Miami preparing motion for dismissal of case

[Golden_Cane]

I have to disagree a little. The quickest way to end the case is the best. What do we care if everyone else thinks we got off on a technicality? If we get what we want, it doesn't matter.

That's a little short sighted and not completely true. Other Universities would most likely make a fuss about it and demand similar action with their cases. They could even threaten a law suit which I think nobody (even us) wants due to threat of discovery (subpoena power). I think we will get additional penalties, but they will not be excessive. Things like extended probation or restrictions to recruiting freedoms comes to mind. We may even lose a few ships, but at the end of the day, I think that the sooner this is over, the better, regardless of the penalties.

I am very interested in seeing what Golden can do on the recruiting trail WITHOUT an albatross around his neck for the first time. I think he is going to be an absolute monster when this is finally put to rest.

They only care about subpoena power if all this stuff really went on, I think UM knows that only the minor stuff was true and doesn't have anything else to hide

That's not true. If people are forced to testify in front of a court ANYTHING and EVERYTHING they say will be used against them by the NCAA. And who knows what the **** will come up if it gets to that point. That's the last place I would want to go.

Sorry, but Donna is demanding no more penalties. So you're saying, if they go ahead and say no more penalties, it's bad for us because other schools will ****? Who, USC? They're the only ones who can complain. Everyone esle got a slap on the wrist. If UNC wants to have their **** re-opened, good luck with that. I bet they don't say ****. That McNair guy from USC is already trying o burn the NCAA in court.


If I was Dr. Gonzo, I would say to Donna, as your attorney I advise you to get the case dismissed, and then file a lawsuit anyways. Burn those ******** before they come back for more.


That's what I'm worried about. Even if we get time served, if we don't finish these ****ers off, we will just be walking on eggshells and they will have us under the microscope waiting for something to try and hammer us again.

I agree with you for the most part, but that list of schools extends far past USC... Penn State, Ohio State, USC, North Carolina... Who knows how everyone would react. I'm just saying let's not open pandora's box until we have to.

 

[USNAVYCANE]

I have to disagree a little. The quickest way to end the case is the best. What do we care if everyone else thinks we got off on a technicality? If we get what we want, it doesn't matter.

That's a little short sighted and not completely true. Other Universities would most likely make a fuss about it and demand similar action with their cases. They could even threaten a law suit which I think nobody (even us) wants due to threat of discovery (subpoena power). I think we will get additional penalties, but they will not be excessive. Things like extended probation or restrictions to recruiting freedoms comes to mind. We may even lose a few ships, but at the end of the day, I think that the sooner this is over, the better, regardless of the penalties.

I am very interested in seeing what Golden can do on the recruiting trail WITHOUT an albatross around his neck for the first time. I think he is going to be an absolute monster when this is finally put to rest.

They only care about subpoena power if all this stuff really went on, I think UM knows that only the minor stuff was true and doesn't have anything else to hide

That's not true. If people are forced to testify in front of a court ANYTHING and EVERYTHING they say will be used against them by the NCAA. And who knows what the **** will come up if it gets to that point. That's the last place I would want to go.

Sorry, but Donna is demanding no more penalties. So you're saying, if they go ahead and say no more penalties, it's bad for us because other schools will ****? Who, USC? They're the only ones who can complain. Everyone esle got a slap on the wrist. If UNC wants to have their **** re-opened, good luck with that. I bet they don't say ****. That McNair guy from USC is already trying o burn the NCAA in court.


If I was Dr. Gonzo, I would say to Donna, as your attorney I advise you to get the case dismissed, and then file a lawsuit anyways. Burn those ******** before they come back for more.


That's what I'm worried about. Even if we get time served, if we don't finish these ****ers off, we will just be walking on eggshells and they will have us under the microscope waiting for something to try and hammer us again.

I agree with you for the most part, but that list of schools extends far past USC... Penn State, Ohio State, USC, North Carolina... Who knows how everyone would react. I'm just saying let's not open pandora's box until we have to.

if they have nothing to hide it wouldnt matter

 

[UMcanesfan420]

I'm sure all parties know at this point what dirt the NCAA actually has on them.

 

[DapperSlapper]

Like the coaches involved in the case, Miami will file a “motion” to have the NCAA’s infractions case against the school dismissed. One problem:

But according to two sources, the NCAA last week sent a letter to UM and the implicated former coaches with a warning: The infractions committee “does not believe it has the authority under the bylaws to dismiss the case” prior to the case going before the infractions committee in mid-June.

The Committee on Infractions is correct in that there is no established NCAA process for having a case dismissed by the COI prior to the institution filing a response. There is this though:

32.6.6 – Prehearing Conference.

Within 30 days of an institution’s submission of its written response to the notice of allegations, in a case involving an alleged major violation, the enforcement staff shall consult with institutional representatives and other involved individuals who will attend the hearing in order to clarify the issues to be discussed in the case during the hearing, make suggestions regarding additional investigation or interviews that should be conducted by the institution to supplement its response and identify allegations that the staff intends to withdraw. The enforcement staff shall conduct independent prehearings with the institution and/or any involved individuals, unless mutually agreed by all parties to do otherwise.

If the NCAA is following its rules, this is the first opportunity for the case to go away now that the Notice of Allegations was sent. The enforcement staff, now under new leadership, could decide to simply withdraw all allegations in light of Miami’s response.

That would be the quickest way to end the case, but it might not be the best, even for Miami. Miami has played and continues to play the victim. But maintaining that status is more difficult if it appears that Miami got off on a technicality, despite the self-imposed sanctions.

While it takes longer, the best outcome for Miami is to get its day in court and be vindicated; i.e. go in front of the Committee on Infractions and receive no additional punishment. But given how difficult it is to predict what the COI will do in any given case, Miami has to take every opportunity to avoid rolling those dice.

The other notable part of this and other articles is how effective the PR campaign has been for Miami and the involved coaches. Miami is not “filing a motion”. It is sending a strongly worded letter. And the NCAA pointing out to Miami that it has no such motion has become “throwing up roadblocks”. Overplaying its hand as the victim and the underdog is a danger for Miami, but so far that does not seem to be the case.

http://www.athleticscholarships.net/2013/03/13/miami-asking-for-nonexistent-motion.htm

First, the rule clearly says that one of the purposes of the first hearing is to identify allegations the staff intends to withdraw. That means, for those who actually know how to practice law (which clearly doesn't include anyone at the NCAA) that the hearing allows Miami and the coaches to file a written request to have specific or all allegations withdrawn by the NCAA staff. . . . in other words, a motion to dismiss.

Second, didn't the NCAA already grant the coaches a hearing on their motions to dismiss?

The prehearing conference is not a hearing. It's a meeting between institution or involved individual and Enforcement - the COI is not involved. It's just like hashing out a pretrial stipulation - the idea is to narrow the issues for the actual hearing.

Where the COI is unsure of its authority, it can, pursuant to Bylaw 32.8.8.2, request an interpretation of applicable legislation from the academic and membership affairs staff. This is aimed more at issues that come up in the hearing, but there is nothing in the rule that would prevent the COI from requesting such an interpretation prior to the hearing.

Speaking of pretrial stipulations, I have one to get to...

 

[Golden_Cane]

The prehearing conference is not a hearing

Sort of like an arraignment?

 

[nadiamufdi]

All of those other schools who will complain and want to sue do not have any sort of fraud and illegal activity by the ncaa to argue about to my knowledge.

 

[DapperSlapper]

The prehearing conference is not a hearing

Sort of like an arraignment?

No. An arraignment is a hearing that occurs in court. The prehearing conferences are meetings between/among the parties that will appear at the hearing. The judge (COI in this case) has nothing to do with the prehearing conference(s).

 

[Classic]

Eddie Johnson is leading our NCAA proceedings.

Dude doesn't give two chitlins if such a motion exists -- he's gon' file it anyways!

Goon on, goon on.

 

[Canesfan1899]

Unfortunately they won't dismiss it. This will drag out to the Fall, where there will finally be closure. For all their posturing, the NCAA doesn't want another lawsuit. They will hand out some scholly losses, probation and be done with it. I'd rather not have to go the lawsuit route. Lets just get this over with and move on.

Agreed, it will probably take another 2 years. The NCAA can lick my balls.

 

[jakeman1]

There should be no more scholarship losses. Miami has already overpenalized itself with the two bowl bans and losing the ACCCG. They've also reduced recruiting visits and cut some scholarships already. Put the money amount and supposed infractions that the NCAA has in the report against what OSU or UCF received. Tressel got the show cause because he lied. UCF's AD was directly involved and got less punishment. Miami has already taken a bigger hit.

 

[riceman]

For what it's worth, Shalala was in Tallahassee last night. FL Session is in. Perhaps a meeting with some old friends? Maybe a Senator? Maybe a Representative of the House? Maybe a hitman?

I want to believe she was here declaring war and calling in some favors. Or it was the hitman.

Definitely the hitman...

 

[rsa coral gables]

For what it's worth, Shalala was in Tallahassee last night. FL Session is in. Perhaps a meeting with some old friends? Maybe a Senator? Maybe a Representative of the House? Maybe a hitman?

I want to believe she was here declaring war and calling in some favors. Or it was the hitman.

Definitely the hitman...

she was probably there asking for money for UM. her favors would be directed to washington dc

 

[Angry Ibis]

I walk a fine line between getting it over with and bringing down the house.

Either way, I'm all in!

I'd like to move on, but I Stand By The U if it is decided to fight the NCAA to the death on this bull****.

 

[caneworld]

I walk a fine line between getting it over with and bringing down the house.

Either way, I'm all in!

I'd like to move on, but I Stand By The U if it is decided to fight the NCAA to the death on this bull****.

Need to move in and go for the KILL. If the current group survives, they will be after us for years to come. Time to eliminate the enemy.

 

[UMFarArcher]

He who has his enemy at his mercy, and does not kill him, is his own worst enemy.

You don't just kill the king, but you also kill his sons lest one come back for revenge in later years.

 

[MIA42178]

Like the coaches involved in the case, Miami will file a “motion” to have the NCAA’s infractions case against the school dismissed. One problem:

But according to two sources, the NCAA last week sent a letter to UM and the implicated former coaches with a warning: The infractions committee “does not believe it has the authority under the bylaws to dismiss the case” prior to the case going before the infractions committee in mid-June.

The Committee on Infractions is correct in that there is no established NCAA process for having a case dismissed by the COI prior to the institution filing a response. There is this though:

32.6.6 – Prehearing Conference.

Within 30 days of an institution’s submission of its written response to the notice of allegations, in a case involving an alleged major violation, the enforcement staff shall consult with institutional representatives and other involved individuals who will attend the hearing in order to clarify the issues to be discussed in the case during the hearing, make suggestions regarding additional investigation or interviews that should be conducted by the institution to supplement its response and identify allegations that the staff intends to withdraw. The enforcement staff shall conduct independent prehearings with the institution and/or any involved individuals, unless mutually agreed by all parties to do otherwise.

If the NCAA is following its rules, this is the first opportunity for the case to go away now that the Notice of Allegations was sent. The enforcement staff, now under new leadership, could decide to simply withdraw all allegations in light of Miami’s response.

That would be the quickest way to end the case, but it might not be the best, even for Miami. Miami has played and continues to play the victim. But maintaining that status is more difficult if it appears that Miami got off on a technicality, despite the self-imposed sanctions.

While it takes longer, the best outcome for Miami is to get its day in court and be vindicated; i.e. go in front of the Committee on Infractions and receive no additional punishment. But given how difficult it is to predict what the COI will do in any given case, Miami has to take every opportunity to avoid rolling those dice.

The other notable part of this and other articles is how effective the PR campaign has been for Miami and the involved coaches. Miami is not “filing a motion”. It is sending a strongly worded letter. And the NCAA pointing out to Miami that it has no such motion has become “throwing up roadblocks”. Overplaying its hand as the victim and the underdog is a danger for Miami, but so far that does not seem to be the case.

http://www.athleticscholarships.net/2013/03/13/miami-asking-for-nonexistent-motion.htm

First, the rule clearly says that one of the purposes of the first hearing is to identify allegations the staff intends to withdraw. That means, for those who actually know how to practice law (which clearly doesn't include anyone at the NCAA) that the hearing allows Miami and the coaches to file a written request to have specific or all allegations withdrawn by the NCAA staff. . . . in other words, a motion to dismiss.

Second, didn't the NCAA already grant the coaches a hearing on their motions to dismiss?

The prehearing conference is not a hearing. It's a meeting between institution or involved individual and Enforcement - the COI is not involved. It's just like hashing out a pretrial stipulation - the idea is to narrow the issues for the actual hearing.

Where the COI is unsure of its authority, it can, pursuant to Bylaw 32.8.8.2, request an interpretation of applicable legislation from the academic and membership affairs staff. This is aimed more at issues that come up in the hearing, but there is nothing in the rule that would prevent the COI from requesting such an interpretation prior to the hearing.

Speaking of pretrial stipulations, I have one to get to...

Dapper, first, thanks for explanation. Second, why were there articles that the coaches were granted a hearing on their motions to dismiss several weeks back?

 

[Canesfan1899]

Kill, Kill, Kill the NCAA!