OT | The hardest college to get into in every state

[Zbrod95]

Arizona is a massively underrated state when it comes to widespread stupidity. People always defaulting to Mississippi or West Virginia too quickly. I guess widespread inbreeding tilts general perceptions.

girls at ASU are out of hand though. I'm surprised more recruits don't official visit there on that alone...

They probably have OV rules...you gotta be verbally committed to Hawaii to OV if I remember correctly.

 

[thegrove]

They didn't even have all 50 states in that list.

And lulz at BYU having 2 schools on the list.

Must (not really, but it helps) be Mormon.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

 

[paksat]

alabama is the hardest uni to get into in alabama

nuff said about that sh*t hole

 

[hotshot]

When I got accepted into UM in 1962, the acceptance rate must have well over 90% (the U was about to embark on a MAJOR building campaign and needed every dollar), the tuition, room and board was like $3000 a year (possibly $2500?), and Hispanic-American students were rare. On the other hand, NY/NJ residents, Jaguar XKE automobiles, and reflectors to maximize tanning were not! Just to show how things have changed.

 

[OriginalCanesCanesCanes]

When I got accepted into UM in 1962, the acceptance rate must have well over 90% (the U was about to embark on a MAJOR building campaign and needed every dollar), the tuition, room and board was like $3000 a year (possibly $2500?), and Hispanic-American students were rare. On the other hand, NY/NJ residents, Jaguar XKE automobiles, and reflectors to maximize tanning were not! Just to show how things have changed.

Did you use to go to games in the OB as a student?

If yes, what was that like? Can’t even imagine.

 

[hotshot]

Original, I never missed a home game as a student; never saw an away game in person until after I graduated and moved to the DC area. There were NO day games at the OB that I can remember. So, no sweltering in daytime heat and humidity. Games were played on Friday or Saturday nights.

The Dolphins didn't come into being until just after I graduated so the Canes were the only game in town. Well, maybe I can't say that because I also was in an OB crowd in 1965 where Gables played Miami High in front of over 40,000. No joke!

The teams were pretty average but as an Independent trying to attract the Miami Beach tourist dollar, they usually played top drawer, "name" opponents. That contributed to the usual 5-5 record (occasionally a game worse or better as to record). George Mira was there my first couple years. One very nice season, one very disappointing. Since the head coach's connections were all in Pittsburgh/Western Pa, that's where the bulk of the good players came from. No FAMUs or Savannah State's on the schedule.

As for the crowds, like now, the OB would sell out for ND or UF. Good crowds for LSU, Auburn, GT etc. Weaker crowds for Vandy, Indiana, and that level of team. Fraternities were huge on campus and more so at the games. The Band of the Hour would play "Dixie" and the frat boys would wave the Stars and Bars Confederate flag. That always made me laugh -- Northerners "pretending" they were at a "southern school."

No black athletes at all while I was at UM. Our first Black player arrived in 1967. Why? The Admin's answer was always that "the SEC and other southern schools would not play us" if we had an integrated team. That was a HUGE missed opportunity since we were an Independent and could still have played top schools.

 

[Tetragrammaton Cane]

I bet we'll get a turnover chain bump in the admissions stats this year..

more exposure ==> more applications ==> lower admissions rate

Except that the kind of kid that typically applies to UMiami doesn't give a **** about the Turnover Chain. You may get a couple of idiots that think that Miami is your typical "Jock" school, and get summarily rejected, but odds are this bump will not be the boon most believe it will be. I think today's kids are a lot more savvy, they know **** well which schools they can actually get into, so you don't see as many reach kids as you saw in previous generations.

Schnellenberger never shows up at Miami -and his AD doesn’t have a vision of big time football- and Miami is not even William & Mary, JMU or tons of other “Colonial” type schools. Ever. Football paved the way to be associated with Big East schools and later ACC schools that had far better academic reputations than Miami ever could have attained through just alumni donations, research and graduate programs offered. That association raised Miami’s standing...more so then the kids admitted. Or, you can give all the credit to Shalala...

https://www.usnews.com/best-colleges/rankings/national-universities

According to the US News list University of Miami is #46 . Which is behind University of Florida and is 8th in the ACC and affiliates (Duke, ****, UVA, Wake, UNC, BC, GT)

Acceptance rate is one thing, but that doesn’t really matter to a blue-chip recruit looking at an ACC/SEC school.

Without football, and the previous Big East and now ACC affiliations, Miami wouldn’t be top-100 - maybe not even top-150.

 

[hotshot]

When my son was looking at schools to apply to back in the 90s, I of course checked out the U. Once I saw the tuition, Arizona State looked good (even though 2000 miles away).

 

[OriginalCanesCanesCanes]

Original, I never missed a home game as a student; never saw an away game in person until after I graduated and moved to the DC area. There were NO day games at the OB that I can remember. So, no sweltering in daytime heat and humidity. Games were played on Friday or Saturday nights.

The Dolphins didn't come into being until just after I graduated so the Canes were the only game in town. Well, maybe I can't say that because I also was in an OB crowd in 1965 where Gables played Miami High in front of over 40,000. No joke!

The teams were pretty average but as an Independent trying to attract the Miami Beach tourist dollar, they usually played top drawer, "name" opponents. That contributed to the usual 5-5 record (occasionally a game worse or better as to record). George Mira was there my first couple years. One very nice season, one very disappointing. Since the head coach's connections were all in Pittsburgh/Western Pa, that's where the bulk of the good players came from. No FAMUs or Savannah State's on the schedule.

As for the crowds, like now, the OB would sell out for ND or UF. Good crowds for LSU, Auburn, GT etc. Weaker crowds for Vandy, Indiana, and that level of team. Fraternities were huge on campus and more so at the games. The Band of the Hour would play "Dixie" and the frat boys would wave the Stars and Bars Confederate flag. That always made me laugh -- Northerners "pretending" they were at a "southern school."

No black athletes at all while I was at UM. Our first Black player arrived in 1967. Why? The Admin's answer was always that "the SEC and other southern schools would not play us" if we had an integrated team. That was a HUGE missed opportunity since we were an Independent and could still have played top schools.

Thanks for the history lesson.

Such a different experience for me when I attended, but it’s important to hear the experiences of a different bygone era.

It is a different place now, and it was one of the first universities to change in the “south” that’s for sure. That’s before my time, but I guess Miami, the school and the city, in the very early 60’s and before, was more “south” than what we think of Miami now.

 

[mirednmediocrity2]

Arizona is a massively underrated state when it comes to widespread stupidity. People always defaulting to Mississippi or West Virginia too quickly. I guess widespread inbreeding tilts general perceptions.

girls at ASU are out of hand though. I'm surprised more recruits don't official visit there on that alone...

They probably have OV rules...you gotta be verbally committed to Hawaii to OV if I remember correctly.

Northern Arizona is one scary place. Remember driving through there from the Grand Canyon and Flagstaff. Weirdest looking people I've ever seen. Locked the doors and rolled up the windows and went as fast as I could until we reached civilization in Phoenix. Worse than the hinterlands of LA, Missichitty, or. AL.

 

[OriginalCanesCanesCanes]

Arizona is a massively underrated state when it comes to widespread stupidity. People always defaulting to Mississippi or West Virginia too quickly. I guess widespread inbreeding tilts general perceptions.

girls at ASU are out of hand though. I'm surprised more recruits don't official visit there on that alone...

They probably have OV rules...you gotta be verbally committed to Hawaii to OV if I remember correctly.

Northern Arizona is one scary place. Remember driving through there from the Grand Canyon and Flagstaff. Weirdest looking people I've ever seen. Locked the doors and rolled up the windows and went as fast as I could until we reached civilization in Phoenix. Worse than the hinterlands of LA, Missichitty, or. AL.

I’ve been to the Grand Canyon, but I flew in on one of those excursion flights from Las Vegas. And I’ve been to Arizona but it’s always been into Phoenix and stayed there or Scottsdale. Arizona always seemed like a nice state to me. What the heck is going on in northern Arizona that would make it scary? Please fill me in. I guess I’ve never been there

 

[Canedude08]

I bet we'll get a turnover chain bump in the admissions stats this year..

more exposure ==> more applications ==> lower admissions rate

Except that the kind of kid that typically applies to UMiami doesn't give a **** about the Turnover Chain. You may get a couple of idiots that think that Miami is your typical "Jock" school, and get summarily rejected, but odds are this bump will not be the boon most believe it will be. I think today's kids are a lot more savvy, they know **** well which schools they can actually get into, so you don't see as many reach kids as you saw in previous generations.

Schnellenberger never shows up at Miami -and his AD doesn’t have a vision of big time football- and Miami is not even William & Mary, JMU or tons of other “Colonial” type schools. Ever. Football paved the way to be associated with Big East schools and later ACC schools that had far better academic reputations than Miami ever could have attained through just alumni donations, research and graduate programs offered. That association raised Miami’s standing...more so then the kids admitted. Or, you can give all the credit to Shalala...

https://www.usnews.com/best-colleges/rankings/national-universities

According to the US News list University of Miami is #46 . Which is behind University of Florida and is 8th in the ACC and affiliates (Duke, ****, UVA, Wake, UNC, BC, GT)

Acceptance rate is one thing, but that doesn’t really matter to a blue-chip recruit looking at an ACC/SEC school.

Without football, and the previous Big East and now ACC affiliations, Miami wouldn’t be top-100 - maybe not even top-150.

Complete and utter nonsense. Football was(and remains) a nice marketing tool, but the growth of the CITY OF MIAMI had more of a role in the growth of the University than the football program. I know it's a convenient narrative pushed by idiots like Corben, but the corporate dollars started flowing when people started to realize that Miami was the gateway to the Americas, and Foote and his fundraisers started selling the University as a corporation friendly incubator of diverse talent. If the city of Miami would have stayed a sleepy southern town, and Miami football was winning, the school wouldn't have grown. It would have been a private version of Alabama. That said, the city grew, and with that growth came corporate dollars, which led to significant improvements.

By the way, Miami didn't get into the ACC merely because of football, the ACC also noted that the University was a perfect fit academically and culturally. The school was firmly in the top 70 or so BEFORE the move. The school was climbing like a rocket BEFORE that point, what Foote, Shalala and their fundraisers did in over twenty years was far more important than what happens on twelve fall saturdays. If conference affiliation was so incredibly important to a school's rise, then explain why NC State, FSU and Clemson are still jokes, despite being directly associated with UVA, Miami, Georgia Tech, Duke, UNC, etc.?

 

[Tetragrammaton Cane]

I bet we'll get a turnover chain bump in the admissions stats this year..

more exposure ==> more applications ==> lower admissions rate

Except that the kind of kid that typically applies to UMiami doesn't give a **** about the Turnover Chain. You may get a couple of idiots that think that Miami is your typical "Jock" school, and get summarily rejected, but odds are this bump will not be the boon most believe it will be. I think today's kids are a lot more savvy, they know **** well which schools they can actually get into, so you don't see as many reach kids as you saw in previous generations.

Schnellenberger never shows up at Miami -and his AD doesn’t have a vision of big time football- and Miami is not even William & Mary, JMU or tons of other “Colonial” type schools. Ever. Football paved the way to be associated with Big East schools and later ACC schools that had far better academic reputations than Miami ever could have attained through just alumni donations, research and graduate programs offered. That association raised Miami’s standing...more so then the kids admitted. Or, you can give all the credit to Shalala...

https://www.usnews.com/best-colleges/rankings/national-universities

According to the US News list University of Miami is #46 . Which is behind University of Florida and is 8th in the ACC and affiliates (Duke, ****, UVA, Wake, UNC, BC, GT)

Acceptance rate is one thing, but that doesn’t really matter to a blue-chip recruit looking at an ACC/SEC school.

Without football, and the previous Big East and now ACC affiliations, Miami wouldn’t be top-100 - maybe not even top-150.

Complete and utter nonsense. Football was(and remains) a nice marketing tool, but the growth of the CITY OF MIAMI had more of a role in the growth of the University than the football program. I know it's a convenient narrative pushed by idiots like Corben, but the corporate dollars started flowing when people started to realize that Miami was the gateway to the Americas, and Foote and his fundraisers started selling the University as a corporation friendly incubator of diverse talent. If the city of Miami would have stayed a sleepy southern town, and Miami football was winning, the school wouldn't have grown. It would have been a private version of Alabama. That said, the city grew, and with that growth came corporate dollars, which led to significant improvements.

By the way, Miami didn't get into the ACC merely because of football, the ACC also noted that the University was a perfect fit academically and culturally. The school was firmly in the top 70 or so BEFORE the move. The school was climbing like a rocket BEFORE that point, what Foote, Shalala and their fundraisers did in over twenty years was far more important than what happens on twelve fall saturdays. If conference affiliation was so incredibly important to a school's rise, then explain why NC State, FSU and Clemson are still jokes, despite being directly associated with UVA, Miami, Georgia Tech, Duke, UNC, etc.?

No surprise you believe that Miami is more than it was/is...but without an incredible football program it would be considerably less of an institution by all and any measure.

There’s too much nonsense in your post to waste time rebutting or even citing evidence to the contrary; you believe what you believe and nothing is going to dissuade you (That’s kind of how CIS works anyway). Admirable...the whole school loyalty thing, but it’s ignorant and wrong, too. It’s an embarrassingly naive take that only proves that you’ve definitively (and emotionally) moved from drinking the kool-aid to an intravenous drip. Plus, from where I type, the whole proving a hypothetical thing...

...but if The Ghost of Football’s past and the collegiate version of It’s a Wonderful Life’s Clarence Odbody teamed up for that thought experiment, they would prove...somewhere between 100-150...at best.

That said, I’m always astonished at the amount of Miami alumni who are afraid to give football the credit it deserves as the rocket fuel for the lift off of the university’s academic reputation. That same Alabama, that you ridicule, acknowledges this fact - as do other schools. Oh well, que sera, sera.

I think we can at least agree that US News ranks Miami behind University of Florida. Because had it not been for the booming growth of Alachua county...

 

[Cajuncane]

Emory??

Big time nerdville. So yes, it's prestigious in terms of academics and difficult to get admitted.

My cousin has been the dean of girls there for years....nerd school is right

 

[SayWhat]

Emory??

Big time nerdville. So yes, it's prestigious in terms of academics and difficult to get admitted.

My cousin has been the dean of girls there for years....nerd school is right

Neeeeeerddddsssss! It isn't ever day I hear that term around, but times have changed since the Revenge movies. Those Neeeerrrrdddsssss are your future bosses.

 

[hotshot]

Original, I never missed a home game as a student; never saw an away game in person until after I graduated and moved to the DC area. There were NO day games at the OB that I can remember. So, no sweltering in daytime heat and humidity. Games were played on Friday or Saturday nights.

The Dolphins didn't come into being until just after I graduated so the Canes were the only game in town. Well, maybe I can't say that because I also was in an OB crowd in 1965 where Gables played Miami High in front of over 40,000. No joke!

The teams were pretty average but as an Independent trying to attract the Miami Beach tourist dollar, they usually played top drawer, "name" opponents. That contributed to the usual 5-5 record (occasionally a game worse or better as to record). George Mira was there my first couple years. One very nice season, one very disappointing. Since the head coach's connections were all in Pittsburgh/Western Pa, that's where the bulk of the good players came from. No FAMUs or Savannah State's on the schedule.

As for the crowds, like now, the OB would sell out for ND or UF. Good crowds for LSU, Auburn, GT etc. Weaker crowds for Vandy, Indiana, and that level of team. Fraternities were huge on campus and more so at the games. The Band of the Hour would play "Dixie" and the frat boys would wave the Stars and Bars Confederate flag. That always made me laugh -- Northerners "pretending" they were at a "southern school."

No black athletes at all while I was at UM. Our first Black player arrived in 1967. Why? The Admin's answer was always that "the SEC and other southern schools would not play us" if we had an integrated team. That was a HUGE missed opportunity since we were an Independent and could still have played top schools.

Thanks for the history lesson.

Such a different experience for me when I attended, but it’s important to hear the experiences of a different bygone era.

It is a different place now, and it was one of the first universities to change in the “south” that’s for sure. That’s before my time, but I guess Miami, the school and the city, in the very early 60’s and before, was more “south” than what we think of Miami now.

I'm not one of those old geezers who longs for the "good old days." In terms of quality of education, today's U is light years' better (the professors, facilities, everything); the campus back in my day, even in the tropical splendor of Miami, was not really all that attractive (the 3 story dorm apartment buildings (long-torn down now) were old even in the 60s and the high rises and classroom buildings were a mish-mash architecturally). There were no real "entrances" to the campus at all. You just turned onto roads running off Ponce; might not even have known you were on a campus.

You are letting the U off the hook with your "one of the first universities to change in the South" statement though. That's just not true. Nothing to congratulate ourselves on there (integration). We were pretty much in line with the Deep South "resistor" schools, maybe a year or so earlier than some, behind others.

The City of Miami was quite "southern" in character. The initial wave of Cuban immigrants had arrived but it would still be many years until their impact would be felt. There was the Dixie Highway and Palmetto Expressway but no I-95 or Florida Turnpike running through the city. Miami Beach, as a tourist destination was #1 in the county -- ahead of Vegas in those days, even without the gambling. Also, Disney World/Epcot and all that Orlando stuff was not in existence. No Metro either; you took Coral Gables busses and transferred if dependent on public transport.

 

[Canedude08]

I bet we'll get a turnover chain bump in the admissions stats this year..

more exposure ==> more applications ==> lower admissions rate

Except that the kind of kid that typically applies to UMiami doesn't give a **** about the Turnover Chain. You may get a couple of idiots that think that Miami is your typical "Jock" school, and get summarily rejected, but odds are this bump will not be the boon most believe it will be. I think today's kids are a lot more savvy, they know **** well which schools they can actually get into, so you don't see as many reach kids as you saw in previous generations.

Schnellenberger never shows up at Miami -and his AD doesn’t have a vision of big time football- and Miami is not even William & Mary, JMU or tons of other “Colonial” type schools. Ever. Football paved the way to be associated with Big East schools and later ACC schools that had far better academic reputations than Miami ever could have attained through just alumni donations, research and graduate programs offered. That association raised Miami’s standing...more so then the kids admitted. Or, you can give all the credit to Shalala...

https://www.usnews.com/best-colleges/rankings/national-universities

According to the US News list University of Miami is #46 . Which is behind University of Florida and is 8th in the ACC and affiliates (Duke, ****, UVA, Wake, UNC, BC, GT)

Acceptance rate is one thing, but that doesn’t really matter to a blue-chip recruit looking at an ACC/SEC school.

Without football, and the previous Big East and now ACC affiliations, Miami wouldn’t be top-100 - maybe not even top-150.

Complete and utter nonsense. Football was(and remains) a nice marketing tool, but the growth of the CITY OF MIAMI had more of a role in the growth of the University than the football program. I know it's a convenient narrative pushed by idiots like Corben, but the corporate dollars started flowing when people started to realize that Miami was the gateway to the Americas, and Foote and his fundraisers started selling the University as a corporation friendly incubator of diverse talent. If the city of Miami would have stayed a sleepy southern town, and Miami football was winning, the school wouldn't have grown. It would have been a private version of Alabama. That said, the city grew, and with that growth came corporate dollars, which led to significant improvements.

By the way, Miami didn't get into the ACC merely because of football, the ACC also noted that the University was a perfect fit academically and culturally. The school was firmly in the top 70 or so BEFORE the move. The school was climbing like a rocket BEFORE that point, what Foote, Shalala and their fundraisers did in over twenty years was far more important than what happens on twelve fall saturdays. If conference affiliation was so incredibly important to a school's rise, then explain why NC State, FSU and Clemson are still jokes, despite being directly associated with UVA, Miami, Georgia Tech, Duke, UNC, etc.?

No surprise you believe that Miami is more than it was/is...but without an incredible football program it would be considerably less of an institution by all and any measure.

There’s too much nonsense in your post to waste time rebutting or even citing evidence to the contrary; you believe what you believe and nothing is going to dissuade you (That’s kind of how CIS works anyway). Admirable...the whole school loyalty thing, but it’s ignorant and wrong, too. It’s an embarrassingly naive take that only proves that you’ve definitively (and emotionally) moved from drinking the kool-aid to an intravenous drip. Plus, from where I type, the whole proving a hypothetical thing...

...but if The Ghost of Football’s past and the collegiate version of It’s a Wonderful Life’s Clarence Odbody teamed up for that thought experiment, they would prove...somewhere between 100-150...at best.

That said, I’m always astonished at the amount of Miami alumni who are afraid to give football the credit it deserves as the rocket fuel for the lift off of the university’s academic reputation. That same Alabama, that you ridicule, acknowledges this fact - as do other schools. Oh well, que sera, sera.

I think we can at least agree that US News ranks Miami behind University of Florida. Because had it not been for the booming growth of Alachua county...

Miami alums don't give football "Credit" because it would be a complete farce to do so. Football has never, and I repeat never built a major University. Ironically enough, the things that make for successful football programs don't make for successful academic institutions. There's a reason why the USNR and the AP Top 25 will never look anything alike. There's a reason why Miami is part of a very small pool of truly academically orientated institutions that have found success in multiple revenue sports. By the way, your big breaking news item about UF being ranked ahead of MIami is a joke. 42nd vs 46th with those rankings is separated by DECIMAL POINTS. In other words, the difference between Miami and UF is basically seen as mere semantics, with both schools offering differing things. Frankly, I wouldn't be shocked if Miami's retrenchment following Dr. Frenk's hire is the reason why Miami fell behind UF.

The typical non-alum wants to feel that their only true love(football) is the reason why the school exists, to justify their short sighted and ignorant thought process behind how the school should be managed. Educated people, who understand that no one is writing huge checks for football, those checks ARE being written for big research projects, for medical stuff, etc. know that football has a place, and we should make sure that place fits within the larger purpose of the institution.

 

[Pete]

Has nothing to do with football.

You got that right! What a stupid,stupid posting.Like the ad says"Lemonade,can't you read!Football can't you
read!

 

[RVACane]

Arizona is a massively underrated state when it comes to widespread stupidity. People always defaulting to Mississippi or West Virginia too quickly. I guess widespread inbreeding tilts general perceptions.

girls at ASU are out of hand though. I'm surprised more recruits don't official visit there on that alone...

They probably have OV rules...you gotta be verbally committed to Hawaii to OV if I remember correctly.

Northern Arizona is one scary place. Remember driving through there from the Grand Canyon and Flagstaff. Weirdest looking people I've ever seen. Locked the doors and rolled up the windows and went as fast as I could until we reached civilization in Phoenix. Worse than the hinterlands of LA, Missichitty, or. AL.

I’ve been to the Grand Canyon, but I flew in on one of those excursion flights from Las Vegas. And I’ve been to Arizona but it’s always been into Phoenix and stayed there or Scottsdale. Arizona always seemed like a nice state to me. What the heck is going on in northern Arizona that would make it scary? Please fill me in. I guess I’ve never been there

It's been a little under 20 years since I've been there but I didn't get this scary vibe in Northern Arizona. If anything, in places like Sedona and Prescott, I remember a good number of crystal rock loving spiritual hippies sprinkled in with some salt of the earth types. There's definitely a weird vibe but it's UFO-ish - nothing like West Virginia. Now if you want a scarier place in Arizona, the worst to me is Kingman. That was a rough little town when I stopped there.

 

[hotshot]

Except that the kind of kid that typically applies to UMiami doesn't give a **** about the Turnover Chain. You may get a couple of idiots that think that Miami is your typical "Jock" school, and get summarily rejected, but odds are this bump will not be the boon most believe it will be. I think today's kids are a lot more savvy, they know **** well which schools they can actually get into, so you don't see as many reach kids as you saw in previous generations.

Schnellenberger never shows up at Miami -and his AD doesn’t have a vision of big time football- and Miami is not even William & Mary, JMU or tons of other “Colonial” type schools. Ever. Football paved the way to be associated with Big East schools and later ACC schools that had far better academic reputations than Miami ever could have attained through just alumni donations, research and graduate programs offered. That association raised Miami’s standing...more so then the kids admitted. Or, you can give all the credit to Shalala...

https://www.usnews.com/best-colleges/rankings/national-universities

According to the US News list University of Miami is #46 . Which is behind University of Florida and is 8th in the ACC and affiliates (Duke, ****, UVA, Wake, UNC, BC, GT)

Acceptance rate is one thing, but that doesn’t really matter to a blue-chip recruit looking at an ACC/SEC school.

Without football, and the previous Big East and now ACC affiliations, Miami wouldn’t be top-100 - maybe not even top-150.

Complete and utter nonsense. Football was(and remains) a nice marketing tool, but the growth of the CITY OF MIAMI had more of a role in the growth of the University than the football program. I know it's a convenient narrative pushed by idiots like Corben, but the corporate dollars started flowing when people started to realize that Miami was the gateway to the Americas, and Foote and his fundraisers started selling the University as a corporation friendly incubator of diverse talent. If the city of Miami would have stayed a sleepy southern town, and Miami football was winning, the school wouldn't have grown. It would have been a private version of Alabama. That said, the city grew, and with that growth came corporate dollars, which led to significant improvements.

By the way, Miami didn't get into the ACC merely because of football, the ACC also noted that the University was a perfect fit academically and culturally. The school was firmly in the top 70 or so BEFORE the move. The school was climbing like a rocket BEFORE that point, what Foote, Shalala and their fundraisers did in over twenty years was far more important than what happens on twelve fall saturdays. If conference affiliation was so incredibly important to a school's rise, then explain why NC State, FSU and Clemson are still jokes, despite being directly associated with UVA, Miami, Georgia Tech, Duke, UNC, etc.?

No surprise you believe that Miami is more than it was/is...but without an incredible football program it would be considerably less of an institution by all and any measure.

There’s too much nonsense in your post to waste time rebutting or even citing evidence to the contrary; you believe what you believe and nothing is going to dissuade you (That’s kind of how CIS works anyway). Admirable...the whole school loyalty thing, but it’s ignorant and wrong, too. It’s an embarrassingly naive take that only proves that you’ve definitively (and emotionally) moved from drinking the kool-aid to an intravenous drip. Plus, from where I type, the whole proving a hypothetical thing...

...but if The Ghost of Football’s past and the collegiate version of It’s a Wonderful Life’s Clarence Odbody teamed up for that thought experiment, they would prove...somewhere between 100-150...at best.

That said, I’m always astonished at the amount of Miami alumni who are afraid to give football the credit it deserves as the rocket fuel for the lift off of the university’s academic reputation. That same Alabama, that you ridicule, acknowledges this fact - as do other schools. Oh well, que sera, sera.

I think we can at least agree that US News ranks Miami behind University of Florida. Because had it not been for the booming growth of Alachua county...

Miami alums don't give football "Credit" because it would be a complete farce to do so. Football has never, and I repeat never built a major University. Ironically enough, the things that make for successful football programs don't make for successful academic institutions. There's a reason why the USNR and the AP Top 25 will never look anything alike. There's a reason why Miami is part of a very small pool of truly academically orientated institutions that have found success in multiple revenue sports. By the way, your big breaking news item about UF being ranked ahead of MIami is a joke. 42nd vs 46th with those rankings is separated by DECIMAL POINTS. In other words, the difference between Miami and UF is basically seen as mere semantics, with both schools offering differing things. Frankly, I wouldn't be shocked if Miami's retrenchment following Dr. Frenk's hire isn't a reason why Miami fell behind UF.

The typical non-alum wants to feel that their only true love(football) is the reason why the school exists, to justify their short sighted and ignorant thought process behind how the school should be managed. Educated people, who understand that no one is writing huge checks for football, those checks ARE being written for big research projects, for medical stuff, etc. know that football has a place, and we should make sure that place fits within the larger purpose of the institution.

I dunno abut that. Notre Dame was a nothing school in rural Indiana until the legend that Rockne created and the school becoming the rallying bastion of Catholicism.