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Elite Roster vs Coaching

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Noliaboi

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Nothing new that hasn’t been said already by some posters but from a coaches mouth/perspective..

“If you don’t recruit, there’s no coach out there that can out-coach recruiting,” Smart said last season. “I don’t care who you are. The best coach to ever play the game better be a good recruiter because no coaching is going to out-coach players. Anybody will tell you that our defense is good because we have good players.”

* Before we get a bunch of “still shouldn’t have lost to MTSU and Duke” I agree *
 
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We are all beating the same drum. Our coaches right now are trying to fit round pegs into square holes and it isn’t working. And frankly it won’t work until they get square pegs. So we will be very frustrated this year losing to teams with ”inferior” talent whose coaches are maximizing their players’ abilities.
And there is a valid argument that Mario and staff should have just kept playing this year with Lashlee’s playbook so we would at least have 1-2 more wins.

But Mario doesn’t roll that way. He will coach his way and he will get elite players who will succeed with his methods. And we will likely suffer through another bad season next year until the transformation is complete. And then we will show dramatic improvement In year 3.
 
Acquisition- Croot the BEST PEOPLE, not just the most talented. (Sign the best, BCR over 60%, fill a gap in portal)
Development- Make them better, keep them healthy. (S&C, position coaches, fundamentals from coord's, practice loads, recovery)
Deployment- Game management, right scheme for the guys you have. (Be innovate, have guts in close games, play to win)
 
“There’s no coach that can out coach recruiting”. I’m not sure that’s correct. We see teams that have recruited well lose to teams thag have recruited worse every week. I’m not just talking about Miami either. There’s a bunch of teams that consistently recruit at a top 25 level and they still manage to lose to inferior teams all the time. Is it easier to win if you have better players? Of course. Does that mean you can be a mediocre coach with a mediocre staff and still win all the time just because you recruit well? Not at all. You still have to play the game.
 
DTP said:
“There’s no coach that can out coach recruiting”. I’m not sure that’s correct. We see teams that have recruited well lose to teams thag have recruited worse every week. I’m not just talking about Miami either. There’s a bunch of teams that consistently recruit at a top 25 level and they still manage to lose to inferior teams all the time. Is it easier to win if you have better players? Of course. Does that mean you can be a mediocre coach with a mediocre staff and still win all the time just because you recruit well? Not at all. You still have to play the game.
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Also, you still have to develop them and cultivate a winning culture.
 
Noliaboi said:
Nothing new that hasn’t been said already by some posters but from a coaches mouth/perspective..

“If you don’t recruit, there’s no coach out there that can out-coach recruiting,” Smart said last season. “I don’t care who you are. The best coach to ever play the game better be a good recruiter because no coaching is going to out-coach players. Anybody will tell you that our defense is good because we have good players.”

* Before we get a bunch of “still shouldn’t have lost to MTSU and Duke” I agree *
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Someone should let app st know that aren't suppose beat or nearly beat all these teams with far better recruiting
 
AtlAtty said:
We are all beating the same drum. Our coaches right now are trying to fit round pegs into square holes and it isn’t working. And frankly it won’t work until they get square pegs. So we will be very frustrated this year losing to teams with ”inferior” talent whose coaches are maximizing their players’ abilities.
And there is a valid argument that Mario and staff should have just kept playing this year with Lashlee’s playbook so we would at least have 1-2 more wins.

But Mario doesn’t roll that way. He will coach his way and he will get elite players who will succeed with his methods. And we will likely suffer through another bad season next year until the transformation is complete. And then we will show dramatic improvement In year 3.
Click to expand...
Agree on everything else, disagree with the timeline. With a good class and solid portal additions this could be a 9-win team next year. If we end up 7-6, getting to 9 would be dramatic improvement in my eyes.
 
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DTP said:
“There’s no coach that can out coach recruiting”. I’m not sure that’s correct. We see teams that have recruited well lose to teams thag have recruited worse every week. I’m not just talking about Miami either. There’s a bunch of teams that consistently recruit at a top 25 level and they still manage to lose to inferior teams all the time. Is it easier to win if you have better players? Of course. Does that mean you can be a mediocre coach with a mediocre staff and still win all the time just because you recruit well? Not at all. You still have to play the game.
Click to expand...
I think Smart is referring to overall team performance over a season, over multiple seasons. UGA almost lost at Missouri. Upsets happen. Thats why they play the game.

But teams that compete for championships have the superior players. Alabama, UGA, Ohio State, and Clemson all have/had better overall rosters than anyone else. Yes, they have excellent coaching but those same staffs are not winning or playing for NCs if they were suddenly coaching Boston College, Arizona, or Rutgers.
 
TemplarCane said:
I think Smart is referring to overall team performance over a season, over multiple seasons. UGA almost lost at Missouri. Upsets happen. Thats why they play the game.

But teams that compete for championships have the superior players. Alabama, UGA, Ohio State, and Clemson all have/had better overall rosters than anyone else. Yes, they have excellent coaching but those same staffs are not winning or playing for NCs if they were suddenly coaching Boston College, Arizona, or Rutgers.
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I 100% agree that the best teams often have the best recruits. That’s a no brainer. It’s just that recruiting at a really high level isn’t enough. Look at Texas. They consistently sign top 10 classes including multiple top 3 classes recently. Yet every year they suck. They can’t possibly have such a ridiculously high bust rate that all these 5 star kids just happen to flop for them. Coaching matters. Whether you want to call it development or just simply knowing how to use them. You still need to know the Xs and Os. Or at least have coordinators who do.

Texas A&M is another example. How many home run recruiting classes is does Jimbo need just to be above average on the field?


Or maybe it’s just that Texas kids suck?
 
Why not both? I don't think it was crazy to expect a game or 2 better with this roster with the amount of money spent on this staff.

We knew the roster was gonna take some time, but I don't think expecting to beat MTSU was a big ask
 
DTP said:
I 100% agree that the best teams often have the best recruits. That’s a no brainer. It’s just that recruiting at a really high level isn’t enough. Look at Texas. They consistently sign top 10 classes including multiple top 3 classes recently. Yet every year they suck. They can’t possibly have such a ridiculously high bust rate that all these 5 star kids just happen to flop for them. Coaching matters. Whether you want to call it development or just simply knowing how to use them. You still need to know the Xs and Os. Or at least have coordinators who do.

Texas A&M is another example. How many home run recruiting classes is does Jimbo need just to be above average on the field?

Or maybe it’s just that Texas kids suck?
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Yes, agree, players still have to be coached up. Bad coaching can absolutely ruin a team’s potential. But the statement was can coaching offset not having the best players? The big picture answer is no.

Combine great recruiting with excellent coaching and you have the same 5-6 teams annually competing for CFP spots.

Side Note: In today’s CFB you must have great-to-elite QB play to win or compete for NCs. Plus a supporting cast. Lack of a top QB has been Harbaugh’s problem at Michigan and Jimbo’s issue at TAMU. Harbaugh had Luck at Stanford, won a lot. Fisher had Winston at FSU, won a NC.
 
There's a group in here that gathers and has a circle jerk to an image of Butch Davis. Butch was not a great game day coach. You cannot point to a game where Butch outreached anyone. He recruited elite level talent and then developed that talent very well. He never beat FSU or Va. Tech until he had better talent.
 
And yet mtsu and duke both did it to us. I think South Carolina upset Georgia a couple years ago who had much worse talent. And smart is neglecting the fact that he is an elite defensive coach, so him getting out coached is NOt likely to happen very often
 
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You simply need both (good players and good coaches)

Good teams simply have good coaches who coach up good players.

It’s not a hard formula. The hard part is getting both pieces in that formula.
 
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