• Attention: Register today to view CanesInSight Ad-Free for 7 days.

PAC 12 Scraps Divisions, effective 2022. ACC soon to follow.

CaneinBroward

Recruit
Joined
Apr 26, 2016
Messages
1,073
No divisions are the way to go in order to have a chance at 2 possible qualifiers to the 4 team playoff. The ACC was able to see this in 2020 when ND (ACC member that year) and Clemson both made it into the playoff. Divisions aren't bad, but if you have one division that is head and shoulders better than the other, your conference could be screwed out of getting multiple participants and the $$$ involved.

The only downside is at least in divisions you played the most number of games against similar opponents (i.e. 6 division rivals) so it made for a fairer "champion". Although you did have the 2 inter-division games which could give one school an advantage, such as Miami has FSU as cross-division rival and say Clemson was the other game where Pitt could be playing Syracuse as cross-division rival and BC. Without divisions, you could have pretty disparate strength of schedules.
 

DTP

Section 102
Joined
Dec 30, 2015
Messages
11,940
I hope the SEC drops divisions so the gators don’t get the lucky break of only having one good team in their division. That yearly “gauntlet” of Kentucky, Tennessee, Missouri, Vandy and South Carolina was a joke.
 

mossmadness

"Couldn't" Care Less.
Joined
Nov 3, 2011
Messages
4,126
Seems odd to do it this year, when the schedule is still going to be a “division” schedule.

Basically the PAC 12 hasn’t eliminated divisions, it has just eliminated the automatic bid to the PAC12CG that comes with winning the division.
 

TheOriginalCane

All American
Premium
Joined
Dec 22, 2011
Messages
24,500
Seems odd to do it this year, when the schedule is still going to be a “division” schedule.

Basically the PAC 12 hasn’t eliminated divisions, it has just eliminated the automatic bid to the PAC12CG that comes with winning the division.


Yeah, this is one of those weird debates. I am good friends with several USC alums, and when the Pac 12 expanded, there was a big fight against the "geographic" divisions, because everyone in the north wanted to play in Los Angeles with more frequency (for recruiting purposes).

Personally, I prefer knowing who my rivals are, I prefer having some certainty of scheduling. But I can also understand wanting to play certain teams more frequently.

I tend to focus on the drawbacks of eliminating the divisions. First, you have a greater likelihood of tiebreakers that are not based on head-to-head. At least when you have a tie for first place in a division, you can guarantee that there have been head-to-head games. I think it would suck to lose out on making an ACC Championship game when the #2 and #3 teams in the conference haven't had a chance to play each other.

Speaking of which, divisional play tends to cut down on the Championship Game being a "rematch". It doesn't eliminate the possibility entirely, just makes it more unlikely. Which, of course, leads in to the next point, which is that the luck of the draw is going to give some teams "easy" conference schedules. In the current system, you have only ONE "randomized" game, as you play your 6 divisional teams plus 1 permanent rival. However, under the new proposal, you would have 5 opponents selected out of the other 10 teams that are not your 3 "permanent rivals", leading to the possibility that the majority of your conference schedule is "soft" if you manage to avoid the toughest of those 10 possible opponents.

Also, how are we going to select the "3 permanent rivals"? I know we could sit here and hypothesize about who those should be "for Miami" or "for North Carolina", but you ultimately have to distribute the permanent rivalry games equally. So we can't just say "oh, Miami wants F$U and VaTech and Boston College" or some such thing, because at some point, some team will have to take the "leftovers". And don't even get me started on what happens if Notre Dame joins...

Of course, I'm not even sure why "not" playing in the ACC-CG would be such a bad thing if the #2 (division AND overall) team in the ACC Atlantic (or Coastal) has only lost to the division champ. Having only 1 loss, in an age of 12 regular season games and a P5 conference championship game, is almost always a ticket to the Final Four. Losing a conference championship game (perhaps for the second time) to another conference team tends to push that second team OUT of the Final Four consideration. I know getting 2 teams in the Final Four is awesome, but making those two teams play in the ACC-CG is not incredibly helpful.

Anyhow, just my thoughts on the matter, though I'm sure we will get overwhelmed by people who proclaim that 3-3-5 is the greatest thing since sliced bread.
 
Last edited:

SCarolina Ibis

Medical Redshirt
Joined
May 28, 2017
Messages
2,095
Yeah, this is one of those weird debates. I am good friends with several USC alums, and when the Pac 12 expanded, there was a big fight against the "geographic" divisions, because everyone in the north wanted to play in Los Angeles with more frequency (for recruiting purposes).

Personally, I prefer knowing who my rivals are, I prefer having some certainty of scheduling. But I can also understand wanting to play certain teams more frequently.

I tend to focus on the drawbacks of eliminating the divisions. First, you have a greater likelihood of tiebreakers that are not based on head-to-head. At least when you have a tie for first place in a division, you can guarantee that there have been head-to-head games. I think it would suck to lose out on making an ACC Championship game when the #2 and #3 teams in the conference haven't had a chance to play each other.

Speaking of which, divisional play tends to cut down on the Championship Game being a "rematch". It doesn't eliminate the possibility entirely, just makes it more unlikely. Which, of course, leads in to the next point, which is that the luck of the draw is going to give some teams "easy" conference schedules. In the current system, you have only ONE "randomized" game, as you play your 6 divisional teams plus 1 permanent rival. However, under the new proposal, you would have 5 opponents selected out of the other 10 teams that are not your 3 "permanent rivals", leading to the possibility that the majority of your conference schedule is "soft" if you manage to avoid the toughest of those 10 possible opponents.

Also, how are we going to select the "3 permanent rivals"? I know we could sit here and hypothesize about who those should be "for Miami" or "for North Carolina", but you ultimately have to distribute the permanent rivalry games equally. So we can't just say "oh, Miami wants F$U and VaTech and Boston College or some such thing, because at some point, some team will have to take the "leftovers". And don't even get me started on what happens if Notre Dame joins...

Of course, I'm not even sure why "not" playing in the ACC-CG would be such a bad thing if the #2 (division AND overall) team in the ACC Atlantic (or Coastal) has only lost to the division champ. Having only 1 loss, in an age of 12 regular season games and a P5 conference championship game, is almost always a ticket to the Final Four. Losing a conference championship game (perhaps for the second time) to another conference team tends to push that second team OUT of the Final Four consideration. I know getting 2 teams in the Final Four is awesome, but making those two teams play in the ACC-CG is not incredibly helpful.

Anyhow, just my thoughts on the matter, though I'm sure we will get overwhelmed by people who proclaim that 3-3-5 is the greatest thing since sliced bread.
U make some good points here. There are benefits to having 2 divisions when it comes to the playoffs. Ohio State in 2016 and Alabama in 2017 got into the playoffs without winning their division. Avoiding the conference championship game helped both of them. There's always an SEC west team that's guaranteed a spot in a major bowl game because they're not playing on conference championship weekend.
 

ben

Senior
Premium
Joined
Jun 3, 2012
Messages
5,510
nicksplat GIF
 
Top