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How do Collectives work?

RVACane said:
Nice yearbook photo with your classmates.

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Look at @Dr.L.ThugU in his younger days. Smack that smile right off his face




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cdmd said:
In theory, this is how they're supposed to work...

A group of donors get together and pool their money via a collective. The collective then buys an athlete's NIL rights. The collective pays them a negotiated guaranteed fee. The collective can then go out to the market and resell the athlete's NIL to recoup their investment. The collectives know they won't reasonably recoup their investment, so they operate at a loss.

Let's use Nico and UT as an example:
- UT donor-backed collective signs Nico to a $1M/year NIL deal.
- UT collective now owns Nico's NIL
- UT collective reaches out to local businesses to have Nico as their spokesman.
- Local business pays UT collective to have Nico make an appearance at an event. Let's say they pay $100k for the appearance.
- Nico does the appearance.
- This is the only NIL deal the collective does for the year on behalf of Nico
- Nico gets paid the guaranteed $1M/year from the collective, regardless of whether the collective negotiates $1M worth of NIL deals on his behalf

Just a fancy way to pay the players guaranteed money via NIL.
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That's why collectives run according to the above are illegitimate. They serve no tangible business benefit so are effectively pay-to-play which is banned. All such collectives and their schools should be investigated and punished by the NCAA and the IRS.

You could argue that a collective of businesses local to, or affiliated with, a school could create a legitimate NIL program even if they lose money on the investment. Very few marketing programs can show direct measurable ROI, and outside of digital, virtually none. So a collective of companies could join resources to invest money with no measurable return on their NIL, but if they're profitable or have the prospect of being profitable, it's probably legit.

I don't know how many programs have those types of collectives out there. But I'm pretty sure it's the minority. What group of UF or FSU businesses are going to put together a $10-$25M annual NIL budget, for example? And they can't go collecting alumni donations to subsidize their investments, because then it would revert back to the earlier arrangement and be illegitimate.
 
Empirical Cane said:
View attachment 198835

Collectives consider people good if they are helpful, generous, dependable and attentive to the needs of others in the community.

How do you achieve this coveted good status? So long as I, your Komissar Empirical Canedesinovitch, due to my clearly superior intellect, ability, and devotion to the people and our righteous struggle, deem them worthy enough of this designation.

If I determine you unworthy, you will immediately study your book of My Greatness: A Journey Of Learning The Path of The Empirical One or be sent to Tallahassee for re-education. Also, if I just feel like it, I'll send you just cuz.

GLORY TO THE PEOPLE!

but more importantly,

GLORY TO EMPIRICAL CANEDESINOVITCH!


Oh, you meant NIL Collectives. They are basically setup as charities, receive donations, and then provide cash and in-kind NIL benefit to given athletes.

Very different from LifeWallet where each athlete has an employment agreement for endorsements.
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Comrade Canedesinovitch is buggn..
 
RVACane said:
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I hate to hijack this thread, and that is not the point of this question, but I've studied and have a degree in political science but in Canada.
In America, collective or anything remotely related to communism to community based politics etc. immediately goes to a autocratic approach, regardless if they used "communism as a façade for autocratic or authoritative rule, which are displayed with several head of states you've put in this image, and I would say about 90% of them did not used that façade hahaha Just curious, they were all pieces of **** human beings, just wondering haha
 
cdmd said:
In theory, this is how they're supposed to work...

A group of donors get together and pool their money via a collective. The collective then buys an athlete's NIL rights. The collective pays them a negotiated guaranteed fee. The collective can then go out to the market and resell the athlete's NIL to recoup their investment. The collectives know they won't reasonably recoup their investment, so they operate at a loss.

Let's use Nico and UT as an example:
- UT donor-backed collective signs Nico to a $1M/year NIL deal.
- UT collective now owns Nico's NIL
- UT collective reaches out to local businesses to have Nico as their spokesman.
- Local business pays UT collective to have Nico make an appearance at an event. Let's say they pay $100k for the appearance.
- Nico does the appearance.
- This is the only NIL deal the collective does for the year on behalf of Nico
- Nico gets paid the guaranteed $1M/year from the collective, regardless of whether the collective negotiates $1M worth of NIL deals on his behalf

Just a fancy way to pay the players guaranteed money via NIL.
Click to expand...
This is ultimately is what the blueblood bag schools hate about NIL imo. They used to get away with 20-100k bags for 4 years. Now, that's just for an unofficial visit.
 
It seems like a collective is trying to act like a temporary work agency. A temp work agency has a pool of workers who they farm out for pay at a higher rate than the worker gets... admin fees built in. The difference is collectives pay the workers even if they don't work and that's not what NIL is supposed to be about. They'll probably pivot to some sort of autograph/memorabilia agency where people can purchase autographs or memorabilia at an inflated price. That way lots of people will donate what they can and receive something for their money. It'll be like the Johnny Manziel scandal except legal. The collective would effectively be guaranteeing autograph sales to a player as long as they stay at a school. At tennessee you'd purchase a 52 week package of a weekly autographed playing card, signed jersey, signed helmet, and a signed photograph of Nico while he's still a player for $100k. 10 boosters buy that package and you've got $1 million a year for the kid. A $10k package could just be a signed playing card.
Right now, floriduh is offering these packages but are putting stipulations on the signed picture. billy and the collective want to require kids to wear jorts in the picture and it's really turning off recruits. Even the kids from Lakeland, who are used to jorts, don't want to take the pictures. The collective is adamant about the picture being in jorts and their class is suffering as a result. There was a lawyer who tried to negotiate 'just head shots' instead of the full length pictures and the collective wouldn't do it. He referred to the whole negotiation as a '**** show.' It's true, I saw it in the news.
 
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cdmd said:
In theory, this is how they're supposed to work...

A group of donors get together and pool their money via a collective. The collective then buys an athlete's NIL rights. The collective pays them a negotiated guaranteed fee. The collective can then go out to the market and resell the athlete's NIL to recoup their investment. The collectives know they won't reasonably recoup their investment, so they operate at a loss.

Let's use Nico and UT as an example:
- UT donor-backed collective signs Nico to a $1M/year NIL deal.
- UT collective now owns Nico's NIL
- UT collective reaches out to local businesses to have Nico as their spokesman.
- Local business pays UT collective to have Nico make an appearance at an event. Let's say they pay $100k for the appearance.
- Nico does the appearance.
- This is the only NIL deal the collective does for the year on behalf of Nico
- Nico gets paid the guaranteed $1M/year from the collective, regardless of whether the collective negotiates $1M worth of NIL deals on his behalf

Just a fancy way to pay the players guaranteed money via NIL.
Click to expand...
So in that situation….

Let’s say it is Central Connecticut State, and Paul Levesque decides he wants to get heavily into CFB. He sets up a Blue Devils Collective and signs Arch Manning to a $30M per year guarantee. Yet the only NIL deal that the Collective signs is with a local coffee shop for $100 per year. Arch gets his money as long as Levesque is willing to keep funding the Collective, but basically it’s acting as a channel to funnel money from boosters to players, notwithstanding actual NIL interest in the local or national markets.
 
C2l3w1 said:
This is ultimately is what the blueblood bag schools hate about NIL imo. They used to get away with 20-100k bags for 4 years. Now, that's just for an unofficial visit.
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Yep. Paying $300K max for a player was far more manageable than $1M plus for each.

And they lack the NCAA protection that they formerly had.
 
GojiraCane said:
So in that situation….

Let’s say it is Central Connecticut State, and Paul Levesque decides he wants to get heavily into CFB. He sets up a Blue Devils Collective and signs Arch Manning to a $30M per year guarantee. Yet the only NIL deal that the Collective signs is with a local coffee shop for $100 per year. Arch gets his money as long as Levesque is willing to keep funding the Collective, but basically it’s acting as a channel to funnel money from boosters to players, notwithstanding actual NIL interest in the local or national markets.
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Correct.
 
grover said:
That's why collectives run according to the above are illegitimate. They serve no tangible business benefit so are effectively pay-to-play which is banned
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But does it matter in NCAA football and men's basketball since NIL came to be?

Is anything "illegitimate" or "banned" if nobody — not the NCAA, conferences, the states or the Feds — is enforcing whatever "rules" exist?
 
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