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Al vs. Butch after 4 years

Z

zipcode

Redshirt Freshman
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I did a little research.


Butch was 31-15 in his 1st 4 seasons. He had 11 double digit losses, was 3-9 against 9 win teams and was 2-0 in bowls. He started to really turn it around in '99 when we went 9-4. We lost to VT and FSU that year and they played for the NC.

Al, on the other hand is 28-22 in his 1st 4 years. He has 12 double digit losses, 1-13 against 9 win teams (the win against Duke this year) and 0-2 in bowls.

On top of that, Al is trending down with a 8-11 record in his last 19 games. Of those 11 losses 9 were by double digits. Butch was trending up in his last 19 games heading into 1999. We was 13-6 with 4 losses by double digits.

Unfortunately, I don't see anything that would make me think Al can turn it around. How do you win only 6 games with a team that has 10 players that will probably be drafted?
 
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You have to remember that back then most teams only played 11 games, so if you are talking about the regular season a 9 win team went 9-2 where a 9 win team now is 9-3, so you could argue that a 9 win team in Butches era was a better team than a 9 win now.
 
UM also had tremendous amount of recruiting momentum in the late 90s. Butch was signing the best players in south Florida.
 
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miamihurricane34 said:
You have to remember that back then most teams only played 11 games, so if you are talking about the regular season a 9 win team went 9-2 where a 9 win team now is 9-3, so you could argue that a 9 win team in Butches era was a better team than a 9 win now.
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I agree. When comparing quality, it's better to count the losses than the wins. For the past couple years, I've been waiting for the 'Canes to win ONE lousy game against a team that finished with four losses or fewer -- basically, my shorthand for a decent football team. This year's win over Duke (yay, we got 'em THIS year, boys!) finally made that happen, but just barely. (The last time the 'Canes beat a decent football team before that was 3-loss GT in 2009.)

Now, it's worth pointing out that the team Butch inherited from Erickson was significantly better than the one Golden inherited from Shannon. So comparing the first four years gives Butch a LITTLE help from those first couple seasons when he was playing with a roster that hadn't been completely brutalized by the NCAA sanctions.

But Butch only had one REALLY bad season -- 5-6, in Year 3, 1997. Al Golden has already had either two or three, depending on how you look at Year 2's 7-5.

I just can't decide whether to get angry or just laugh when slurpers are giving me this line: "I guess you would've fired Butch, too, you idiot."

Even when things were **** under Butch, they weren't this bad. And they sure didn't stay bad this long.
 
Butch had never been a head coach before. He started out as a horrible gameday head coach and slowly improved as he got more experience. He also tweaked his staff over that time-frame.


Al Golden was, of course, a head coach at Temple. He's made no voluntary staff changes, and hadn't really adapted, changed style, or grown as a head coach at all.
 
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brcane1 said:
zipcode said:
When playing teams that lost less than 5 games Golden is 2-14.
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The front page article actually quotes 3-26 for teams that lost less than or equal to 5 games which is even more damning.
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I should have said he is 2-14 at UM against teams that lost 4 games or less. He is 4-15 at UM against teams that lost 5 games or less.
 
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zipcode said:
I did a little research.


Butch was 31-15 in his 1st 4 seasons. He had 11 double digit losses, was 3-9 against 9 win teams and was 2-0 in bowls. He started to really turn it around in '99 when we went 9-4. We lost to VT and FSU that year and they played for the NC.

Al, on the other hand is 28-22 in his 1st 4 years. He has 12 double digit losses, 1-13 against 9 win teams (the win against Duke this year) and 0-2 in bowls.

On top of that, Al is trending down with a 8-11 record in his last 19 games. Of those 11 losses 9 were by double digits. Butch was trending up in his last 19 games heading into 1999. We was 13-6 with 4 losses by double digits.

Unfortunately, I don't see anything that would make me think Al can turn it around. How do you win only 6 games with a team that has 10 players that will probably be drafted?
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Where Butch doesn't get credit is the hiring of his coaching staff. You had Pagano, CJ, Schiano, Chud, Coker, Randy, Mario (as a GA) all who ended up as head coaches.
 
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zipcode said:
I should have said he is 2-14 at UM against teams that lost 4 games or less. He is 4-15 at UM against teams that lost 5 games or less.
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Just when I thought I had a handle on how bad things were. And one of those 4 would appear to be Arkansas freakin' State.
 
We can analyze Al Golden in a thousand different ways, and you'll get the same answer...he is a terrible head coach.

Butch Davis, while not without his warts, is the best talent evaluator and the best to prepare the modern athlete for the pro game, college football has seen in probably the past 30 years, maybe more. There is simply no comparison to be made between the two. Even of recent vintage, Butch Davis has either recruited or coached 30 NFL Draft Picks at North Carolina, including 7 first round picks. He's simply a great coach while Golden is just a guy.
 
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Butch was also working under a cloud with the loss of three times the number of scholly's Al is working under.
 
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