could've gone unbeaten in conference play because they somehow didn't play each other.

Yeah they could change tiebreaker rules.. again.. to put the committee's highest ranked teams in. But the committee is ******** us right now. Does anyone really want to put our fate 100% in the hands of the committee?
Started wayyyyy before that, the article shows they didnt even value football and even though they were legit #2 conference in regards to talent, didnt market or protect that in anyway.. Stood around when conference realignment was happening with no foresight then just grabbed whatever was left with no rhyme or reason.
 
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Great article. As long as we are stuck in this conference the best thing we can do for ourselves and the ACC is beat the every living **** out of everyone till they start taking football seriously. VT, Stanford, Cal appear to be taking football seriously again, which can't hurt.

One thing the article didn't focus on that is a big issue is the former premier football team in the ACC, Clemson, has been hurt the most by the divergence between ACC and SEC in HS recruiting, and their coach has chosen to make things worse by ignoring the transfer portal.
 
The ACC also felt Clemson success, winning two national titles, was enough to maintain the image of the ACC as a good football conference. What they failed to do was require the other schools to pump in more invest more money, like the SEC and Big Ten schools did in order to try and keep up with Alabama and Ohio State.

The ACC wet dream was Miami-Florida State conference championship games two with both teams in the top 10, games, your rival games from the 80s and 90s. Never happened. One reason because Florida State’s early dominance of the conference, in Miami could make a good decision to save the program. Other schools resented Florida State and Miami rather than realize if those schools were enjoying their past success, it raises the entire level of the conference.

And here we are today.
 
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