Off-Topic Space, the final frontier, these are the voyages of NASA

Don’t kid yourself. They don’t HAVE TO do anything. They could scrap the whole project tomorrow.

I’m not saying they will, but it definitely wouldn’t surprise me at all.
No they very literally legally do have to.

In order to be able to scrap it they’d need congressional approval. Which would be great. Just not realistic whatsoever. NASA isn’t allowed to make the actual best decision. And due to the structure of the contracting, it incentivizes waste and incompetence, with zero repercussion.
 
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NASA has officially reclassified the Starliner CFT mission a Class A misshap (on the level of Challenger and Columbia Shuttle disasters) and says it will not fly until the the technical causes are corrected and investigation recces are implemented....

I give this update about a 95% chance that Boeing just straight up kills Starliner. I think its dead.



Quick summary kind of:
Anomalies:
- Loss of 6DOF control. Four recovered via in-situ troubleshooting. Likely cause = Two-phase oxidizer flow (vaporization/cavitation from thermal soakback, pulse demand, OMAC heating) + Teflon poppet extrusion restricting oxidizer flow.
- One thruster failed during descent, dropping the system to zero fault tolerance (a loss-of-crew scenario if the redundant path had failed). Likely Cause = Corrosion from carbazic acid formed by residual propellant + CO₂.
- 7 of 8 SM helium manifolds leaked. Likely cause = Seal material incompatibility with oxidizer (NTO degradation) + inadequate O-ring sizing/gland fill/squeeze tolerances.
- Propulsion system lacked required two-fault tolerance for deorbit burns (undetected for years).

Boeing demonstrated systemic qualification and testing shortfalls. RCS thrusters, valves, and seals were never properly qualified for actual flight environments. And prior anolmolies on previous test flights (10 thrusters failed on OFT1 and 3 failed on OFT2) were never fixed.

The funny thing is when the Commercial Crew awards were announced nobody thought SpaceX would be successful, and they all assumed Boeing would due to their history. And it's probably this exact thinking that allowed NASA and Boeing to not be as critical and get away with so much of their failures. And it led to NASA being FAR more critical and holding SpaceX to a higher standard, and basically letting Boeing get away with countless mistakes. So in a way this may have been good for SpaceX to have had NASA basically riding their asses, but they very clearly were getting treated much worse than Boeing who also received like $2B MORE than SpaceX... Also the fact is SpaceX had already had the Cargo contract so had years of experience already and just iterated on all that to go from a cargo capsule to crew capsule, while Boeing basically had to start from scratch. Secondly SpaceX is vertically integrated while Boeing relies on so many subcontractors. Full control and testing with rapid iteration and direct accountability and lower integration risks vs subcontractors and a complete lack of rigorous testing. It is actually crazy the methodology Boeing used for their testing tbh. NASAs report says SpaceX agressively root-caused and fixed any issues while Boeing didn't do flight-like duty cycles, and full integration effects and had " acceptance of unexplained anomalies without root cause resolution"!
 
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I guess I’ll just set this down right here…

This plan actually is an acceleration of the timeline imo. It just renames Artemis 3 Artemis 4 and still remains planned for 2028. But it adds a new Artemis mission Designated Artemis 3 (but for SLS to dock Orion to Starship/Blue Moon in LEO to test that aspect of the mission. And If the Suits are ready they will also be tested in a spacewalk, if not they'll be tested on ISS. That just makes sense tbh, never really made much sense beyond pure cost to not have ANY human launch and docking testing before the actual moon mission itself. So this should be similar to like Apollo 9 I believe. While Artemis 2 is similar to Apollo 8... So basically we're doing Apollo 8, 9, and 11. Apollo 10 is skipped which is the human lunar orbit. So seems like the correct plan.

The very good news is this announcement basically cancels EUS upperstage, which also basically cancels SLS block 1b and block 2 which would be insane money pits. And future Artemis missions will use a standardized upper stage like Centaur V. EUS I think has already spent $4B and then there is an additional $3B spent for the mobile launch platform.... which have all contributed $0 and will contribute $0 to an actual Moon landing. It's insane. Those were only going to be useful for "sustained" presence, but them and the launches for it would be so expensive there is quite literally 0 hope those do anything really... To get to the moon asap, SLS and orion are useful. Anything regarding a sustained presence needs to entirely be by SpaceX, Blue Origin, and whoever else wants to contribute. The current plan was garbage. And Isaacman is working to get rid of that bull****.

Secondly this new plan aims to increase the launch cadence of SLS, which for costs and actual technical ability is important. The goal they are now aiming for an SLS launch ever 10 months. It is currently on a once every 3 years launch pace... So this would be good. SLS is expensive and a waste but for the next 5 years Hopefully we can get 5-7 launches out of it before just killing the entire thing and moving to a more commercial solution. I mean once Starship and Blue Origin have HLS operating, Figuring out the Human launcher and getting to Lunar orbit shouldn't be that difficult. I mean immediately we can probably get Falcon Heavy human rated. And then New Glenn and Starship eventually human rated... **** Vulcan once they solve their SRB issues, can too...

Plus all along that, they are also working to accelerate the HLS contracts as well.

The thing that slows down the timeline is Artemis 2 delayed cause they are removing the helium tanks and doing some other replacements.
 
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Quicker than I thought it'd be. Good news. but the news just a couple days ago where Isaacman made himself Boeings worst enemy is real interesting.

He's trying to change the plan to have SLS launch Orion just to LEO where it will dock to Starship and Starship will be the one to essentially ferry it to Lunar orbit where it'll then leave Orion and will land on the moon for HLS. So basically eliminating using SLS to send Orion to Lunar orbit. If that happens it paints a big ******* red target on SLS to be killed. If you don't need to send Orion that far and only need to get it to LEO where Starship will then do all the work, then SLS has no logical reason for existing given it's price tag. The alternative can easily be New Glenn 9x4. The biggest struggle is human rating it. Other alternatives could be Falcon heavy (would have to be human rated). Starship itself but that'd have to undergo some changes and get human rated. Orion seems to be a non negotiable (so no Dragon to leo then just dock to starship).... But then also if you have orion that only ends up getting launched to Leo- what would be the point of any further investment in Starliner? Boeing is on the path to getting their two biggest contracts just fully cut with SLS and Starliner...
 

Major Announcements.



Man I hope Isaacmans can remain in place past Trump... And I hope Congress just aligns behind his vision.

Already getting to work on the obvious - cancelling gateway, cancelled icps, is about to cancel SLS beyond like Artemis VI...

Is putting in the work to target like a 2 order of magnitude increase in launches. The crazy thing is a lot of these goals can be achieved asap if you just let SpaceX and Blue Origin do a full sprint/race to plant flags. **** TODAY SpaceX can probably fully launch the sat communication constellation within like 6 months via starlink. And for cheaper than any competitor.. and not just talk they initiated 2 RIFs for Commercial Lunar launch/landings without SLS I believe. That's big.

But gunna test nuclear electric propulsion. The LTV (lunar terrain vehicle) program SHOULD be far cheaper now give all the EV investments that have been made by industry over the years.
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Fun times
 
The moon is already inhabited in the core and dark side that never gets sunlight .

NASA knows also tremendous solar flare is coming soon .
 
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Yeah right what? This is a very very very positive move for NASA. If this doesn't work, there honestly is little hope at NASA ever being anything close to what it used to be capable of for real

Yes, it’s a very positive move for NASA.

But it’s the rest of your post that highlights what I was referring to. The “if this doesn’t work” part.
 


Wonder if she will be CEO or if Musk will ... I imagine Musk will.

Shorwell is incredibly competent. **** wish she'd be COO of Tesla too....
 
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