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Blue Chip Ratio - Death

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Dwinstitles said:
Clemson always recruited well agree to disagree
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If you're into rankings, since Dabo was made full time head coach their rankings were (per 247):


Clemson Miami
2009 - national - 36, ACC - 6, avg. - 0.8981 (Taj Boyd's class)national - 16, ACC - 3, avg. - 0.8948
2010 - national - 27, ACC - 4, avg. - 0.8594 national - 33, ACC - 6, avg. - 0.8442
2011 - national - 20, ACC - 2, avg. - 0.8717 (Sammy Watkins class) national - 10, ACC - 2, avg. - 0.8789 (Golden's first year)
2012 - national - 20, ACC - 3, avg. - 0.8903 national - 14, ACC - 2, avg. - 0.8748
2013 - national - 15, ACC - 3, avg. - 0.8836national - 14, ACC - 2, avg. - 0.8840
2014 - national - 16, ACC - 3, avg. - 0.8819 (Deshaun Watsons class) national - 12, ACC - 2, avg. - 0.8807
2015 - national - 9, ACC - 2, avg. - 0.8912 national - 27, ACC - 3, avg. - 0.8636
2016 - national - 11, ACC - 2, avg. - 0.9030 national - 22, ACC - 3, avg. - 0.8863 (Richt's first year)
2017 - national - 13, ACC - 2, avg. - 0.9210 national - 12, ACC - 2, avg. - 0.8868
2018 - national - 7, ACC - 1, avg. - 0.9345national - 8, ACC - 2, avg. - 0.9099
2019 - national - 10, ACC - 1, avg. - 0.8976 national - 27, ACC - 4, avg. - 0.8807

Just looking at the results, his first class wasn't that good but he's gradually improved without the big swings we had. But it's been since 2015 that he's really upped it
 
PanamaCityCanes said:
He has 139 yards receiving in four games. He's not in the top 200 in the NCAA in any receiving category. But since he caught a touchdown pass on TV, he must be "balling out".
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If you consider "Big Time Players make Big Time Plays in Big Time Games" yes, he is 'Ballin out.
 
craval85 said:
So you're saying since 1892..they won all of their national championships with 5 coaches-is that correct? How does that not underscore the pt that coaching is more important than talent.
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Because they haven't been the most talented team every year for 100 years.
 
NorthEastCane said:
If you're into rankings, since Dabo was made full time head coach their rankings were (per 247):


Clemson Miami
2009 - national - 36, ACC - 6, avg. - 0.8981 (Taj Boyd's class)national - 16, ACC - 3, avg. - 0.8948
2010 - national - 27, ACC - 4, avg. - 0.8594 national - 33, ACC - 6, avg. - 0.8442
2011 - national - 20, ACC - 2, avg. - 0.8717 (Sammy Watkins class) national - 10, ACC - 2, avg. - 0.8789 (Golden's first year)
2012 - national - 20, ACC - 3, avg. - 0.8903 national - 14, ACC - 2, avg. - 0.8748
2013 - national - 15, ACC - 3, avg. - 0.8836national - 14, ACC - 2, avg. - 0.8840
2014 - national - 16, ACC - 3, avg. - 0.8819 (Deshaun Watsons class) national - 12, ACC - 2, avg. - 0.8807
2015 - national - 9, ACC - 2, avg. - 0.8912 national - 27, ACC - 3, avg. - 0.8636
2016 - national - 11, ACC - 2, avg. - 0.9030 national - 22, ACC - 3, avg. - 0.8863 (Richt's first year)
2017 - national - 13, ACC - 2, avg. - 0.9210 national - 12, ACC - 2, avg. - 0.8868
2018 - national - 7, ACC - 1, avg. - 0.9345national - 8, ACC - 2, avg. - 0.9099
2019 - national - 10, ACC - 1, avg. - 0.8976 national - 27, ACC - 4, avg. - 0.8807
Just looking at the results, his first class wasn't that good but he's gradually improved without the big swings we had. But it's been since 2015 that he's really upped it
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They had the 4th or 5th most talent in the country last year. Class ranking doesn't account for small classes.

Class rankings don't matter as much as total talent on the team.
 
Cookie917 said:
Cager balling out???? You watched the one ND game and made that conclusion right???

Let me ask you this, do you think Mike Harley for us is "balling out" this year? Because spoiler alert, he has more catches and yards than Cager this year....Same with Osborn, Brevin, and JT4 is only 6 yards behind him.... **** Mark Pope is only 40 yards behind him, Cager would be 4th currently here.

And don't try the competition schtick either... UGA has played Vandy, Murray State, Ark State, and ND. Not exactly a gauntlet for them either.

Was the point of your post that some 4 and 5* are busts? of course they are, and they get the attention of being busts because they weren't supposed to be, just like a (sarcasm) 2* Ed Reed gets thrown around because he wasn't supposed to be good according to the recruiting sites.

To your second point, of course coaching matters, sure you can win a NC with a half asleep coker at the wheel if your team is the '01 Canes but you rather someone who can maximize your teams strengths and minimize weaknesses, and yes that does mean not asking a havoc of player (chik) eat 19 meals a day to be a space eater, or asking a player (Arthur Brown) to learn some stupid read and react defense when he should just be attacking.
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If you consider “Big Time Players make Big Time Plays in Big Time Games” yes he is ‘Ballin out.

This was National TV, all the bright lights, game in doubt, he makes three plays in a row for his QB.

If any of our WR’s made a play to Win a Ball Game, I would call them Big Time Players.

I will say KJ Osborn is a Big Time ‘Balla, B. Jordan is a Big Time Balla. However, we did not get it done against UF or UNC. Those teams however had WR’s making plays against us.
 
Don canon said:
Wasn’t Ron Zook a great recruiter and his teams always sucked. You can swap Alabama and Miami’s rosters right now and kept the coaching staffs the same. They would still wipe our *** all over the field. I think they are both very important, but our blue chips don’t perform at the same level as Bama’s and Clemson’a and that is a direct reflection of our terrible head coaching that we have been blessed with.
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You can’t actually believe that can you? You really think if we changed staffs preseason and played game one Miami would beat Bama?
 
maurice3p said:
Wisconsin probably has the best coaching staff in the country
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Wisconsin has tough and smart kids. They make **** good football players. They're not divas like our South Florida kids.

Wisconsin kids practice hard, work hard, they in the playbook, and they don't quit or fold or whine or cry about playing time and schemes and whatever nonsense.

There was a time when South Florida kids was that way too. South Florida in the 80's was hard. But nowadays South Florida kids act soft and dumb. ALL TALK and they never produce ****.

In the year 2020, a South Florida 4 star is like a Wisconsin 3 star.

Take Wisconsin coaching staff and put them in charge of Miami, and they win 7 games. Wisconsin did more with less with Barry Alvarez, Bielma, and now... it ain't the coaches
 
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OriginalGatorHater said:
Because they haven't been the most talented team every year for 100 years.
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That is true, but why is it that when they have been talented enough to win a championship it has only coincided with elite coaching? Its not that difficult to understand that roster talent is a direct consequence/byproduct of coaching, The more well coached a team becomes, the more talent they will ultimately be able to acquire. Which is why it's pointless/useless for you to constantly drone/clamor on about Manny's recruiting until it becomes in your eyes championship caliber, because there are NUMEROUS steps/milestones that 1st have to be achieved in order for that to happen. It's like your braindead criticism is putting the cart before the horse, or counting chickens before they hatch..it just doesn't make any sense. The only exceptions to this rule/precept are Iowa & Wisconsin..because they have isolated recruiting bases.
 
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OriginalGatorHater said:
They had the 4th or 5th most talent in the country last year. Class ranking doesn't account for small classes.

Class rankings don't matter as much as total talent on the team.
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But the avg per recruit does. But that's besides the point. I wasn't commenting on the ranking system as much as the following micro dialog in this thread:

MrMachete said:
Dude - their recruiting rankings over the last 10 years and their BCR speak themselves. Swinney did more with his talent than C.U.M, Saban, Richt/Smart, Stoops..ect. They DOMINATED teams with far more “talent...” they finally forced their way into the college championship playoff by beating Jimbo Fisher‘s FSU team that had more blue chip players - then dominated Saban last year.

Up until recently, Dabo Swinney never out recruited either one of those coaches.
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Whereas Dwin maintains:

Dwinstitles said:
Clemson always recruited well agree to disagree
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I'm not a star ***** but I agree what matters is the talent that takes the field. Looking at Clemson's actual recruiting results shows they never recruited at Bamas or FSUs level until about 4-5 years ago. That leads one to believe they were doing it with evaluations and development.
 
NorthEastCane said:
But the avg per recruit does. But that's besides the point. I wasn't commenting on the ranking system as much as the following micro dialog in this thread:



Whereas Dwin maintains:



I'm not a star ***** but I agree what matters is the talent that takes the field. Looking at Clemson's actual recruiting results shows they never recruited at Bamas or FSUs level until about 4-5 years ago. That leads one to believe they were doing it with evaluations and development.
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Yes the average recruit ranking does and he has pretty **** good average recruit rankings. There composite average recruit ranking for everyone one their team last year was in the top 5 of the nation. I consider top 5 recruiting elite.
 
craval85 said:
That is true, but why is it that when they have been talented enough to win a championship it has only coincided with elite coaching? Its not that difficult to understand that roster talent is a direct consequence/byproduct of coaching, The more well coached a team becomes, the more talent they will ultimately be able to acquire. Which is why it's pointless/useless for you to constantly drone/clamor on about Manny's recruiting until it becomes in your eyes championship caliber, because there are NUMEROUS steps/milestones that 1st have to be achieved in order for that to happen. It's like your braindead criticism is putting the cart before the horse, or counting chickens before they hatch..it just doesn't make any sense. The only exceptions to this rule/precept are Iowa & Wisconsin..because they have isolated recruiting bases.
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It is because, like I said, the best college coaches are the best recruiters. So the Bama coaches that where able to secure a ton of talent where the ones that won NCs. Obviously there are other teams that also secure a lot of talent and when talent is close coaching makes the difference.

The problem with Manny is he straight up sucks at recruiting. Which is why I didn't want him in the first place. If he somehow learns how to recruit that would be great, but I don't see it.

As I have said you a million times, recruiting at a decent level is not "putting the cart before the horse". I am not saying we should be landing 100% blue chips, just that we should be recruiting better than he does. He couldn't even land elite talent when UF and FSU where down, we played in the orange bowl, had a top defense, and were all over the media with the turnover chain.
 
OriginalGatorHater said:
It is because, like I said, the best college coaches are the best recruiters. So the Bama coaches that where able to secure a ton of talent where the ones that won NCs. Obviously there are other teams that also secure a lot of talent and when talent is close coaching makes the difference.

The problem with Manny is he straight up sucks at recruiting. Which is why I didn't want him in the first place. If he somehow learns how to recruit that would be great, but I don't see it.

As I have said you a million times, recruiting at a decent level is not "putting the cart before the horse". I am not saying we should be landing 100% blue chips, just that we should be recruiting better than he does. He couldn't even land elite talent when UF and FSU where down, we played in the orange bowl, had a top defense, and were all over the media with the turnover chain.
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OriginalGatorHater said:
Yes the average recruit ranking does and he has pretty **** good average recruit rankings. There composite average recruit ranking for everyone one their team last year was in the top 5 of the nation. I consider top 5 recruiting elite.
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I agree. The last few years that been recruiting at an elite level. And they are doing it at positions that make a difference (QB, DT).
 
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craval85 said:
Your parents were dumb for conceiving you. Now run along hoe..
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Right, just needed to confirm you are a rambling dumb ****. You should do yourself the courtesy of a google search when you charge into a conversation not knowing what you are even talking about.
 
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