How would a one-gap 4-3 defense fix our issues?

[moshated305]

Another thing to keep in mind...

Regardless of whether we run 4-3 or 3-4, alot of importance is placed on HOW we line up. Our leverage. Are we still gonna walk our LB's out over the slots and leave 5 or 6 defenders in the box? Are we still gonna line up with a 5-technique DE vs. TE with no OLB to hold the edge?

These things happen whether we use the 4-3 or the 3-4. The way we line-up in the back-7 is mind boggling at times.

To me, one of the most frustrating things about our D is the alignment. There was an entire thread on how we line up our LBs so far behind our DL, even on the goal line and short yardage. It's hard to understand how it's possible for our LBs to ever make TFLs when they have to run an extra few yards just to get to the line of scrimmage.

It's also frustrating to see our LBs line up over slot receivers. I get that in some sets, our LBs will be lined up on guys in the slot. But, I don't get why we leave in a 3rd LB when teams go to 3 wide when our alignment is to have the LB line up over the WR. The advantage of not going to the nickel is to have the extra LB on the field for run support. If that LB is lined up out on a WR, we have the worst of both worlds - a LB covering a WR (even if it's in a zone) instead of a nickel CB and we're short guys in the box. Just doesn't make sense to me to get outnumbered in the box AND have worse coverage on the field. Does this kind of coverage ever work on a regular basis?

This is a huge problem, IMO. Going back to UNC, we had LBs matched up with Ebron for the majority of the game. Did they really think that would work? Fast forward a week to Wake and you would think we learned our lesson. Nope, we lined up LBs across from Campanaro, the only **** person Wake ever throws too until the 4th when we finally wised up and put Crawford on him. He caught one pass in the 4th quarter and drew a pass interference. Sad part is, we let other guys who usually didn't get **** get off as well. Teams saw this and attacked accordingly, FSU, VT, and Wake all carved up our LBs out of the slot and with their backs. I don't recall Howard or Gunter getting beat in coverage against Duke yet they still got whatever they wanted in the passing game. They didn't even attempt to challenge our CBs but they did their homework and knew they could beat our LBs in coverage.

 

[Ernie McCracken]

Vegas Franklin, Eric moncur and Terez McCray

We had a dt who was 255 and a de who was 245 starting and stopping the run in 2007 and were good. If they played in this system they would get dominated just like we are today.. We need to move to a 4-3

3-4 and 4-3 aren't the issues. The big question Coach Golden will have to mull over is "are we asking our current and future DL to do something that doesn't maximize our talent?" The only part that scares me is that he will simply refuse to even consider the question. I keep telling myself he's shown evidence of being practical in other areas (specifically, roster management), so he'll do the same here.

What the man says publicly and what he's "actually considering" could be two drastically different things. I refuse to believe that he "refuses to consider the question". IMO there are 100's of variables that go into a decision like this.

We (fans) take a couple dozen of those variables and express our feelings in definite. I understand why everyone is upset and wants better and is frustrated with the perceived lack of progress on the defensive side of the ball. I think the detractors, for the most part, have valid concerns.

I just think the overreaction on here has been epic and premature. None of us truly know what Al's ultimate goal is for this defense and how he wants to get there. That's why I think the real question is and always has been "do you trust Al (based on his past history & deductive reasoning) to make the correct decisions" moving forward?

Based on his past history of fielding solid (not great) defenses and building a solid program @ Temple (from the ashes) is proof enough for me (at this point). Will we ever win big with Al? I think that is a solid question that right now, I'm not sure anyone can answer. I still think he will.

Without a doubt re: his public vs private comments. I've said the same dozens of times. I also understand we may seem to have less variables at our disposal. Some of the posters have a bit more because they're privy to certain comments or perspectives from within the team.

If you mean that the overreaction of "Golden should be fired" or "Golden is a piece of ****" is epic and premature. I agree. Personally, I try to keep the reaction focused to what's happening on the field against teams and how that relates to what will happen on the field against future teams. You saw my answer to your thread on whether we still believed in Al or thought he'd win a Championship. I basically said I think he's here for a while.

As for your new question on whether to blindly trust Coach Golden, I think it's a question worth posing to everyone. You hit it in your last sentence as to what's my biggest concern. I would like for us to maximize whatever talent we get. And, being in South Florida, we have access to some really good talent. I think the jury is still out on whether he'll make the necessary moves (whatever they may be) to make that happen. I sure as **** hope so. It'd be the quickest way to our success.

I wonder about the "square peg, round hole" argument regarding South Florida kids.

I think it would be foolish to try to run a precision pro-style passing attack with guys like Shoelace Robinson and Jeffrey Godfrey at QB.

But is our current defensive scheme anathema to South Florida talent?

I don't know the answer to that, but it seems to have become conventional wisdom. Maybe our guys can't/won't thrive in this system, but generally speaking, I think they should.

In our best days, when we were running a 4-3, most of our great defensive tackles came from OUT OF STATE.

We didn't recruit south florida kids to play that position at that time, so I don't see why the "south florida kids can't play a 2 gap" argument makes any sense. We didn't recruit south florida kids to play a one gap.

South Florida is to a point where we produce great skill position players, but not a lot of anything else. The 2015 class has a million 4 and 5 star wide receivers from South Florida, but it's thin at linebacker and defensive line. Part of that is just the south florida athlete, and part of that is the 7 on 7's making every good athlete want to play wide receiver.

 

[Ernie McCracken]

Ask yourself this... where are the great South Florida linebackers in 2014 or 2015? I don't think there's a single 4 star linebacker from South Florida in either class.

But there's like 30 wide receivers, CB's, safeties, and running backs.

It doesn't matter what scheme you're in if your linebackers are mediocre. In the old days, a kid like Dalvin Cook would have played linebacker and that's how you get your Ray Lewis type talents.

 

[Coach Macho]

Ask yourself this... where are the great South Florida linebackers in 2014 or 2015? I don't think there's a single 4 star linebacker from South Florida in either class.

But there's like 30 wide receivers, CB's, safeties, and running backs.

It doesn't matter what scheme you're in if your linebackers are mediocre. In the old days, a kid like Dalvin Cook would have played linebacker and that's how you get your Ray Lewis type talents.

Uh...

No.

 

[weownfsu]

Ask yourself this... where are the great South Florida linebackers in 2014 or 2015? I don't think there's a single 4 star linebacker from South Florida in either class.

But there's like 30 wide receivers, CB's, safeties, and running backs.

It doesn't matter what scheme you're in if your linebackers are mediocre. In the old days, a kid like Dalvin Cook would have played linebacker and that's how you get your Ray Lewis type talents.

A kid like Ray Lewis isn't from South Florida. You aren't limited to linebackers from South Florida.

 

[CanesAreAble]

i never saw a Randy defense get "mucked up" or done as bad as we have the last 5 weeks. And if it was it was done by a legit guy like a Petrino etc.

If we're talking about when Shannon was DC, his defenses almost never got tuned up. When he was head coach, there were definitely some stinkers in there. Wake Forest had close to 600 yards of offense in '09. There was also FSU '10, Clemson '09, FSU '08, GTech '08, NC State '08, OU '07, UVA '07, and maybe a couple more.

 

[CanesAreAble]

This is a huge problem, IMO. Going back to UNC, we had LBs matched up with Ebron for the majority of the game. Did they really think that would work? Fast forward a week to Wake and you would think we learned our lesson. Nope, we lined up LBs across from Campanaro, the only **** person Wake ever throws too until the 4th when we finally wised up and put Crawford on him. He caught one pass in the 4th quarter and drew a pass interference.

I think this is overblown.

Good players are good for a reason. Every team has a scouting report on Ebron, but that doesn't mean he's easy to stop. He wouldn't be NFL-caliber if it was easy. Most of his damage was done on the play with the missed tackles that went for 75 yards. He beat us in zone a few times, and he also beat Bush and Jenkins in man a couple times.

Same thing with Campanaro. The guy is good. BTW it's not like we had a LB lined up on him one-on-one the whole game or something like that. There were a couple times where we had a LB covering the underneath routes in zone coverage. On Wake's first possession, he beat Artie Burns in press coverage to pick up a 3rd & 5. He caught a few tunnel screens as well.


This defense absolutely deserves to get criticized and ripped to shreds, but I think some of the stuff is nitpicking.

 

[Ernie McCracken]

Ask yourself this... where are the great South Florida linebackers in 2014 or 2015? I don't think there's a single 4 star linebacker from South Florida in either class.

But there's like 30 wide receivers, CB's, safeties, and running backs.

It doesn't matter what scheme you're in if your linebackers are mediocre. In the old days, a kid like Dalvin Cook would have played linebacker and that's how you get your Ray Lewis type talents.

Uh...

No.

Who the **** asked your Randy Shannon slurping ***?

************ thinks he's Vince Lombardi

 

[Ernie McCracken]

Ask yourself this... where are the great South Florida linebackers in 2014 or 2015? I don't think there's a single 4 star linebacker from South Florida in either class.

But there's like 30 wide receivers, CB's, safeties, and running backs.

It doesn't matter what scheme you're in if your linebackers are mediocre. In the old days, a kid like Dalvin Cook would have played linebacker and that's how you get your Ray Lewis type talents.

A kid like Ray Lewis isn't from South Florida. You aren't limited to linebackers from South Florida.

That's true he went to killian. All the same, where are the four or five star linebackers in this years class or next years class?

There are like 30 wr's and no linebackers according to all the scouting services, not just my opinion. Whereas in the past, south Florida would produce a lot of linebackers.

Also, mother****ers like wildcat like to say that we need to go to a 4-3 because that fits the south Florida athlete better, but that's false because even when we were a 4-3 team we went out of state for our great defensive linemen

 

[Cane Dynasty]

I kinda like the consistency of the 3-4 bailout that we run now. About the same viscosity as grits.

 

[Coach Macho]

Ask yourself this... where are the great South Florida linebackers in 2014 or 2015? I don't think there's a single 4 star linebacker from South Florida in either class.

But there's like 30 wide receivers, CB's, safeties, and running backs.

It doesn't matter what scheme you're in if your linebackers are mediocre. In the old days, a kid like Dalvin Cook would have played linebacker and that's how you get your Ray Lewis type talents.

Uh...

No.

Who the **** asked your Randy Shannon slurping ***?

************ thinks he's Vince Lombardi

Ay...


You're the guy who compared a 5'11" Running Back to Ray Lewis.