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Does Playing a Freshman QB Significantly Speed Development?

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arcane

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There has been a lot of good discussion about whether UM should start Jake Heaps or Brad Kaaya in the first game against Louisville. I really don't care, but some interesting points have been raised. A cornerstone of the "start Kaaya" argument is that playng as a freshman will accelerate his development. This contention seemed perfectly reasonable to me until I began thinking about some of the "great" freshman quarterbacks who starred as redshirt freshmen.

The first three I thought of were Jameis Winston, Bernie Kosar, and Johnny Football. Maybe not a representative sample - responders are invited to cite some more examples. When I wonder how much better each of these would have been as a sophomore had he played as a true freshman, I am not convinced that it would have made all that much difference. They each seemed completely masterly. Would playing earlier have made some difference? Probably. A huge amount of difference? Frankly, that would be tough to imagine given how good they were already.

To a degree, I am arguing against what I would have supposed would be true. I would have thought that playing as a freshman would have helped them a huge amount. But when I think about the times I saw them play, I am not so sure. What do you all think?

I would particularly like to hear from people who don't really have a horse in the "start Heaps" vs. "start Kaaya" race. As I say, I don't really care who starts that at QB - I just want to win the game. But I am also going beyond that preference to see what you all think about the question I have posed here.
 
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i think if you have a creative system that lets the kid get comfortable, then you have the opportunity to build the kid as you go... Can't just throw the kid in traditional sets and expect him to read every defense's zone/blitz packages against those sets.

The easiest way to play a freshman early, is in a spread offense. It helps the offensive line, as its easier for the QB to see the field and dump the ball quickly, from gun or the pistol formation. in singleback formation, its a simple numbers game. the minute some one blitzes you go with your hot read in one on one coverage.
 
Thanks, bigsonnyu.

To stick to my examples, do you think that your scenario applies specifically to Jameis Winston, Bernie Kosar, or Johnny Football. If not them, could you point to a specific elite quarterback that lacked that experience, but could have largely benefited from it?
 
I believe the biggest issue is not the physical side of things but the mental component

Are kids fresh out of high school able to deal with being beaten up or having a 4 INT game, then coming out in the last drive or the following week and still have the guts to want the ball in the clutch.

Some guys (both freshman and seniors and even pros) are just not mentally able to put those bad games and bad moments behind them, because they are going to happen...Even many pro qbs struggle to develop the "short term memory loss" required to play the position. They get rattled, stay rattled and lose confidence. I think that is the worry with any qb.
All guys are different so maybe Kaaya can handle it, maybe he cant. Same with Heaps. If they cant handle it, this can potentially affect their long term development
 
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I think experience helps, but how much is anyone's guess. Obviously good coaching and complimentary players that help him along, skill level, and mental accuity as well as fortitude. EveryQB is different and there's no certain answer, too many variables. Some young men pressure can destroy while others will grow.
 
INCaneFan said:
I think experience helps, but how much is anyone's guess. Obviously good coaching and complimentary players that help him along, skill level, and mental accuity as well as fortitude. EveryQB is different and there's no certain answer, too many variables. Some young men pressure can destroy while others will grow.
Click to expand...

That's the key, right there
 
These QB's coming out of high school are better than they were 10 years ago. All these camps like the elite 11 and the opening prepares them to be college ready.

Even in the NFL, where back in the day, QB's sat a year or two. Now if you're drafted in the 1st or 2nd round, you're expected to start.
 
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Jacory and Stephen both had trouble reading defensive schemes out of the Pro Set. The more guys in the box the more schemes a DC can throw at a young QB.

This is why spreading the field has its benefits.
 
Just my two cents, if a kid is a baller hes a baller and can contribute at a high volume then theres kids who need some coaching up and prepping up. If your kid is the later he shouldnt be in the running to win the starting job much like kevin olsen and countless others.
 
matt hinton wrote an entire post about this last year http://www.footballstudyhall.com/2013/8/17/4630390/so-youre-starting-a-true-freshman-quarterback

the conclusion of this is that you're more or less able to tell what you're getting from the kid right away. per this study, the idea that experience "helps" a freshman become better over time is false: if a true freshman quarterback turns out to be GREAT -- i.e. rg3, braxton miller, terrelle pryor, teddy bridgewater, probably christian hackenburg -- he will be great immediately. true freshmen quarterbacks who are mediocre or slightly above average -- this includes stephen and jacory -- tend to be that way for their careers. this argument basically says that "development" for true freshmen starters doesn't really exist.

but lumping winston and manziel into this conversation doesn't hold for me because they redshirted a year.
 
As a couple guys said, my main concern is throwing a freshman QB in the fire (especially at a sold out Louisville where the atmosphere will be intimidating in the eyes of an 18 year old freshman playing the most important position on the field). If he can't handle the atmosphere and the pressure, and has a bad game, it could end up being a pretty big setback mentally.

Every QB is certainly different, so there is no way to tell how Brad may or may not handle it until he is put in the situation, but it would be a serious problem if we set back his development by throwing him in the fire too early. You see teams in the NFL go both ways on this (Jags with Bortles, Vikings with Bridgewater, Panthers with Newton, etc.; they go both ways). I think in college its a bit more rare to see a true freshman thrown in the fire from the first game of his freshman year.

I do think Brad is the real deal, I just don't know if he will be ready to handle this spotlight and pressure right from the get go. If there is a good chance he can't and it could negatively impact him, I would rather let him develop and unleash his fury his redshirt freshman year. Unfortunately with Olsen looking like he is useless up to this point we likely won't have the luxury of just letting Brad develop and redshirt him as we probably should.

Just my opinion, not sure what the right way to look at this is but at the end of the day I will support and trust our coaches decision on this. If they think he' ready to go, they will put him out there. If they think he needs more time to develop mentally and physically they will start Heaps. I think its as simple as that for this QB battle. Kaaya has shown the coaches he has the ability to go out there and win us some football games, its just a matter of whether they think there is a chance that this hinders his ability to be great in the long run.
 
I do not think Brad will redshirt.

I do however think there are a lot of cases where freshman play as a QB and never seem to get much better as they go, Matt Barkley, for example. Played a lot but never seemed to get any better. I am sure there have been a lot of situations where a freshman was played and it hurt their development more than it helped.

I am worried about using Brad up in Louisville, you think those fans will know he is a true freshman? You think they will heckle the crap out of him? I do not care how many all star games you played, or how big your state championship crowd was, nothing can prepare you for this big of a stage and I think he will look out that tunnel and say "holy ****, those people are crazy out there!" I love his charisma, I love his story but I am more worried about breaking his confidence/development going forward than I am about him getting 'experience' at Louisville. I would be for the idea of getting him a couple of series in the second quarter of that game if they go with Heaps. Especially if Heaps is struggling...

But I am with the Tomcat on this one, if they feel like Brad gives us the best chance to win I am all for it!
 
Kosar was the single worst physical specimen to ever hold the QB position. He had bricks for feet and lead weights on his legs and a mediocre arm. I can't recall one time dude scrambled for positive yardage. Yet, he beat out the most naturally physically gifted QB the U ever produced in Testeverde, won a national title then became a tremendous success at Cleveland in the NFL ( beloved by Cleveland fans).

It's all about intelligence, throwing accuracy, leadership and the fire to win. Everything else is gravy.

Physically, Kaaya is Jim Thorpe by comparison. However, Bernie (not to mention Johnny Foosball and Winston) obviously benefitted by red shirting and I think Kaaya would benefit as well.
 
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Not all experience comes from being the starter. Backups can develop nicely without the pressure of starting, while still being exposed to "real" action. I can't see redshirting a QB unless you think he's not going to play at all - even in a limited backup role. The other mostly ignored factor in starting a true freshman QB is the prospects for the team in general. How well have teams done when starting a true freshman QB?

Art Briles went to RGIII after 3 series of Kirby Freeman partly because Baylor wasn't going to have much success either way. Whatever it cost Baylor through mistakes by a true freshman wouldn't matter on the bottom line, as nothing was really at risk.

I don't see that as the case here. We have a lot of talent. I know that exposes the flip side of the argument. Maybe an offense that looks to be very talented can afford a true freshman's growing pains. I'm good with whatever Golden and Coley decide.
 
To stay on point, I don't think experience as a true freshmans will make a difference as to how Kaaya plays next year. Didn't help Bobby Drama Marve. Didn't help Jacory.

Dorsey had a lot of experience as a freshmans and still looked shaky and rattled the first game of his sophomore season against Warshington on the road in a hostile environment. That game as a sophomore might have helped him later in that season, but his freshmans experience didn't seem to help him in that game.

At the end of the day, it's impossible to quantify, but I don't think experience or no experience as a freshmans will make much difference with Kaaya unless the experience is really, and it breaks him. But if bad experience as a freshmans breaks him, then he'd probably break at some point down the road anyway.
 
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