forums

Off-Topic Does God actually exist?

JD08 said:
So a bunch of people reading an adult version of the Boy Scout Promise is the ushering in of Christofascism?

And people wonder why the Chinese are eating our lunch.
Click to expand...
There is a nut in another thread that thinks the Chinese gov is getting fentanyl into US vis Mexico. Chinese are eating our lunch! :(
 
Advertisement
Funny thing is I got to church on a semi-frequent basis, was a church youth speaker, but I never understood why people spoke so dedicatedly to being a believer and not being more questioning about the Bible and the many things that can easily be proven wrong. I guess you can say I'm not a believer. in fact I hate being in the company of a bunch of holy people.
 
Billy D Williams said:
Funny thing is I got to church on a semi-frequent basis, was a church youth speaker, but I never understood why people spoke so dedicatedly to being a believer and not being more questioning about the Bible and the many things that can easily be proven wrong. I guess you can say I'm not a believer. in fact I hate being in the company of a bunch of holy people.
Click to expand...
I wonder why so many people feel the same way as you do?

The holy rollers can be some of the most hypocritical self righteous people on earth to boot.
 
Advertisement
imurcane said:
hear the prayers of the wicked. In Jeremiah 14:11–12, for example, we read: “The Lord said to me: ‘Do not pray for the welfare of this people. Though they fast, I will not hear their cry, and though they offer burnt offering and grain offering, I will not accept them.’ ” Proverbs 28:9tells us that the prayer of a lawless man “is an abomination.” Over and over we read that God does not listen to the prayers of the wicked (e.g., Ps. 66:18; Prov. 21:13; Isa. 1:15; Jer. 11:11–14). What does this mean? Is God not omniscient? Does He not know all things? Of course He does. Scripture tells us that God knows all things and that no creature is hidden from His sight (Heb. 4:13). God knows every thought in our minds (1 Chron. 28:9), and He knows the words we are going to say even before we speak them (Ps. 139:4).
How, then, can the Bible also say that He does not hear the prayers of the wicked? In order to understand what Scripture is saying, let us first consider Isaiah 59:1–2. Here, the prophet writes: “Behold, the Lord’s hand is not shortened, that it cannot save, or his ear dull, that it cannot hear; but your iniquities have made a separation between you and your God, and your sins have hidden his face from you so that he does not hear” (emphasis added). The prophet affirms that God can hear. In other words, God is omniscient. He can hear the prayers of the wicked in the sense that He knows that they are praying, and He knows what they are praying. God is omniscient.

However, Isaiah then immediately turns to note that the problem is not God’s omniscience. The problem is the wickedness of the ones praying. Because of their wickedness, “he does not hear.” What this means is that God is not going to listen to those who flout His law. As Zechariah makes clear, “As I called, and they would not hear, so they called, and I would not hear” (7:13). If unbelievers persist in wickedness, God will not grant their requests. They pray in vain.
There is one prayer that a wicked person can pray, however, that will be heard by God. It is the prayer of repentance. We see an example of this in 1 Kings 21:17–29. Here God condemns the wicked king Ahab (vv. 17–24). Upon hearing the words of judgment, Ahab repents in sackcloth (v. 27). The Lord sees his repentance and declares that the judgment will fall on Ahab’s descendants rather than on Ahab himself (vv. 28–29). Consider also the repentance of the Ninevites described in the book of Jonah. When the king of Nineveh heard the words of the prophet, he and the people repented, and God relented (Jonah 3:1–10). God knows and hears all things, but the only prayer of the wicked to which He will listen is a prayer of genuine repentance.
Dr. Keith A. Mathison is professor of systematic theology at Reformation Bible College in Sanford, Fla. He is author of several books, including The Lord’s Supper and From Age to Age.
Click to expand...

How does any of you wrote above relate to a Calvinist perspective? It seems what you describe above still requires a response from the individual in order to restore a fractured relationship where God is essentially ex-communicated by your own doing. Acknowledging that it is your own doing that leads to the fracture and not God is what leads to repentance.

So yes, God is omniscient but knowing how you will respond doesn't cause you to respond in that way. If I had perfect knowledge of a future game where I was aware of all the circumstances in play and could 100% predict the outcome my prediction doesn't determine the outcome. That will still be determined by the circumstances and decisions/actions of each individual player.
 
CaneinBroward said:
Is theocracy on the way?

Click to expand...


How is a theocracy constitutional? You can't honor what's in the constitution as they are saying and also be advocating a theocracy which essentially means a state sanctioned religion. The establishment clause doesn't do away with religion it just does away with a state sponsored religion. I think some folks misunderstand what separation of church and state actually means.
 
NDE said:
I had a Near Death Experience, just like the tens of thousands of fully documented NDE cases and thousands of NDE Experiencers who have posted there NDE Experience on Youtube. The NDE Experience is VERY real and approximately one third of NDE Experiencers have an encounter with "GOD", who appears in many forms to make the NDE experiencer comfortable. The majority of the time GOD appears as pure energy. However, for a Christian it can appear as Jesus, for a Buddhist as Buddha, for a Muslem as Mohammed. There was a case of a ****** lady who had 2 rabbis that appeared to her. All communication is telepathic. Approximately out of of four has a Life Review, where GOD shows you the good and bad you did in your live. GOD does not judge you, you judge yourself. I highly recommend that you read the book by one of the major NDE researchers in the world, Dr. Jeffrey Long. He has been collecting NDE surveys for more than 20 years and has over 10,000 cases. His lates book is titled "GOD and the Afterlife". This is his website: https://www.nderf.org/

So my answer to your initial question is: Yes, but not a religious GOD-- GOD is much more complicated and much more benevolent than the biblical version, which is just one of thousands of religions known to humanity-- where most religions claim that only "their own religion" is correct and all the others will burn in hill. These are man-made stories. If you want to learn about GOD, ask the people that died and came back to life.
Click to expand...

Not denying the actual experiences of people who have had NDEs but it seems a very narrow view of how one can really get to know God.

For one, like you say, not everyone has the experience. The majority don't as you cite. Two, they experience God in different ways seemingly related to their cultural conditioning. Three, it seems to limit God's own manner which he may choose to reveal himself to someone. Why only get to know God by asking an NDE experiencer?

So while you say there are many man made stories that make up religious beliefs, it seems an NDE is in the same boat since the experiencer has to also recount his/her experience in the same manner as others do by telling their stories. And the experiences, just like the many religions, are not exactly uniform.

Seems to me we are no further along than where we started.

All that being said I still think there is an objective truth somewhere to be found that transcends our own limits of understanding and experience. Just like the old Indian parable of the blind men describing what an elephant looks like we each are grasping at just part of it and confusing it as being the whole.

We need the elephant's (if it could speak) own testimony to set us in the right direction towards understanding what it really is.
 
Salt said:
How does any of you wrote above relate to a Calvinist perspective? It seems what you describe above still requires a response from the individual in order to restore a fractured relationship where God is essentially ex-communicated by your own doing. Acknowledging that it is your own doing that leads to the fracture and not God is what leads to repentance.

So yes, God is omniscient but knowing how you will respond doesn't cause you to respond in that way. If I had perfect knowledge of a future game where I was aware of all the circumstances in play and could 100% predict the outcome my prediction doesn't determine the outcome. That will still be determined by the circumstances and decisions/actions of each individual player.
Click to expand...

lol
ok
 
Advertisement
Salt said:
That's too bad. I assume that if you believe in something you have actually put some thought behind it.
Click to expand...
I realize we have differing perspectives and experiences. Nothing the Bible or I say will matter to you; believe what you want. It’s America baby!
 
imurcane said:
I realize we have differing perspectives and experiences. Nothing the Bible or I say will matter to you; believe what you want. It’s America baby!
Click to expand...

So you don’t care if what any one of us believes is in error and the consequences might be grave? I suppose you would if I thought flying planes into buildings on a jihad so I can spend eternal life with 72 virgins was my ticket to bliss.

I would at least expect some push back and not “believe what you want. It’s America baby!”
 
Salt said:
So you don’t care if what any one of us believes is in error and the consequences might be grave? I suppose you would if I thought flying planes into buildings on a jihad so I can spend eternal life with 72 virgins was my ticket to bliss.

I would at least expect some push back and not “believe what you want. It’s America baby!”
Click to expand...


Why?
 
Advertisement
Billy D Williams said:
Funny thing is I got to church on a semi-frequent basis, was a church youth speaker, but I never understood why people spoke so dedicatedly to being a believer and not being more questioning about the Bible and the many things that can easily be proven wrong. I guess you can say I'm not a believer. in fact I hate being in the company of a bunch of holy people.
Click to expand...
@Suhrthing you must be one of those religious right, just another code to identify themselves as being racists. That crap ya'll spout is the same as Middle East fanatics just a different religion targeting different groups. Ya'll would do the same things to us as they do to opposition in Saudi Arabia.
 
Advertisement
Billy D Williams said:
@Suhrthing you must be one of those religious right, just another code to identify themselves as being racists. That crap ya'll spout is the same as Middle East fanatics just a different religion targeting different groups. Ya'll would do the same things to us as they do to opposition in Saudi Arabia.
Click to expand...
I'm agnostic. But carry on with your typically ignorant presumptions... the mental midget you are.
 
Billy D Williams said:
@Suhrthing you must be one of those religious right, just another code to identify themselves as being racists. That crap ya'll spout is the same as Middle East fanatics just a different religion targeting different groups. Ya'll would do the same things to us as they do to opposition in Saudi Arabia.t
Click to expand...
Shouldn't you be at a rally out in a pasture on the edge of town?
 
Advertisement
Back
Top