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Alternative DOGE thread

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Feb is not yet over and we are already reading about DoD cuts. I am curious what the total amount of cuts will be by summer’s end.
 
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I agree with removing fraud and waste. DOGE is a great idea. None of its implementation and functional decision making have been made apparent in the cuts, though. So right now it equates to failure until such details are known. What’s fraud and waste to me and a lot of us are pretty clear, but I don’t think that’s what’s happening as sometimes very important things can get cut in the process, too. Some agencies/research that are not ‘deep state’ do incredibly important work with literature going back many decades. You can’t just cut without informed opinion or understanding the mountains of literature in each sub specialty within a respective agency. It makes no sense.

The lack of transparency on decisions (some very complicated decisions) is incredibly disturbing. Again, hope Im wrong.
 
TheEye said:
Feb is not yet over and we are already reading about DoD cuts. I am curious what the total amount of cuts will be by summer’s end.
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Many pro military/vets probably won’t like it obviously.

Does that mean we actually consider removing some international bases in our new isolationist direction? I don’t think Trump is that stupid.
 
HughFreezemyCuckoldYesPlz said:
Many pro military/vets probably won’t like it obviously.

Does that mean we actually consider removing some international bases in our new isolationist direction? I don’t think Trump is that stupid.
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If someone is serious about cutting multi Trillions in over spending, people across the board should be irritated. On both sides of the aisle.
 
HughFreezemyCuckoldYesPlz said:
I agree with removing fraud and waste. DOGE is a great idea. None of its implementation and functional decision making have been made apparent in the cuts, though. So right now it equates to failure until such details are known. What’s fraud and waste to me and a lot of us are pretty clear, but I don’t think that’s what’s happening as sometimes very important things can get cut in the process, too. Some agencies/research that are not ‘deep state’ do incredibly important work with literature going back many decades. You can’t just cut without informed opinion or understanding the mountains of literature in each sub specialty within a respective agency. It makes no sense.

The lack of transparency on decisions (some very complicated decisions) is incredibly disturbing. Again, hope Im wrong.
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I agree with everything you have typed here, except for the second sentence. DOGE is a constitutionally questionable (and potentially dangerous) idea.

The Department of Government Efficiency was established solely by executive order and without regard for the APA. On that basis alone -- as an American who generally disapproves of "government by agency rule" -- I immediately disapprove of the idea. I've had debates with friends/family/lawyers about the perils of executive agency rule for decades (regardless of which party was in the White House), and I guess it's just something I need to acknowledge I'm apparently in the minority on (though I suspect most Americans have no actual clue about the amount of power some of these agencies can wield). I'm prepared to acknowledge the sheer size of our country and population may make some reliance on agency rule unavoidable, but I'm not prepared to abandon the APA and Congress's role in the creation of such agencies.

As far as DOGE's purpose, I'm very suspicious, to say the least. The EO claims the purpose of DOGE is to "implement the President’s DOGE Agenda, by modernizing Federal technology and software to maximize governmental efficiency and productivity." If it was simply a question of implementing everything coming after the word "by," I'd say (Constitutional questions aside) I might be able to get behind it. The complete lack of transparency regarding this "DOGE Agenda" is troubling, in particular following several other EOs further empowering DOGE and making it pretty clear DOGE is not really concerned with "modernizing Federal technology and software," but about slashing government based on the President and Musk's (undisclosed) agenda. February saw several EOs to this effect, including implementing the President's "workforce optimization initiative" (read as mass government layoffs) "deregulatory initiative" (read as defunding various administrative agencies), and "cost efficiency initiative" (read as a empower federal spending freezes). Constitutionally, this is particularly concerning because Congress is the branch of government that controls the federal purse, and DOGE appears more and more to be an encroachment on that Congressional authority.

And from a purely logical/philosophical perspective, I'm also highly suspicious of the notion that in order to have a "smaller" government, we need to temporarily make the government bigger (by establishing a new executive agency).
 
AuoraCane said:
Agreed. Admittingly 30 years ago I had a different view.
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RVACane said:
I’m not against DOGE in principle. I am against eliminating or lowering payments to anyone who worked and contributed to the system for promised returns in amounts promised.
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I remember 20 years ago talking to a friend about SS... I remember saying I'd be fine with letting the gov keep all the SS payments I'd made to that point, just stop taking them from here on out - and I won't expect any when I reach retirement.

That was before I learned SS is a giant ponzi scheme that will bankrupt America and leave millions holding nothing but their ****s in their hands. They can't kick the can forever...
 
It's easy to hit a red X because your political hero supports/hates Y. It's more difficult to respond with an argument supported by facts @Suhrthing.

But, thank you for reminding me why I typically don't engage in political discourse on this message board.
 
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Suhrthing said:
I remember 20 years ago talking to a friend about SS... I remember saying I'd be fine with letting the gov keep all the SS payments I'd made to that point, just stop taking them from here on out - and I won't expect any when I reach retirement.

That was before I learned SS is a giant ponzi scheme that will bankrupt America and leave millions holding nothing but their ****s in their hands. They can't kick the can forever...
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I get it but I do not think it’s right to do that. I feel if we locked in then they need to honor it. And cutting circumcision money to Lesotho and Arab Sesame Street money to Iraq, is a good start. Stop giving away our money to crap overseas that doesn’t outweigh the needs of our citizens. It’s maddening as ****. Thank God these guys are doing this cleanup now.
 
RVACane said:
I get it but I do not think it’s right to do that. I feel if we locked in then they need to honor it. And cutting circumcision money to Lesotho and Arab Sesame Street money to Iraq, is a good start. Stop giving away our money to crap overseas that doesn’t outweigh the needs of our citizens. It’s maddening as ****. Thank God these guys are doing this cleanup now.
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Dont get me wrong, I didn't mean to imply we should. I don't have any answers, and yes - massive inroads into fraud, waste and abuse spending is the only place to start. Because Medicare will be bankrupt by 2031, and SS will be bankrupt by 2034.

Can open heart surgery by DOGE offset the hundred trillion in debt and entitlements? I'm doubtful, considering half the people of this country can't even get behind it, let alone the majority of congress - and 99% of federal workers. The powers that be tried to kill Trump twice to preserve their gravy train - they will cling to the graft until it's pried from their cold, dead hands - and take us all down with them.
 
Suhrthing said:
Dont get me wrong, I didn't mean to imply we should. I don't have any answers, and yes - massive inroads into fraud, waste and abuse spending is the only place to start. Because Medicare will be bankrupt by 2031, and SS will be bankrupt by 2034.

Can open heart surgery by DOGE offset the hundred trillion in debt and entitlements? I'm doubtful, considering half the people of this country can't even get behind it, let alone the majority of congress - and 99% of federal workers. The powers that be tried to kill Trump twice to preserve their gravy train - they will cling to the graft until it's pried from their cold, dead hands - and take us all down with them.
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Suhrthing said:
Dont get me wrong, I didn't mean to imply we should. I don't have any answers, and yes - massive inroads into fraud, waste and abuse spending is the only place to start. Because Medicare will be bankrupt by 2031, and SS will be bankrupt by 2034.
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Been hearing that wrning for what seems like forever. Only the dates have changed. Almost a "cry wolf" warning at this point.
 
hotshot said:
Been hearing that wrning for what seems like forever. Only the dates have changed. Almost a "cry wolf" warning at this point.
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Secretary Yellen said it recently. Who did you hear it from?
 
Suhrthing said:
Secretary Yellen said it recently. Who did you hear it from?
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I'd say since the 1980s (maybe 1970s even) there have been news reports over those 40+ years of Social Security and Medicare going bankrupt.

It's one of those predictions like the climate crisis and coastal areas sinking into the sea that never seems to materialize.

Doesn't mean it can't or won't happen but people who were proclaiming in their 20s and 30s that they'd never see a penny of Social Security are receiving it today.
 
hotshot said:
I'd say since the 1980s (maybe 1970s even) there have been news reports over those 40+ years of Social Security and Medicare going bankrupt.

It's one of those predictions like the climate crisis and coastal areas sinking into the sea that never seems to materialize.

Doesn't mean it can't or won't happen but people who were proclaiming in their 20s and 30s that they'd never see a penny of Social Security are receiving it today.
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I hope so.
 
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