Time to pull our weight(football)

[TreOFive]

Camp, I believe you're correct (doling out 11-12 schollies to the entire roster). The reality is, though, that the top flight kids will have everything paid for in a combination of scholarships and grants. I'd wager to say that most of the other starter types would get most of their costs covered as well - there's no way they can have that many guys footing the entire bill.

Are they allowed to get grants and financial aid while being on a partial athletic scholarship? I believe the NCAA prohibits that now but I could be wrong

an athletic scholarship is a grant so yes you are wrong. You can still apply and recieve financial aid

 

[canestim]

The baseball team is a top 5 team this year, but they should be a top 5 team every year. One could argue that the baseball team has an even greater home town recruiting advantage than the football team. I think they have disappointed just as much as the football team these last 10 years.

Disagree. When you factor in how baseball scholarships work, the baseball team is at the most drastic disadvantage of all major sports. As a matter of fact, it's a maricle they can even compete with state schools.

Can you expound on this? I'd like to know how it works...

I need to read up on it or if someone can explain. Never understood how football gets 85 but baseball is limited to 11(12?). And now with someone saying they can do academic, but I guess that practice is limited in football? Very confusing.

 

[Don Caneleone]

11.7 Scholarships

The NCAA allows Division I athletic programs to award a maximum of 85 football scholarships, entitling nearly every gridiron athlete a full ride to college.
Baseball players don't have it nearly as good. The NCAA has allotted Division I schools just 11.7 scholarships per year since 1991. Instead of offering full rides, baseball recruiters are forced to pull out their knives and dissect 11.7 scholarships into enough 15%-30% pieces to support a typical 25-man roster.

Yet despite these scholarship limits, Louisiana State still carries 49 players on its roster. Other schools, including Southeastern Conference foes Florida and Georgia, have 40-plus men in uniform.

However, the teams aren't stretching their 11.7 scholarships as thin as you might think.

These teams and others have in-state scholarships at their disposal, grants that the NCAA doesn't count against the standard 11.7 allotment.

"It has definitely helped us," said LSU assistant baseball coach and recruiting coordinator Turtle Thomas. "They get tuition and some of their fees covered, and most of them make good enough grades to keep their scholarships. We're glad to have it."

The awards are meant to keep top high school seniors in Louisiana, Florida, Georgia and nine other states from attending out-of-state universities. In most cases, students receive enough money to cover their tuition and additional fees for four years of school.

Not surprisingly, college baseball coaches in Alabama, Tennessee and other states without merit programs say the awards give their opponents an unfair recruiting advantage, and it's up to the NCAA to step in and fix it.

Most of the state programs have broad eligibility requirements that, on average, require students to graduate with a 3.0 grade-point average (on a 4.0 scale) and score in the top 10 percentile of state and/or national assessment tests. College students can renew their award every year provided they maintain a certain GPA.

However, the standards aren't as high for Louisiana's Tuition Opportunity Program for Students, or TOPS. First introduced in 1998, the program pays tuition and certain fees to any public university in the state for students earning both a minimum 2.5 GPA on high school core courses and an ACT score equivalent to the state average from the previous year. Students must have a 2.30 GPA at the end of the first year, and a 2.50 GPA thereafter.

A majority of players on LSU's roster are TOPS scholars, Thomas said. They receive a small additional scholarship from LSU to cover expenses such as books and housing, then Thomas uses the money left over to offer higher percentage scholarships to out-of-state athletes.

Last year, more than 70,000 Florida students took advantage of the state's Bright Futures Scholarships. High school graduates with a minimum 3.5 GPA and a 1,270 SAT or 28 ACT can earn upward of $1,800 a year for college if they maintain a 3.0 GPA.

Florida also offers a Merit Scholars Award and a Florida Gold Seal Vocational Scholars Award, both of which covers 75% of a student's annual tuition. Both scholarships are renewable with a 2.75 GPA.

Several Florida State players are Merit scholars, said Jamey Shouppe, assistant coach and recruiting coordinator for the Seminoles. He argues that 75% of tuition paid for by the state amounts to only a small portion of the total cost to attend Florida State.

"It's misleading, because at Florida State, 75% is only $1,500," Shouppe said. "A full scholarship to Florida State is $9,000 or so. And if they drop below a 2.75, they're off the Merit program. So for me, I don't use it in the recruiting process at all. I look at the scholarship as money they've earned."

Implemented in 1993, Georgia's HOPE program, Helping Outstanding Pupils Educationally, offers scholarships to high school graduates with a 3.0 GPA who attend one of the state's public universities. The scholarship pays tuition plus $150 per semester for books.

"That 11.7 doesn't get very far," Georgia head coach Ron Polk said. "It helps when recruiting an in-state kid, because he can get free tuition and some money for books."

Polk said another advantage of the HOPE program is how it works to deter out-of-state programs from recruiting in Georgia.

Auburn's coach Renfroe concurred. He said recruiting in Georgia is tough because he can't offer equivalent scholarships.

Private schools also find the scholarship program unfair. Although his school is located in New Orleans, Tulane head coach Rick Jones said Louisiana's program doesn't affect his program much because a $2,000 award barely dents Tulane's $34,000 tuition.

"This is an NCAA problem," Jones said, because there aren't enough scholarships for baseball. "This is not a state of Louisiana problem."

While both the haves and have-nots agree that the programs give some schools a major recruiting edge, the solutions aren't obvious, except for the NCAA to grant baseball more scholarships.

Renfroe suggested that the grant programs or the NCAA allow an out-of-state recruit to bring his academic scholarship with him. But he knows that's unlikely to happen.

"We would all like to have it," he said. "But you just can't cry about that. You deal with it and just go out and compete"

 

[Fightinibis]

11.7 Scholarships

The NCAA allows Division I athletic programs to award a maximum of 85 football scholarships, entitling nearly every gridiron athlete a full ride to college.
Baseball players don't have it nearly as good. The NCAA has allotted Division I schools just 11.7 scholarships per year since 1991. Instead of offering full rides, baseball recruiters are forced to pull out their knives and dissect 11.7 scholarships into enough 15%-30% pieces to support a typical 25-man roster.

Yet despite these scholarship limits, Louisiana State still carries 49 players on its roster. Other schools, including Southeastern Conference foes Florida and Georgia, have 40-plus men in uniform.

However, the teams aren't stretching their 11.7 scholarships as thin as you might think.

These teams and others have in-state scholarships at their disposal, grants that the NCAA doesn't count against the standard 11.7 allotment.

"It has definitely helped us," said LSU assistant baseball coach and recruiting coordinator Turtle Thomas. "They get tuition and some of their fees covered, and most of them make good enough grades to keep their scholarships. We're glad to have it."

The awards are meant to keep top high school seniors in Louisiana, Florida, Georgia and nine other states from attending out-of-state universities. In most cases, students receive enough money to cover their tuition and additional fees for four years of school.

Not surprisingly, college baseball coaches in Alabama, Tennessee and other states without merit programs say the awards give their opponents an unfair recruiting advantage, and it's up to the NCAA to step in and fix it.

Most of the state programs have broad eligibility requirements that, on average, require students to graduate with a 3.0 grade-point average (on a 4.0 scale) and score in the top 10 percentile of state and/or national assessment tests. College students can renew their award every year provided they maintain a certain GPA.

However, the standards aren't as high for Louisiana's Tuition Opportunity Program for Students, or TOPS. First introduced in 1998, the program pays tuition and certain fees to any public university in the state for students earning both a minimum 2.5 GPA on high school core courses and an ACT score equivalent to the state average from the previous year. Students must have a 2.30 GPA at the end of the first year, and a 2.50 GPA thereafter.

A majority of players on LSU's roster are TOPS scholars, Thomas said. They receive a small additional scholarship from LSU to cover expenses such as books and housing, then Thomas uses the money left over to offer higher percentage scholarships to out-of-state athletes.

Last year, more than 70,000 Florida students took advantage of the state's Bright Futures Scholarships. High school graduates with a minimum 3.5 GPA and a 1,270 SAT or 28 ACT can earn upward of $1,800 a year for college if they maintain a 3.0 GPA.

Florida also offers a Merit Scholars Award and a Florida Gold Seal Vocational Scholars Award, both of which covers 75% of a student's annual tuition. Both scholarships are renewable with a 2.75 GPA.

Several Florida State players are Merit scholars, said Jamey Shouppe, assistant coach and recruiting coordinator for the Seminoles. He argues that 75% of tuition paid for by the state amounts to only a small portion of the total cost to attend Florida State.

"It's misleading, because at Florida State, 75% is only $1,500," Shouppe said. "A full scholarship to Florida State is $9,000 or so. And if they drop below a 2.75, they're off the Merit program. So for me, I don't use it in the recruiting process at all. I look at the scholarship as money they've earned."

Implemented in 1993, Georgia's HOPE program, Helping Outstanding Pupils Educationally, offers scholarships to high school graduates with a 3.0 GPA who attend one of the state's public universities. The scholarship pays tuition plus $150 per semester for books.

"That 11.7 doesn't get very far," Georgia head coach Ron Polk said. "It helps when recruiting an in-state kid, because he can get free tuition and some money for books."

Polk said another advantage of the HOPE program is how it works to deter out-of-state programs from recruiting in Georgia.

Auburn's coach Renfroe concurred. He said recruiting in Georgia is tough because he can't offer equivalent scholarships.

Private schools also find the scholarship program unfair. Although his school is located in New Orleans, Tulane head coach Rick Jones said Louisiana's program doesn't affect his program much because a $2,000 award barely dents Tulane's $34,000 tuition.

"This is an NCAA problem," Jones said, because there aren't enough scholarships for baseball. "This is not a state of Louisiana problem."

While both the haves and have-nots agree that the programs give some schools a major recruiting edge, the solutions aren't obvious, except for the NCAA to grant baseball more scholarships.

Renfroe suggested that the grant programs or the NCAA allow an out-of-state recruit to bring his academic scholarship with him. But he knows that's unlikely to happen.

"We would all like to have it," he said. "But you just can't cry about that. You deal with it and just go out and compete"

Gotta love that...the entire article is dedicated to the clash of worlds between state school A v. state school B...and which gets additional benefits from their state, along with the inherit benefit over private schools from the NCAA, with a tiny fraction of the article mentioning some loosely associated private school problem...lmfao.

UM

 

[CaneOil]

If its true that Kaaya is heisman caliber and a top 5 pick in the NFL and a junior.... 10 wins and legitimately challengng for the ACC title should be the expectation this season.

I could not agree more with this statement. If Kaaya stays healthy and Searels earns his paycheck it wouldn't be shocking to win 10 games.

Love to see 10+ wins but I think we're stuck on 9..Vegas says 6.5 go figure..

It's at 7 now, but I agree, Vegas is usually not off by much. Offensive line has got to protect our QB to have a good season.

 

[FrancisSawyer]

If its true that Kaaya is heisman caliber and a top 5 pick in the NFL and a junior.... 10 wins and legitimately challengng for the ACC title should be the expectation this season.

I could not agree more with this statement. If Kaaya stays healthy and Searels earns his paycheck it wouldn't be shocking to win 10 games.

Love to see 10+ wins but I think we're stuck on 9..Vegas says 6.5 go figure..

It's at 7 now, but I agree, Vegas is usually not off by much. Offensive line has got to protect our QB to have a good season.

What did Vegas have us at for last year?

 

[CaneOil]

If its true that Kaaya is heisman caliber and a top 5 pick in the NFL and a junior.... 10 wins and legitimately challengng for the ACC title should be the expectation this season.

I could not agree more with this statement. If Kaaya stays healthy and Searels earns his paycheck it wouldn't be shocking to win 10 games.

Love to see 10+ wins but I think we're stuck on 9..Vegas says 6.5 go figure..

It's at 7 now, but I agree, Vegas is usually not off by much. Offensive line has got to protect our QB to have a good season.

What did Vegas have us at for last year?

I think it was 8, It was close enough where I wouldn't bet it. Someone posted here that it was at 6.5 so I went down the next day and bet it. S Point is the only one with it up this early that I know of, William Hill should have it soon, they are the biggest in Vegas.

 

[FrancisSawyer]

I could not agree more with this statement. If Kaaya stays healthy and Searels earns his paycheck it wouldn't be shocking to win 10 games.

Love to see 10+ wins but I think we're stuck on 9..Vegas says 6.5 go figure..

It's at 7 now, but I agree, Vegas is usually not off by much. Offensive line has got to protect our QB to have a good season.

What did Vegas have us at for last year?

I think it was 8, It was close enough where I wouldn't bet it. Someone posted here that it was at 6.5 so I went down the next day and bet it. S Point is the only one with it up this early that I know of, William Hill should have it soon, they are the biggest in Vegas.

I certainly wouldn't bet on it either. I just think it's a little strange that Vegas would have winning less games (7) than they predicted last year(8) considering the upgrade in coaching and the fact that we didn't really lose that much. Losing Artie Burns hurt us obviously as that CB corps is a little scary but I think with the talent up front as well as contributions from Redwine, Young and JJ that we will hold ourselves above water until reinforcements arrive.

 

[CaneOil]

Love to see 10+ wins but I think we're stuck on 9..Vegas says 6.5 go figure..

It's at 7 now, but I agree, Vegas is usually not off by much. Offensive line has got to protect our QB to have a good season.

What did Vegas have us at for last year?

I think it was 8, It was close enough where I wouldn't bet it. Someone posted here that it was at 6.5 so I went down the next day and bet it. S Point is the only one with it up this early that I know of, William Hill should have it soon, they are the biggest in Vegas.

I certainly wouldn't bet on it either. I just think it's a little strange that Vegas would have winning less games (7) than they predicted last year(8) considering the upgrade in coaching and the fact that we didn't really lose that much. Losing Artie Burns hurt us obviously as that CB corps is a little scary but I think with the talent up front as well as contributions from Redwine, Young and JJ that we will hold ourselves above water until reinforcements arrive.

A few times a year casino's have a few off lines, I believe this is one of them. I don't believe any of the other books open at 6.5, even 7 seems a bit low. I'd say 7.5 to 8 will be the opening at other books.

 

[ThomasM]

It's just mind blowing that they would EVER have a line of 6.5, much less going into the season with a huge upgrade at HC, easier schedule, Heisman candidate, experienced QB... This for a team that won 8 LAST YEAR with a harder schedule. Just doesn't make sense.

Love to see 10+ wins but I think we're stuck on 9..Vegas says 6.5 go figure..

It's at 7 now, but I agree, Vegas is usually not off by much. Offensive line has got to protect our QB to have a good season.

What did Vegas have us at for last year?

I think it was 8, It was close enough where I wouldn't bet it. Someone posted here that it was at 6.5 so I went down the next day and bet it. S Point is the only one with it up this early that I know of, William Hill should have it soon, they are the biggest in Vegas.

I certainly wouldn't bet on it either. I just think it's a little strange that Vegas would have winning less games (7) than they predicted last year(8) considering the upgrade in coaching and the fact that we didn't really lose that much. Losing Artie Burns hurt us obviously as that CB corps is a little scary but I think with the talent up front as well as contributions from Redwine, Young and JJ that we will hold ourselves above water until reinforcements arrive.

 

[The Franchise]

If its true that Kaaya is heisman caliber and a top 5 pick in the NFL and a junior.... 10 wins and legitimately challengng for the ACC title should be the expectation this season.

I could not agree more with this statement. If Kaaya stays healthy and Searels earns his paycheck it wouldn't be shocking to win 10 games.

UM fans act like 10 wins is a monumental mountain that we shouldn't be expected to climb. Didn't sorry *** Vag Tech win 10 games something like 11 out of 13 seasons in the late 1990s-2000s? UGA won 10 games last year in a tougher conference without their best player (Chubb) and without a QB.

10 wins should be expected. It should be a minimum expectation.

 

[The Franchise]

Not a single baseball player receives a full scholarship.
In fact, in a recent interview, Coach Morris stated that he has NEVER offered a full ride to any player at Miami.

The program only has 11 or 12 total scholarships to offer, and those can be split among up to 30 players (I believe).

Plus, one year at Miami costs $64K now (room/board/tuition).

How are the scholarship rules different now than they were when UM won its last 2 NCs in baseball? UM was also very expensive relatively speaking back then too.

 

[CampHillCane]

Wasn't saying they were different.

Someone implied that our baseball team should always be Top 5 due to some invisible hometown advantage. Someone else pointed out that they were at a disadvantage due to scholarships and such.

I was just explaining how the scholarships work. On top of that, there's the fact that UM is a private school and the state schools have some financial advantages. And on top of that, even if Miami is a hotbed of baseball talent, the rules for the MLB Draft sometimes end up taking our best talent from us before they ever set foot on campus.

I get that college baseball doesn't bring in nearly as much revenue as football or basketball, but the system still seems flawed.

 

[The Franchise]

Wasn't saying they were different.

Someone implied that our baseball team should always be Top 5 due to some invisible hometown advantage. Someone else pointed out that they were at a disadvantage due to scholarships and such.

I was just explaining how the scholarships work. On top of that, there's the fact that UM is a private school and the state schools have some financial advantages. And on top of that, even if Miami is a hotbed of baseball talent, the rules for the MLB Draft sometimes end up taking our best talent from us before they ever set foot on campus.

I get that college baseball doesn't bring in nearly as much revenue as football or basketball, but the system still seems flawed.

Our baseball team has the same advantages and disadvantages it had when we were winning NCs. UM was expensive then. And we dealt with the same scholarship restrictions. Vandy is expensive and deals with scholarship restrictions, and they've been killing it. So have many other expensive schools dealing with the same scholarship restrictions.

People are always looking for some excuse to prop up struggling coaches. Morris has been struggling for awhile to get back in the mix for NCs. He's been consistent in getting to Regionals. But that's not the standard here, and he knows it. If he didn't think this was a great job he would have stayed at GT, which is a pretty good college baseball job. He had a major league roster there.

Sometimes, it's the simple answer. Here, Morris got comfortable and probably lost a little bit of his edge. That happens all the time when a HC stays somewhere for a very long time. We also haven't recruited quite as well since the fall out with Turdhole Thomas.

 

[CTCANE]

The baseball team is a top 5 team this year, but they should be a top 5 team every year. One could argue that the baseball team has an even greater home town recruiting advantage than the football team. I think they have disappointed just as much as the football team these last 10 years.

With only 11.7 scholarships allowed in Baseball and the amount it costs to go to UM why should we be top 5 every year?

 

[Zbrod95]

Wasn't saying they were different.

Someone implied that our baseball team should always be Top 5 due to some invisible hometown advantage. Someone else pointed out that they were at a disadvantage due to scholarships and such.

I was just explaining how the scholarships work. On top of that, there's the fact that UM is a private school and the state schools have some financial advantages. And on top of that, even if Miami is a hotbed of baseball talent, the rules for the MLB Draft sometimes end up taking our best talent from us before they ever set foot on campus.

I get that college baseball doesn't bring in nearly as much revenue as football or basketball, but the system still seems flawed.

Our baseball team has the same advantages and disadvantages it had when we were winning NCs. UM was expensive then. And we dealt with the same scholarship restrictions. Vandy is expensive and deals with scholarship restrictions, and they've been killing it. So have many other expensive schools dealing with the same scholarship restrictions.

People are always looking for some excuse to prop up struggling coaches. Morris has been struggling for awhile to get back in the mix for NCs. He's been consistent in getting to Regionals. But that's not the standard here, and he knows it. If he didn't think this was a great job he would have stayed at GT, which is a pretty good college baseball job. He had a major league roster there.

Sometimes, it's the simple answer. Here, Morris got comfortable and probably lost a little bit of his edge. That happens all the time when a HC stays somewhere for a very long time. We also haven't recruited quite as well since the fall out with Turdhole Thomas.

[MENTION=4841]The Franchise[/MENTION] the baseball boys about to tag team you lol

 

[Zbrod95]

The baseball team is a top 5 team this year, but they should be a top 5 team every year. One could argue that the baseball team has an even greater home town recruiting advantage than the football team. I think they have disappointed just as much as the football team these last 10 years.

With only 11.7 scholarships allowed in Baseball and the amount it costs to go to UM why should we be top 5 every year?

you serious?? He has the most talented region for baseball and even with those scholarships restrictions, I personally know about 6 players from the last 3 years he's missed on that would've helped us this year that are starters everywhere else that he didn't give an offer to or didn't recruit as hard. Yea he has scholly restrictions but he hasn't made the best of them like he used too

 

[The Franchise]

Wasn't saying they were different.

Someone implied that our baseball team should always be Top 5 due to some invisible hometown advantage. Someone else pointed out that they were at a disadvantage due to scholarships and such.

I was just explaining how the scholarships work. On top of that, there's the fact that UM is a private school and the state schools have some financial advantages. And on top of that, even if Miami is a hotbed of baseball talent, the rules for the MLB Draft sometimes end up taking our best talent from us before they ever set foot on campus.

I get that college baseball doesn't bring in nearly as much revenue as football or basketball, but the system still seems flawed.

Our baseball team has the same advantages and disadvantages it had when we were winning NCs. UM was expensive then. And we dealt with the same scholarship restrictions. Vandy is expensive and deals with scholarship restrictions, and they've been killing it. So have many other expensive schools dealing with the same scholarship restrictions.

People are always looking for some excuse to prop up struggling coaches. Morris has been struggling for awhile to get back in the mix for NCs. He's been consistent in getting to Regionals. But that's not the standard here, and he knows it. If he didn't think this was a great job he would have stayed at GT, which is a pretty good college baseball job. He had a major league roster there.

Sometimes, it's the simple answer. Here, Morris got comfortable and probably lost a little bit of his edge. That happens all the time when a HC stays somewhere for a very long time. We also haven't recruited quite as well since the fall out with Turdhole Thomas.

[MENTION=4841]The Franchise[/MENTION] the baseball boys about to tag team you lol

LOL at those facquits. I've been a big UM baseball guy since the mid 80s. Been to Omaha twice for 2 entire CWS, and UM won both times. So, "the baseball boys" couldn't sniff my **** *** on UM baseball.

I don't mess with that baseball board because it's a toilet where 2 or 3 morons who have been banned over here for being ***** spew the same **** repeatedly.