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Mark Richt. What did he really do for Miami

Cookie917 said:
I dont think you are "dragging" his name but I think you are making a point to be the salmon going upstream just for the sake of it.

From what I glean, you are a-ok on Richt getting this amount of recognition for him as a person, what he did behind the scene and making us relevant but feel is coaching was overrated. I dont think anyone disagrees with you. I dont think anyone at UGA would disagree with you. A++++ as a human being. As a coach, he likely left some meat on the bone at both UM and UGA.

This is the line you said that stuck out to me: "I simply think that Richt is revered at a level for his coaching that I don’t think is warranted based upon what he achieved on the field here. " Now I agree if every post in here was saying how he was an x and o guru and only talking about coaching, sure make this comment. But I dont see anyoneeee in this thread solely brought up his coaching until you did to be the salmon. Lots saying he returned us to being relevant, that is true, that 17 season was fun, had a lot of buzz, he created the hype even if he didnt construct the perfect roster and call the perfect plays. Give that man his halo. You are arguing against shadows and ghosts.
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I replied to the original post about a ......coach.

I'm not arguing. I shared an opinion. Then I defended MY opinion when asked about it by several others on here. I understand that a lot of others don't want to believe what I wrote. I've also seen some misremembrances from several on here. It's ok; it happens. I never once disrespected Coach Richt despite what some may think. My quote that you listed I stand by. If you don't like it, that's fine but ask yourself if what I wrote is untrue or if it doesn't fit the narrative of Saint Mark the Coach. Saint Mark the person deserves his halo and I've given it to him.

He was a good coach here. I don't think he was a great coach. He was a .667 coach here over three seasons. His last season was a significant downward trend going 7-6. If his name was Mark Schmicht and had those same numbers, no one would push back on what I wrote. No one. Just to be fair, his name isn't Mark Schmicht and Mark Richt did do much more than just go 26-13 over three seasons which I've already acknowledged on here several times. Furthermore, since Butch, Richt was indeed our best coach by a fair amount up until Mario (and I'm not gonna get into this with Mario as his story is still being written). Here's a little more context: Schnellenberger, JJ, Erickson and Butch all had a winning percentage over .718. Schnelly and Butch had .718 and .719 and JJ and Erickson were mid .800 and up. Is .667 that much worse? In the case of Butch and Schnellenberger, no. I specifically chose those two names because those two guys had far more difficult paths to initial success then did JJ and Erickson. Schnellenberger and Butch both left with the program on a very high trajectory. Richt left with a 7-6 season.

You know why salmon swim upstream right? To spawn. I love spawning. I also love salmon. But I am not a salmon.
 
We've had so many questionable hires at UM, but two who gave us some fantastic moments and who gracefully stepped down when they realized it was time for someone else to take over were Coach Larranaga and Coach Richt.
They did themselves and UM athletics a big favor (cough, cough, Arteaga).
 
BigDikDaddyFromCincinnati said:
I replied to the original post about a ......coach.

I'm not arguing. I shared an opinion. Then I defended MY opinion when asked about it by several others on here. I understand that a lot of others don't want to believe what I wrote. I've also seen some misremembrances from several on here. It's ok; it happens. I never once disrespected Coach Richt despite what some may think. My quote that you listed I stand by. If you don't like it, that's fine but ask yourself if what I wrote is untrue or if it doesn't fit the narrative of Saint Mark the Coach. Saint Mark the person deserves his halo and I've given it to him.

He was a good coach here. I don't think he was a great coach. He was a .667 coach here over three seasons. His last season was a significant downward trend going 7-6. If his name was Mark Schmicht and had those same numbers, no one would push back on what I wrote. No one. Just to be fair, his name isn't Mark Schmicht and Mark Richt did do much more than just go 26-13 over three seasons which I've already acknowledged on here several times. Furthermore, since Butch, Richt was indeed our best coach by a fair amount up until Mario (and I'm not gonna get into this with Mario as his story is still being written). Here's a little more context: Schnellenberger, JJ, Erickson and Butch all had a winning percentage over .718. Schnelly and Butch had .718 and .719 and JJ and Erickson were mid .800 and up. Is .667 that much worse? In the case of Butch and Schnellenberger, no. I specifically chose those two names because those two guys had far more difficult paths to initial success then did JJ and Erickson. Schnellenberger and Butch both left with the program on a very high trajectory. Richt left with a 7-6 season.

You know why salmon swim upstream right? To spawn. I love spawning. I also love salmon. But I am not a salmon.
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Ok since you want to dig in, tell me who are these mystery fans propping up Richt for his COACHING. You said you responded to OP, he posted Richt, and the first thing he said about what he did was 1. donate his own money (not coaching related); 2. stepped down and didnt take his full contract (not coaching related) and 3. showed what Miami could be, with the clarifier of the lucky bounces we got in 2017 I guess you could argue the last one is coaching related?

And why are limiting his coaching to just Miami when he was only here 3 years??? No way his situation coming in when we were basically a laughing stock is similar to Butch taking over our team right??

So from 01-15 when he was head coach at UGA he had a .740 winning percentage since the winning % seems to be your biggest data point. His LIFETIME college coaching % would be .728, higher than the guys you mentioned.

Butch's HC win %... .537
SSchnelly .511
Erickson .651
Johnson .704
Richt .728

Now before you say well Johnson was coaching a ****** OK State team in the 80s, Erickson was coaching a ****** ASU 2000 team, Butch coaching a ****** FIU team and Schnelly a ****** FAU team, what do you think Miami mid 2015 team was? Good? You think Erickson taking over Miami in 2015 would have a better or worse result than Richt? These arent the kind of threads for splitting hairs. Give dude his props and just go on about the day.

Yous a salmon... not the spawning ones, the ones that just look raggedy and go up river thinking they gonna spawn and get lucky but then just die or get ate up by the same bear that attacked DBC.
 
Applecane said:
If Kaaya had returned in 2017, we would have been even better. Probably would have beaten Pitt and Wisconsin.
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@KrazyCane


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Cookie917 said:
BigDikDaddyFromCincinnati said:
I replied to the original post about a ......coach.

I'm not arguing. I shared an opinion. Then I defended MY opinion when asked about it by several others on here. I understand that a lot of others don't want to believe what I wrote. I've also seen some misremembrances from several on here. It's ok; it happens. I never once disrespected Coach Richt despite what some may think. My quote that you listed I stand by. If you don't like it, that's fine but ask yourself if what I wrote is untrue or if it doesn't fit the narrative of Saint Mark the Coach. Saint Mark the person deserves his halo and I've given it to him.

He was a good coach here. I don't think he was a great coach. He was a .667 coach here over three seasons. His last season was a significant downward trend going 7-6. If his name was Mark Schmicht and had those same numbers, no one would push back on what I wrote. No one. Just to be fair, his name isn't Mark Schmicht and Mark Richt did do much more than just go 26-13 over three seasons which I've already acknowledged on here several times. Furthermore, since Butch, Richt was indeed our best coach by a fair amount up until Mario (and I'm not gonna get into this with Mario as his story is still being written). Here's a little more context: Schnellenberger, JJ, Erickson and Butch all had a winning percentage over .718. Schnelly and Butch had .718 and .719 and JJ and Erickson were mid .800 and up. Is .667 that much worse? In the case of Butch and Schnellenberger, no. I specifically chose those two names because those two guys had far more difficult paths to initial success then did JJ and Erickson. Schnellenberger and Butch both left with the program on a very high trajectory. Richt left with a 7-6 season.

You know why salmon swim upstream right? To spawn. I love spawning. I also love salmon. But I am not a salmon.
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Ok since you want to dig in, tell me who are these mystery fans propping up Richt for his COACHING. You said you responded to OP, he posted Richt, and the first thing he said about what he did was 1. donate his own money (not coaching related); 2. stepped down and didnt take his full contract (not coaching related) and 3. showed what Miami could be, with the clarifier of the lucky bounces we got in 2017 I guess you could argue the last one is coaching related?

And why are limiting his coaching to just Miami when he was only here 3 years??? No way his situation coming in when we were basically a laughing stock is similar to Butch taking over our team right??

So from 01-15 when he was head coach at UGA he had a .740 winning percentage since the winning % seems to be your biggest data point. His LIFETIME college coaching % would be .728, higher than the guys you mentioned.

Butch's HC win %... .537
SSchnelly .511
Erickson .651
Johnson .704
Richt .728

Now before you say well Johnson was coaching a ****** OK State team in the 80s, Erickson was coaching a ****** ASU 2000 team, Butch coaching a ****** FIU team and Schnelly a ****** FAU team, what do you think Miami mid 2015 team was? Good? You think Erickson taking over Miami in 2015 would have a better or worse result than Richt? These arent the kind of threads for splitting hairs. Give dude his props and just go on about the day.

Yous a salmon... not the spawning ones, the ones that just look raggedy and go up river thinking they gonna spawn and get lucky but then just die or get ate up by the same bear that attacked DBC.
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You’ve completely changed the direction and data points in order to be right on your mind. I specifically mentioned what he did on the field. I don’t recall if I specifically mentioned at Miami or not, but clearly that’s what was implied.

I’m not so sure why you’re so sensitive about this topic, Jon. Your dad is a great person and I’ve said as much repeatedly.

Last I checked, this is still America where we have a right to free speech and we can disagree. I’ve spent enough time responding to folks on this thread and I’ve been fairly respectable about it.
 
BigDikDaddyFromCincinnati said:
You’ve completely changed the direction and data points in order to be right on your mind. I specifically mentioned what he did on the field. I don’t recall if I specifically mentioned at Miami or not, but clearly that’s what was implied.

I’m not so sure why you’re so sensitive about this topic, Jon. Your dad is a great person and I’ve said as much repeatedly.

Last I checked, this is still America where we have a right to free speech and we can disagree. I’ve spent enough time responding to folks on this thread and I’ve been fairly respectable about it.
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How have I changed directions? You are looking at Richt in a vacuum of his 3 years here which I think anyone would opine is not enough time in college ball, his first recruiting class had not matured. Erickson here 6 years, JJ 5 years, Schnelly 5 years, Butch 6 years.

My question, why not look at the entire body of coaching work?

Also, do not forget I started this by saying both Miami and UGA fans alike probably agree from a pure x and o standpoint as a coach was not his strength. But why bring up a perceived weakness in a simple appreciation thread? I likewise think I have been respectable, unsure what that matters, I agree you are being respectful in defending your position if that helps I dont thin we are disagreeing. We both agree he left some to be desired as a HC. So did Butch, his knock and still today was him not being an x and o guy.

This is like if someone posted an appreciation thread about Ed Reed and all the great things he did, you would come in to be like yeahhhh but he was susceptible to the double move because he was too aggressive. Like cool, thats a great talking point for him as a player but whats it matter in an appreciation thread?

Its the salmon. Its like me saying I like waffles and you respond you hate pancakes... okay, free speech but you are going out of your way to stand 10 toes on a point no one is arguing about you over just to say you dont want to give him as much appreciation as JJ, Butch, Erickson and Schnelly?
 
Well, he led a comeback against Florida in 1981 so he's good by me. Seriously, he did turned the trajectory or at least the perception of the program. I know he was surprised by the lack of talent. He just didn't have the juice and resigned. He left us in a decent position to make a good hire financially. Then that idiot Blake James screwed the pooch and hired the Temple coach after 17 days on the job.
 
Cookie917 said:
How have I changed directions? You are looking at Richt in a vacuum of his 3 years here which I think anyone would opine is not enough time in college ball, his first recruiting class had not matured. Erickson here 6 years, JJ 5 years, Schnelly 5 years, Butch 6 years.

My question, why not look at the entire body of coaching work?

Also, do not forget I started this by saying both Miami and UGA fans alike probably agree from a pure x and o standpoint as a coach was not his strength. But why bring up a perceived weakness in a simple appreciation thread? I likewise think I have been respectable, unsure what that matters, I agree you are being respectful in defending your position if that helps I dont thin we are disagreeing. We both agree he left some to be desired as a HC. So did Butch, his knock and still today was him not being an x and o guy.

This is like if someone posted an appreciation thread about Ed Reed and all the great things he did, you would come in to be like yeahhhh but he was susceptible to the double move because he was too aggressive. Like cool, thats a great talking point for him as a player but whats it matter in an appreciation thread?

Its the salmon. Its like me saying I like waffles and you respond you hate pancakes... okay, free speech but you are going out of your way to stand 10 toes on a point no one is arguing about you over just to say you dont want to give him as much appreciation as JJ, Butch, Erickson and Schnelly?
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TLDR

Here's what I said in my first comment: "I think the level of reverence Mark Richt is paid is not commensurate with what he achieved here."

The only slight modification I would consider making is adding "on the field" at the very end of that sentence. I've literally given him props for every single other thing that has been mentioned.

Everything else you've written is twisting and pulling and stretching in an attempt to be right. IT'S AN OPINION. And it's not a stupid opinion. I gave my reasons several times and they are legitimate and based in fact. You don't like that OPINION? No problem. Calling me a salmon because you don't agree with me is awfully juvenile - and trust me, I know juvenile behavior. I don't think "salmon" is clever, but whatever. You're the only person who decided to take it to this level. I'm going to stop replying to you now because I have some work to attend to . I also just got back from eating some Mexican food forlunch, so I have this thing I need to do shortly as well.

Have a nice day and Go Canes.
 
BigDikDaddyFromCincinnati said:
TLDR

Here's what I said in my first comment: "I think the level of reverence Mark Richt is paid is not commensurate with what he achieved here."

The only slight modification I would consider making is adding "on the field" at the very end of that sentence. I've literally given him props for every single other thing that has been mentioned.

Everything else you've written is twisting and pulling and stretching in an attempt to be right. IT'S AN OPINION. And it's not a stupid opinion. I gave my reasons several times and they are legitimate and based in fact. You don't like that OPINION? No problem. Calling me a salmon because you don't agree with me is awfully juvenile - and trust me, I know juvenile behavior. I don't think "salmon" is clever, but whatever. You're the only person who decided to take it to this level. I'm going to stop replying to you now because I have some work to attend to . I also just got back from eating some Mexican food forlunch, so I have this thing I need to do shortly as well.

Have a nice day and Go Canes.
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So you did read it you dirty lil liar.

Again I am not confronting you over your OPINION (do the caps make it more persuasive? or why did you put it in caps) My comment is bringing up your fly specking OPINION in an appreciation thread based on the "fact" richt did not win a higher % of games in a lower amount of time while coaching at UM.

The salmon comment wasnt a shot, it was an analogy. You see how everyone in this thread is just giving Richt his props as a human? See how no one is fly specking him keeping his son as an unqualified OC? that is the river flowing, we are all on it like drunks in inner tubes. You are the salmon that has to go against the flow to state your OPINION (are the all caps working?) when no one is bringing it up in an appreciation thread.
 
Cookie917 said:
So you did read it you dirty lil liar.

Again I am not confronting you over your OPINION (do the caps make it more persuasive? or why did you put it in caps) My comment is bringing up your fly specking OPINION in an appreciation thread based on the "fact" richt did not win a higher % of games in a lower amount of time while coaching at UM.

The salmon comment wasnt a shot, it was an analogy. You see how everyone in this thread is just giving Richt his props as a human? See how no one is fly specking him keeping his son as an unqualified OC? that is the river flowing, we are all on it like drunks in inner tubes. You are the salmon that has to go against the flow to state your OPINION (are the all caps working?) when no one is bringing it up in an appreciation thread.
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I saw the first sentence or so, then the last. Reading implies I read the whole thing which I didn't. Now before you go calling me a ccoccsucker, you should check what has been in your mouth.....

So you did read it you dirty lil liar. - NOPE. See above.

Again I am not confronting you over your OPINION LIE, you're doing it again in your last reply (do the caps make it more persuasive? or why did you put it in caps - for emphasis) My comment is bringing up your fly specking OPINION in an appreciation thread based on the "fact" richt did not win a higher % of games in a lower amount of time while coaching at UM. LIE. I simply said that he gets more love than what I FEEL (more emphasis) he has earned for the time he spent here. Did you miss all the flowers I threw at him as well?

The salmon comment wasnt a shot, it was an analogy. LIE You see how everyone in this thread is just giving Richt his props as a human? No. I see a lot of people doing that, not EVERYONE (that time the caps are to illustrate another LIE you told. See how no one is fly specking him keeping his son as an unqualified OC? LIE. It's been mentioned a couple times by people not claiming to be from Cincy. Someone referred to his son as Jorn which made me laugh. It's been mentioned a couple times that is the river flowing, we are all on it like drunks in inner tubes. You are the salmon that has to go against the flow to state your OPINION (are the all caps working?) when no one is bringing it up in an appreciation thread. You are literally the only person that has made a mission out of this. The only. No one else has put forth the effort you have to prove some point. I originally commented that I would likely get dragged for the comment.

As for the flyspeck part - you're doing it again. Minimizing the comment in order to try to prove that my point is meritless.

The large font and bold is simply to differentiate between your drivel and mine. Why is it so difficult for you to simply shrug your shoulders and say we have a difference of opinion? This isn't that deep.

I don't expect you to stop replying, so I will now.
 
BigDikDaddyFromCincinnati said:
I saw the first sentence or so, then the last. Reading implies I read the whole thing which I didn't. Now before you go calling me a ccoccsucker, you should check what has been in your mouth.....

So you did read it you dirty lil liar. - NOPE. See above.

Again I am not confronting you over your OPINION LIE, you're doing it again in your last reply (do the caps make it more persuasive? or why did you put it in caps - for emphasis) My comment is bringing up your fly specking OPINION in an appreciation thread based on the "fact" richt did not win a higher % of games in a lower amount of time while coaching at UM. LIE. I simply said that he gets more love than what I FEEL (more emphasis) he has earned for the time he spent here. Did you miss all the flowers I threw at him as well?

The salmon comment wasnt a shot, it was an analogy. LIE You see how everyone in this thread is just giving Richt his props as a human? No. I see a lot of people doing that, not EVERYONE (that time the caps are to illustrate another LIE you told. See how no one is fly specking him keeping his son as an unqualified OC? LIE. It's been mentioned a couple times by people not claiming to be from Cincy. Someone referred to his son as Jorn which made me laugh. It's been mentioned a couple times that is the river flowing, we are all on it like drunks in inner tubes. You are the salmon that has to go against the flow to state your OPINION (are the all caps working?) when no one is bringing it up in an appreciation thread. You are literally the only person that has made a mission out of this. The only. No one else has put forth the effort you have to prove some point. I originally commented that I would likely get dragged for the comment.

As for the flyspeck part - you're doing it again. Minimizing the comment in order to try to prove that my point is meritless.

The large font and bold is simply to differentiate between your drivel and mine. Why is it so difficult for you to simply shrug your shoulders and say we have a difference of opinion? This isn't that deep.

I don't expect you to stop replying, so I will now.
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So you did read this one is what all that is saying?
 
BigDikDaddyFromCincinnati said:
Unpopular take and I’m sure I’ll get dragged: I think the level of reverence Mark Richt is paid is not commensurate with what he achieved here.

To be clear, this is not disrespect. I didn’t say he deserves no reverence. I simply think a LOT of our fans and alumni act as if he brought us championships when in reality he brought us one overachieving season and a few other mediocre seasons. Yes he added (temporary) credibility. Yes he was incredibly generous. Yes he stepped down when he needed to. He is a humble and kind man by all accounts. Those are all admirable acts and traits and deserve to be recognized. At the same time, those things have nothing to do with on field achievement.
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no one has ever said, or thought, he brought championships.
 
Hoyacane1620 said:
BigDikDaddyFromCincinnati said:
Unpopular take and I’m sure I’ll get dragged: I think the level of reverence Mark Richt is paid is not commensurate with what he achieved here.

To be clear, this is not disrespect. I didn’t say he deserves no reverence. I simply think a LOT of our fans and alumni act as if he brought us championships when in reality he brought us one overachieving season and a few other mediocre seasons. Yes he added (temporary) credibility. Yes he was incredibly generous. Yes he stepped down when he needed to. He is a humble and kind man by all accounts. Those are all admirable acts and traits and deserve to be recognized. At the same time, those things have nothing to do with on field achievement.
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no one has ever said, or thought, he brought championships.
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“Act as if” was the wording I chose. Is that the same as thought? Eh maybe, maybe not. I wrote what I wrote.

I don’t feel like having another back and forth so I’ll just say “you’re right” so we can both return to our regularly scheduled programs.
 
BigDikDaddyFromCincinnati said:
This is the sort of thing that illustrates why I made the post with my original thoughts in this thread. The comment you replied to made a statement as if it was factually true (but isn't) and it has added to the lore. Meanwhile, what you said is the actual truth. Also, if memory serves me correctly, Herbstreit's famed speech on ESPN questioning The University of Miami's adminstration's commitment to football came THREE YEARS AFTER Richt was gone.
None of what I just wrote is anything negative with respect ro Richt. It simply shows how people misremember things at times.
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I think the problem with the latter half of your analysis there is that that was the admins doing. WHAT IF we had directly/urgently committed to getting Mario right after he retired?

Now see Idk what date it was KNOWN Richt was going to ultimately retire/not return. But Manny took the AppSt HC job 12/7. Taggart left Oregon like 12/5 and Mario accepted promotion to HC 12/8. Technically Richt announced his retirement 12/30. BUT, we also announced Diaz would be our HC the same day. Was there discussion of Richt not returning prior to 12/8? Was there no possibility to get Mario by 12/30?...

Now maybe you say Mario was better for us having had the Oregon HC job for 3 yrs. I actually believe that is probably the case, because he had the facilities and investment guarantees there and success and then when he came here he was able to make the investment demands that the admin/boosters agreed to. BUT had we gone straight to Mario from Richt, I'd bet you the overall 10yr hindsight look on the program from Pre-Richt to then how we are with Mario, it'd look pretty clearly like Richt was the foundation of it...
 
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