What offense and defense would you run at Miami?

[Texxcane]

Well IF you have the horses, and we should, pro style is still best imo, you just need a Damm good quarterback, but we are quarterback U and our HC is supposedly a QB guru. We have dudes all over the field, but no trigger man, you give us a BK/Kelley/Gino/KD/Vinny we hang 50 on everybody. But you also need a coach that knows how to use said horses. I'm going same way with the D, 4-3, need a good 7 man rotation up front, which we should be able to do maybe next year, we have the LB's now. That front 4 needs to reek havoc, free up the backers to make plays, D line needs penetration consistently. In Jimmy's book he says he tried to re-establish the los 2 yards deep in the backfield, this F's an offense up bad, they can't hardly run anything, online can't pull, etc. Listening to ESPNU radio yesterday they were talking about Chip's O at UCLA. The guy on radio was x-NFL, he said that O has been figured out now, the fast pace, said it won't fly anymore. It always comes back to do you have a QB that can read a D, stand in the pocket, and deliver the ball to the right guy. KD and Bern were masters, what did they have in common, slow as **** and not great athletes, had to rely on their brain, film study and prep. Tom Brady runs a 6.2, he rely's on his brain....

 

[DTP]

The Veer

Watch Urban Meyer or Rich Rodriguez offenses. They're pretty much the veer but with the QB in the shotgun. The entire "zone read" concept is based off veer principals.

 

[boxtonenyc]

Clemson Offense.

Seahawks/Pete Carroll 4-3 Cover 1/3 defense. Easy, automatic 8 in the box and cant pass against it bc of the press coverage.

 

[NateDogg]

Great poster. Couldn't disagree with you more on this one point.

That pop gun offense requires a generational talent like DeShaun Watson to win at an elite level. We are seeing their struggles since he left and even Clemson fans are starting to accept the fact that, with their current offense, they aren't the perennial juggernaut they thought they were a couple years ago. Yes, their talent overall is still ridiculous and in the ACC that makes them essentially a playoff shoe-in given Willie in their division, and our struggles to take it to the next level. BUT, as long as Clemson is running this offense, they are going to need a Watson/Lamar Jackson/Jameis Winston/Johhny Manzeil type QB to have a chance at the ultimate prize. Those type of guys just don't come around that often.

I still think a "pro-style" offense; think Philly, LAR, NE, etc is the way to win consistently in today's college football with the talent available to us. The problem we are having right now is that we are calling our offense "pro-style" when it is really the functional equivalent of the triple wishbone in today's college game. The other problem we are having right now is that we are playing a QB who, even in Clemson's screen offense, would struggle to complete more than half of his passes.

As for defense, Miami should be running a 4 down linemen system that relies heavily on press coverage, generally keeps the safeties over the top as centerfielders and has athletic backers and d-linemen who are given the freedom to make plays. A Miami defense should be a defense that isn't afraid to give up some plays underneath, but is going to have an upfield rush, ball hawking and hard hitting playmakers all over the field. To score on us should require 10-15 play drives and should be very infrequent because if a drive takes that many plays, we are going to get a sack, a pick, a fumble, or just knock someone out somewhere along the way.

 

[DTP]

Nobody in pro football uses a "pro style" offense anymore either. Watch Aaron Rogers, Drew Breeze and Tom Brady. Are they lining up under center with two running backs in the I formation anymore? Of course not. They're all in the shotgun with three or four wide receivers. Yes, there was a time when the "pro style" offense was effective. just like there was a time when the wishbone was effective. The game changes. If you coach a football team trying to use 30 year old philosophies, you're going to get curb stomped today.

 

[firstandcanes]

Where's the guy that wants to run the triple option? Also the guy who wants to run a 4-1-6 defense?
It's their time to shine.

 

[Texxcane]

Nobody in pro football uses a "pro style" offense anymore either. Watch Aaron Rogers, Drew Breeze and Tom Brady. Are they lining up under center with two running backs in the I formation anymore? Of course not. They're all in the shotgun with three or four wide receivers. Yes, there was a time when the "pro style" offense was effective. just like there was a time when the wishbone was effective. The game changes. If you coach a football team trying to use 30 year old philosophies, you're going to get curb stomped today.

yes you are correct, it is what the pro style has evolved into now, there is lots more gun, but they still get under center half the time at least. My point is the QB is key, and he has to be able to A) read a damm defense, and B) stand in the pocket and deliver a strike to the open man. Rosier cant do it, and he never will, i dont think Kosi can either, he rely's too much on athleticism also, these two guys have had plenty of time to learn, i would move on. Richt is a nice guy coach, he dont have that put your foot on their throat and finish em attitude like Howard, Jimmy, Dennis, and Butch had, and say what you want but thats what makes Miami Miami. I like Richt but he is waaay to laid back for my taste, I like a Jimmy style coach, in your face, full of fire, a little ****y, and has an attitude to go with it. Thats what this program was built on, and its different than any other school in the country, my grandma has more fire than Richt, Manny has alot of fire, just not much sense, but he has the Miami attitude.

 

[g8rh8rMD]

IMO, it's easier for Miami to find skill position playmakers than top flight offensive linemen. Without 5 NFL players on your line, the pro-style/ two back offense doesn't work. Plus, it requires the QB to make a lot of reads that most college quarterbacks aren't capable of. The spread is simpler and plays to our strengths. It doesn't require five superstar linemen and can be altered to be as run-heavy or pass heavy as you want. I like what Clemson does. They don't have near the skill position talent as Miami and Kelly Bryant is a limited passer but they're still effective. Obviously Oklahoma is probably the offensive king of college football right now but I believe a lot of that has to do with who's under center. I think Miami wins the national championship last year if you swapped Malik Rosier for Baker Mayfield.

As for defense, I'm all in on the 4-2-5. I like the idea of swapping a third linebacker for a safety who can still play the run. Most teams in college run some type of 3 wide offense so playing a 4-3 just forces you into a mismatch playing a linebacker on a receiver. I actually like a lot of what Manny Diaz does. I'm far more interested in a defense that puts a premium on negative yardage "havoc" plays. I just think Manny needs to dial it back a little bit. You don't always have to blitz in passing situations. Especially when you put a premium on linemen that can get upfield. You'll probably get gouged for big gains occasionally because that's what happens when you're aggressive but I'd take that every day over getting nickle and dimed up and down the field ala D'Onfrio.

Man, you guys saying this stuff about Clemson can't be watching them every week. For one, their offense has been seriously struggling since Watson left. It's how they lost to Sarahcuse last year. It took them a quarter and a half to get anything going against FURMAN in their opener this year!! For second, they have skill talent all over the field. Do I really want to say it's as good or better than Miami? No, I don't. But looking at it unbiased, it is.

Their WR position has not dropped off, at least not significantly. They have talented TE's and a flurry of backs with a variety of body types and skills.

Fvck, I hate to say it, but Tee Higgins is their next NFL stud ready to pop. He might be a better NFL prospect than anyone we have on our roster given AR82's health issues.

As for your comments about a pro-style two back offense, that's an anachronism. Doesn't exist anymore. It's certainly not what I'm talking about. Not at all. When I talk about a pro-style offense, I'm talking about the Rams, Patriots, Chiefs, Eagles, the type of offenses those teams run. Watch the Rams on offense from that Monday night game against the Raiders, you telling me that wouldn't work like gangbusters with our personnel?

 

[Bk1]

I would run Chip Kelly’s Oregon offense. I don’t think we can have the Oline to run a pro style and win Nattys over what Bama has on Dline. Our skill positions are second to none which would allow maximum value from them.

Dual threat QBs can be found while I think the pro style ones are difficult to find and develop.

Those undersized SF speedsters could become takes as Kelly knows how to use them.

How fun would it be to watch us drop 60 on folks. The way to counter what Bama/UGA do on D is to go uptempo. I think we can get out oline to be light years better than what Oregon had back in the day.

On defense give me what TCU does on D (4-2-5).

Again....Miami gets and/or recruit any kind of player it needs to run ANY offense....we can run an i-formation pro set offense with our current personnel right now. Even with Malik.... I know what your thinking....the OL are not road graders and can not get ah push up front...well commit to zone blocking principles....and as far defense....the base 43 defense should suffice.

 

[MIA42178]

Air Raid

I’m a fan of the 4-2-5 w the striker we play right now. I just think the playcalling on 3rd down could improve.

 

[SinisterCane]

Sorry I know you said current team but Joe Gibbs Redskins Offense and Buddy Ryan Bears defense

 

[DiegoCane]

It's depressing thinking about Offense because it should be so simple but Miami hasn't had an OC worth **** in over 20 years. Luckily we had monster talent in the early 2000s.

 

[simplycanes]

Whichever one doesn't require Malik Rosier to throw 50-50 balls.

 

[CANEZZ4LIFE]

Great poster. Couldn't disagree with you more on this one point.

That pop gun offense requires a generational talent like DeShaun Watson to win at an elite level. We are seeing their struggles since he left and even Clemson fans are starting to accept the fact that, with their current offense, they aren't the perennial juggernaut they thought they were a couple years ago. Yes, their talent overall is still ridiculous and in the ACC that makes them essentially a playoff shoe-in given Willie in their division, and our struggles to take it to the next level. BUT, as long as Clemson is running this offense, they are going to need a Watson/Lamar Jackson/Jameis Winston/Johhny Manzeil type QB to have a chance at the ultimate prize. Those type of guys just don't come around that often.

I still think a "pro-style" offense; think Philly, LAR, NE, etc is the way to win consistently in today's college football with the talent available to us. The problem we are having right now is that we are calling our offense "pro-style" when it is really the functional equivalent of the triple wishbone in today's college game. The other problem we are having right now is that we are playing a QB who, even in Clemson's screen offense, would struggle to complete more than half of his passes.

As for defense, Miami should be running a 4 down linemen system that relies heavily on press coverage, generally keeps the safeties over the top as centerfielders and has athletic backers and d-linemen who are given the freedom to make plays. A Miami defense should be a defense that isn't afraid to give up some plays underneath, but is going to have an upfield rush, ball hawking and hard hitting playmakers all over the field. To score on us should require 10-15 play drives and should be very infrequent because if a drive takes that many plays, we are going to get a sack, a pick, a fumble, or just knock someone out somewhere along the way.

Great post. I would say that Clemson realizes this also. If you look at the QB’s they’ve signed post Watson in ‘14 and they load up that QB room with consistent 4-5 Star talent. Their lowest rated signed QB of the past 5 classes is Their starter Kelly Bryant who was a 3 Star. Of course you can’t hit on all of them, but Dabo knows they’re not an Oklahoma type with creativity and all these sets and route trees. When they were under guys like chad Morris they weren’t the team and program they are now. I’d personally have no problem running that type of offense because at the end of the day it puts points on the boards and their defense is rarely in bad positions because the offense is like that. But like me and you are saying, still need that QB. A good one at that.

 

[skyman]

Man, you guys saying this stuff about Clemson can't be watching them every week. For one, their offense has been seriously struggling since Watson left. It's how they lost to Sarahcuse last year. It took them a quarter and a half to get anything going against FURMAN in their opener this year!! For second, they have skill talent all over the field. Do I really want to say it's as good or better than Miami? No, I don't. But looking at it unbiased, it is.

Their WR position has not dropped off, at least not significantly. They have talented TE's and a flurry of backs with a variety of body types and skills.

Fvck, I hate to say it, but Tee Higgins is their next NFL stud ready to pop. He might be a better NFL prospect than anyone we have on our roster given AR82's health issues.

As for your comments about a pro-style two back offense, that's an anachronism. Doesn't exist anymore. It's certainly not what I'm talking about. Not at all. When I talk about a pro-style offense, I'm talking about the Rams, Patriots, Chiefs, Eagles, the type of offenses those teams run. Watch the Rams on offense from that Monday night game against the Raiders, you telling me that wouldn't work like gangbusters with our personnel?

ALL those offenses you are talking about are pulling tons of concepts from spread college teams, NE has been ahead of curve and embraced spread. That is why they have dominated lately, Andy reid has tons of articles talking about those spread concepts, it just seems to some who are stuck on nfl that think those are pro concepts when in reality those guys pulled it from college spread teams. We are soo far behind the curve it we sound like old nebraska fans.

The best coaches in college and pro (saban and Belichek) both have shown that they are able to adapt and change with the game, something our admin on coaching searches and some fans have shown that they cant do. The whole "pro style" offense doesnt even make sense now because those top offenses that are lighting teams up are marrying tons of spread concepts. That play you loved with Rams on monday night with Gurley on jet sweep or KC running with their tyreek hill is basically the play that WVU used in orange bowl against Clemson on their way to dropping 70 on them (holgerson got it from bob stitt) Clemson fired DC and hired Venables and that move combined with their OC move to spread took them to another level.

link to show when play blew up, like in all football, whats old is new again.


Link for andy reid and how he never left college, Doug pederson is from that tree and he uses our own SToutland to combine some of Chip kelly stuff in philly,
How a 59-Year-Old Football Lifer Became the NFL’s Most Influential Innovator

 

[DTP]

ALL those offenses you are talking about are pulling tons of concepts from spread college teams, NE has been ahead of curve and embraced spread. That is why they have dominated lately, Andy reid has tons of articles talking about those spread concepts, it just seems to some who are stuck on nfl that think those are pro concepts when in reality those guys pulled it from college spread teams. We are soo far behind the curve it we sound like old nebraska fans.

The best coaches in college and pro (saban and Belichek) both have shown that they are able to adapt and change with the game, something our admin on coaching searches and some fans have shown that they cant do. The whole "pro style" offense doesnt even make sense now because those top offenses that are lighting teams up are marrying tons of spread concepts. That play you loved with Rams on monday night with Gurley on jet sweep or KC running with their tyreek hill is basically the play that WVU used in orange bowl against Clemson on their way to dropping 70 on them (holgerson got it from bob stitt) Clemson fired DC and hired Venables and that move combined with their OC move to spread took them to another level.

link to show when play blew up, like in all football, whats old is new again.


Link for andy reid and how he never left college, Doug pederson is from that tree and he uses our own SToutland to combine some of Chip kelly stuff in philly,
How a 59-Year-Old Football Lifer Became the NFL’s Most Influential Innovator

I was just about to make the same response. Those NFL teams he mentioned are lighting it up because they embraced what colleges have been doing for over a decade now. Multiple receivers, tight ends split out or in the slot, end around action, running backs lined up wide or in the slot, using wide receivers as running backs. That's all spread concepts.

"Spread" does not mean "spread option". It has nothing to do with having a running quarterback. One of the top spread QBs in the nation is Will Grier and he can't run at all. Dennis Erickson helped pioneer the one back offense because his teams at Idaho and Washington State didn't have the horses on the offensive line to just line up and run it at opponents. By replacing the fullback with a slot receiver, he could spread defenses out and force slower, run stuffing linebackers to have to make plays against skill players in space. Because he incorporated lots of short, timing passes you didn't need to have a Dan Fouts or Dan Marino to run his offense. It wasn't just about the big armed QB slinging the ball 30 yards downfield, it was about putting the ball in your play makers' hands and letting them make plays.

 

[skyman]

While we struggle to score in redzone, guys in nfl not only walk in for td but the TE has no one to even block..

 

[DTP]

While we struggle to score in redzone, guys in nfl not only walk in for td but the TE has no one to even block..

Shovel pass off the zone read. I badly want Richt to incorporate this.

 

[skyman]

I was just about to make the same response. Those NFL teams he mentioned are lighting it up because they embraced what colleges have been doing for over a decade now. Multiple receivers, tight ends split out or in the slot, end around action, running backs lined up wide or in the slot, using wide receivers as running backs. That's all spread concepts.

"Spread" does not mean "spread option". It has nothing to do with having a running quarterback. One of the top spread QBs in the nation is Will Grier and he can't run at all. Dennis Erickson helped pioneer the one back offense because his teams at Idaho and Washington State didn't have the horses on the offensive line to just line up and run it at opponents. By replacing the fullback with a slot receiver, he could spread defenses out and force slower, run stuffing linebackers to have to make plays against skill players in space. Because he incorporated lots of short, timing passes you didn't need to have a Dan Fouts or Dan Marino to run his offense. It wasn't just about the big armed QB slinging the ball 30 yards downfield, it was about putting the ball in your play makers' hands and letting them make plays.

Its funny and weird how I guess all those teams were nationally televised and then you have guys saying, wow I wish we ran a pro style like rams, eagles, KC, etc. Well umm, the plays that have you wishing that are actually college/high school even spread concept plays. Like andy reid said in that article NFL, is like 5 years behind college. Tavon Austin was scoring tds on that play in 2012, tons of teams have ridden the spread to national titles in last 10 years +, Saban the standard, has tweaked his game winning philosophy and gone full on spread, while we stay stuck. Ugh. I pray one day, hopefully before this era passes we see true spread implemented with our game breaking skill players

 

[CANEMC]

It's not what you run, but who's running it. Players win games, and coaches lose them.