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Can the secondary be better than last year?

sstcane

sstcane

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I know that we lost Kam, James Williams and Jaden Davis, but I feel that we are going to have a better season in the secondary.

Up front the D-Line has great depth and talent. Bain year 2, Mesidor back and apparently looking great. Baron and Alston are upgrades at end. Basically I feel this unit will harass QB's and speed up the clock on opposing QB's.

We lose Kam's play making, but I feel that Powell's smarts and Harris's speed and athleticism are a good mix. I also expect Zaquan to play a role.

Porter was very good last year and I feel that Damari, Richard, Stafford, Hill and the young guys will be able to step up.

The biggest thing is Chevis Jackson meshing with Guidry better than Addae did last year. That Marshall D they had a couple years ago was very good. Gave up 51% completions 200 yds a game and 12TD to 18INT. They were also #1 in the nation in 3rd down percentage at 23.53%. Those are elite numbers.
 
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Really the only person that us losing is a negative from last season is Kam. We add Hill and Powell. Guys like Jaden Harris, Damari Brown, and Robert Stafford are a year more developed. We have a top talent in Zaquon Patterson…

Our DLine is going to be healthy and far better and have more depth than last season. Our LBs will be more at least on par or better AND more athletic than last season. Both of those position groups being better/far better than last season will make a significant impact on making this seasons results better from the secondary.
 
Davis to hill is an upgrade to me. Dp2 was one of our best players imo. Chevis is a better cb coach than addae imo, plus a better fit with Guidry. Couch was ok, can damari be ok at nickel? I think so even tho its too early to judge him

Dline should help alot but if the secondary is weak it will eventually hurt us. Our offense should be prolific and force teams to be aggressive and hopefully lead to more mistakes
 
I think 4/5 spots in the secondary are upgraded over last year. I also don't think you see as many busts from Jaden Harris like we did with Kam. Less playmaking but it should balance out. I might look more steady sort of like the Jaquan Johnson/Redwine combo.

Depth is also slightly better if Patterson can contribute.
 
It’s the tackling that has me worried. Straight pass defense? We probably can. Maybe.

But forget about James’ first 2 years. Last year, he was an eraser. When he hit people, they were on the ground. He wasn’t the best safety we’ve ever had, obviously, but there weren’t many flat out missed tackles that led to huge gains. Same with Kam. He filled holes (no pause cause they could be female holes), he was in the right place in the run game, he hit people and they dropped.

Jaden Davis turned that A&M game on its head when a big stick and forced fumble.

Can Markieth Williams do this for us this year? Can Jaden Harris? Powell? Is Patterson gonna be in the right places? Is he gonna have some acclimation period where he’s a half step slow and misses someone?

Say what you want about Kam, James, and Jaden, but the NFL called all those kids in April. They don’t just pick random names out of a hat.

So when you say can the secondary be better….i would say that overall, it’s probably not a great bet. But there are going to be multiple plays this year where one of the kids I mentioned above is going to be the only guy between an opposing player and a massive gain. Are they gonna be able to get that dude on the ground? That’s probably my biggest concern on the entire football team, honestly.
 
1. It ******* well better be or some changes need to be made

2. The reported improvement in the D line by itself will help the secondary out to some degree before we even factor in secondary improvement. If both parts happen we could be cooking with gas here.
 
OrangeBowlMagic said:
It’s the tackling that has me worried. Straight pass defense? We probably can. Maybe.

But forget about James’ first 2 years. Last year, he was an eraser. When he hit people, they were on the ground. He wasn’t the best safety we’ve ever had, obviously, but there weren’t many flat out missed tackles that led to huge gains. Same with Kam. He filled holes (no pause cause they could be female holes), he was in the right place in the run game, he hit people and they dropped.

Jaden Davis turned that A&M game on its head when a big stick and forced fumble.

Can Markieth Williams do this for us this year? Can Jaden Harris? Powell? Is Patterson gonna be in the right places? Is he gonna have some acclimation period where he’s a half step slow and misses someone?

Say what you want about Kam, James, and Jaden, but the NFL called all those kids in April. They don’t just pick random names out of a hat.

So when you say can the secondary be better….i would say that overall, it’s probably not a great bet. But there are going to be multiple plays this year where one of the kids I mentioned above is going to be the only guy between an opposing player and a massive gain. Are they gonna be able to get that dude on the ground? That’s probably my biggest concern on the entire football team, honestly.
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Kam was definitely one of the best tacklers on the team the last few years (NCST game for example)

Go back and watch that Davis forced fumble and it all happens because Kam flat out stood up their RT

I was skeptical of why he was named AA status but it doesn’t change the fact that he’s a tough person to replace back there despite his mistakes

Good points
 
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JHallCanes said:
Kam was definitely one of the best tacklers on the team the last few years (NCST game for example)

Go back and watch that Davis forced fumble and it all happens because Kam flat out stood up their RT

I was skeptical of why he was named AA status but it doesn’t change the fact that he’s a tough person to replace back there despite his mistakes

Good points
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IMO he was named an All-American because, in 2022, he was one of the best overall safeties in the country. His play diagnosis, instincts, and overall pass defense took a step back last season (and this has been discussed in about 50 threads over the past 8 months, so let's not derail this into a Kam Kinchens thread), but his tackling did not. He was still excellent in run fits, and actually averaged more tackles per game last year than he did in 2022.

He was AWESOME in 2022. He was merely good in 2023. But dude could tackle. And so could James. Until someone proves to me they're at that level, I'm going to have my breath held anytime someone gets loose in the secondary, and truthfully it's probably gonna happen on the first drive of the first game, because Trey Wilson is going to have 10 catches against us, and they're almost all going to be within 5 yards of the LOS, so we have GOT to get that dude on the ground as soon as he gets the ball.
 
OrangeBowlMagic said:
IMO he was named an All-American because, in 2022, he was one of the best overall safeties in the country. His play diagnosis, instincts, and overall pass defense took a step back last season (and this has been discussed in about 50 threads over the past 8 months, so let's not derail this into a Kam Kinchens thread), but his tackling did not. He was still excellent in run fits, and actually averaged more tackles per game last year than he did in 2022.

He was AWESOME in 2022. He was merely good in 2023. But dude could tackle. And so could James. Until someone proves to me they're at that level, I'm going to have my breath held anytime someone gets loose in the secondary, and truthfully it's probably gonna happen on the first drive of the first game, because Trey Wilson is going to have 10 catches against us, and they're almost all going to be within 5 yards of the LOS, so we have GOT to get that dude on the ground as soon as he gets the ball.
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Yeah I didn’t say the AA thing as a way to debate it, simply put it out there because I think part of the boards issue with him was making him something than he is (we do that sometimes)

And qualifying the compliments I was gonna give him with the perspective I had going into the season wasn’t quite the same as everyone elses

He was arguably the best player on our defense as a freshman and never really deviated

That play against A&M was one I had a screenshot for a long time because his physicality MADE that play happen. I don’t see Jaden Harris or a Markeith Williams doing that….yet…and not to criticize them just perspective that all of 2023 wasn’t Kam blowing coverages
 
OrangeBowlMagic said:
IMO he was named an All-American because, in 2022, he was one of the best overall safeties in the country. His play diagnosis, instincts, and overall pass defense took a step back last season (and this has been discussed in about 50 threads over the past 8 months, so let's not derail this into a Kam Kinchens thread), but his tackling did not. He was still excellent in run fits, and actually averaged more tackles per game last year than he did in 2022.

He was AWESOME in 2022. He was merely good in 2023. But dude could tackle. And so could James. Until someone proves to me they're at that level, I'm going to have my breath held anytime someone gets loose in the secondary, and truthfully it's probably gonna happen on the first drive of the first game, because Trey Wilson is going to have 10 catches against us, and they're almost all going to be within 5 yards of the LOS, so we have GOT to get that dude on the ground as soon as he gets the ball.
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2023 Daryl Porter: Porter was Miami’s most consistent performer at cornerback. He had an 80.2 coverage grade, allowing just 46 percent of passes against him to be caught. Porter had the seventh-best defensive grade and coverage grade of ACC corners with at least 250 snaps last year. His completion percentage against was tied for eighth-best in the conference.. Porter finished the season with 23 tackles and four pass break-ups. According to PFF, Porter missed only one tackle on the year and he allowed only 11 receptions for 108 yards on 22 targets.

2023 Meesh Powell: Powell had a 69 defensive grade with a 73.9 grade in coverage last season. He played 477 snaps at slot cornerback, 34 as outside cornerback, 122 as a deep safety and 165 in the box. Powell racked up 38 tackles, 2.5 tackles for loss and three interceptions last year, scoring one touchdown. Powell rushed the quarterback 29 times last season and had nine pressures. Missed tackles were a slight issue with 14 on the season. he had 14 of them. In three seasons at Washington, he had 92 tackles with four tackles for loss.

2023 Dyoni Hill: Hill had 55 tackles and one interception last year, earning a 74.1 defensive grade and a 70.9 coverage grade.

2023 Damari Brown: Brown played 331 snaps and started 4 games. He had 14 tackles and 1.5 tackles for loss. PFF gave him a 63 defensive grade and a 65.3 coverage grade. His grades were middle of the pack among freshman cornerbacks who played 100 or more snaps last year.


2023 James Williams: Williams played the most defensive snaps for the Hurricanes in 2023 and also finished the year as the leading tackler with 73 tackles while also generating one interception and two forced fumbles. Williams was tied for the team lead with five pass break-ups as well. According to PFF, Williams missed 14 tackles this season. In coverage, Williams allowed 18 receptions for 219 yards and two touchdowns on 31 targets. Williams earned an 84.7 coverage grade, which was the best on the team.

2023 Jaden Davis: Davis had 42 tackles, three tackles for loss and four pass breakups. Pro Football Focus gave him a 76.3 defensive grade with a 73.2 coverage grade. He also had an 80.7 run-defense grade, which was the second-best grade on the team and fourth-best among ACC cornerbacks with at least 200 run-defense snaps. Davis primarily played as an outside cornerback and PFF credited him with allowing 24 receptions on 40 targets for 349 yards and one touchdown in regular season. Davis was credited with missing only six tackles on the year.
 
I thought Davis played pretty well for us despite being put in a position on the outside I didn’t think was his best fit, but I’ll never get the image out of my head of him completely mistiming his jump against UNC to give up a 60 yard touchdown the second I got back to my seat after halftime.
 
Can you guys explain something to me...

Why was Jaden Davis drafted in the 7th round if he played as good as you all seem to think he did? Wouldn't a player that played that well get drafted higher?

It can't be measurables, because Mike Sainristil got drafted in the 2nd round & he's smaller than JD? How did Jarvis Brownlee get drafted ahead of JD if they basically have the same profile?

CB was the most selected position in the 24 draft. There were 36 Corners drafted, he was the 32nd CB taken late in the 7th round. Do yall get what that means?

What am I missing?
 
JayCane20 said:
I think 4/5 spots in the secondary are upgraded over last year. I also don't think you see as many busts from Jaden Harris like we did with Kam. Less playmaking but it should balance out. I might look more steady sort of like the Jaquan Johnson/Redwine combo.

Depth is also slightly better if Patterson can contribute.
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If we get that, I’d consider it an upgrade.
 
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Memnon said:
Can you guys explain something to me...

Why was Jaden Davis drafted in the 7th round if he played as good as you all seem to think he did? Wouldn't a player that played that well get drafted higher?

It can't be measurables, because Mike Sainristil got drafted in the 2nd round & he's smaller than JD? How did Jarvis Brownlee get drafted ahead of JD if they basically have the same profile?

CB was the most selected position in the 24 draft. There were 36 Corners drafted, he was the 32nd CB taken late in the 7th round. Do yall get what that means?

What am I missing?
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Run support is my concern. I think we’ll be fine in coverage this year. And I’m considering basically all tackling in “run support”. Can our DBs get backs on the ground against the run and WRs/TEs on the ground in the short/intermediate passing game?
 
JayCane20 said:
I think 4/5 spots in the secondary are upgraded over last year. I also don't think you see as many busts from Jaden Harris like we did with Kam. Less playmaking but it should balance out. I might look more steady sort of like the Jaquan Johnson/Redwine combo.

Depth is also slightly better if Patterson can contribute.
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Patterson will begin contributing by mid to late October.
 
TwentySix said:
I thought Davis played pretty well for us despite being put in a position on the outside I didn’t think was his best fit, but I’ll never get the image out of my head of him completely mistiming his jump against UNC to give up a 60 yard touchdown the second I got back to my seat after halftime.
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First half of the season I thought he was going to be an All ACC CB lol fell off quickly though.
 
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